My analysys

[The_Dwarf]

@ Öjevind Lång :

You have some good points, however I find some of your points absolutely invalid :

8. Each Indian tribe had ist own characteristic ...
Well in the new Col the Indian civs are actually way more different as in the old one so it doesnt make sense to complain here.

15. The game was much longer ...
Thats pretty much a matter of taste, I actually like it if you can play a game within one day.

16. The pace at which the king added to the REF differed according to difficulty setting ....
Thats still true for the new col.

17. The map was much larger, making exploration last longer and be more interesting ...
It was however pretty exploitable also, getting 5 fountains of youth was much more profitabel as to build some flourishing colonies.

18. You didn't stumble over treasure everywhere ...
I find the exact opposite is true, the early game was way too much influenced by treasure hunting.

19. Sometimes you discovered burial mounds ...
The distintion between ancient ruins and burial mountains is still there in the new col.

22. If a city grew too fast, you got a handicap in that city - production and education tanked. In other words, you simply had to expand ...
Yes ICS was by far the best strategy but however how is that any good ?
Pretty flawed in my opinion.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

If Firaxis couldn't be bothered to put features like this in Railroads!, what makes you think you'd get it in a Civ 4 Mod?

They could just have copied the information screens in the original Colonization game. It's stunning that they didn't bother to do that.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

@ Öjevind Lång :

You have some good points, however I find some of your points absolutely invalid :

8. Each Indian tribe had ist own characteristic ...
Well in the new Col the Indian civs are actually way more different as in the old one so it doesnt make sense to complain here.

15. The game was much longer ...
Thats pretty much a matter of taste, I actually like it if you can play a game within one day.

16. The pace at which the king added to the REF differed according to difficulty setting ....
Thats still true for the new col.

17. The map was much larger, making exploration last longer and be more interesting ...
It was however pretty exploitable also, getting 5 fountains of youth was much more profitabel as to build some flourishing colonies.

18. You didn't stumble over treasure everywhere ...
I find the exact opposite is true, the early game was way too much influenced by treasure hunting.

19. Sometimes you discovered burial mounds ...
The distintion between ancient ruins and burial mountains is still there in the new col.

22. If a city grew too fast, you got a handicap in that city - production and education tanked. In other words, you simply had to expand ...
Yes ICS was by far the best strategy but however how is that any good ?
Pretty flawed in my opinion.

8. Not really. I disagree. They are quite similar. Do they have different preferences when it comes to trade goods, for example? Not as far a I have been able to discover. Also, because the map is so small, there is no variety in your relations with them; the map is small and consequently, it is not too much trouble to take out a tribe, or deal with them in some other way, if they take a scunner on you. But I remember a game in old Col on a standard map where the Aztecs had 13 cities... I definitely walked carefully during that game.

15. As you, say, it's a matter of taste. They could have included different game lengths, and by that I don't mean "length" where it simply takes longer to build everything. The point with the game lasting longer was, as I have said before, that the game had several stages: your first settlements and exploration, discovering your European rivals, dealing with them and probably fighting them at some point, or forming an alliance with one against another, having to fight the king's wars until you got Benjamin Franklin, handling the various Indian tribes (usually trying to appease them through trade - which was also much more rewarding than now), building up your colonies, and THEN prepare for the War of Independence. Of course, throughout the game you had generated liberty bells and made your colonies more efficient and self-reliant, which meant that ultimately, all those enjoyable stages in the game had also served to prepare you for independence while being fun in their own right. But they were not merely way stops to get past as swiftly as possible.

16. I expressed myself badly. The adding rate is much too high on lower difficulty levels.

17. The game could have a large map and a provision that you only find one Fountain of Youth, or that the result of finding one is not as overwhelming as in the old game, or both. I think the miniscule maps in Col II is one of the worst things about it. Abnd the FoY is fun!

18. As for that statement, I am simply surprised. Most of the time, you were just told: "You only hear rumours". By the time you had the FF who made those rumours true, you and your competitors had already explored much or most of the map. But I am not the only one who in Col II has had treasure coming in from all parts of the continent, to my colonies and those of my competitors.

19. In the original game, the burial mounds were one possible event if you came to a goody hut, and if you decided to explore them there were three possible outcomes. Now they mostly mean you get a promotion or some money.

22. Again, we disagree. I think that either having to expand or else work hard at generating more liberty bells was a good feature in the original game. It could be frustrating, but it was definitely a feature that added more interest to the game and demanded more effort from you.

On some points, we seem to differ about what is enjoyable. That is perfectly OK, but it doesn't mean that my points are "absolutely invalid", especially since I was talking about the richness and depth of the game. If you prefer a shorter, slimmed down game, that's a quite different matter.

 

[Imagawa99]

Öjevind Lång i think you have got it spot on tbh
I had been toying with the idea of making a post similar to yours on Apolyton but i really didnt think anybody would be interested in reading me whining

imo the only way that colo2 scores over the original is graphics, if you can get past the "oldness" of it, the original game is more interesting, deeper and more fun to play. Thats a pretty damning statement when your comparing a modern game to a game thats 14 years old

It seems to me that we got sold the name of colonization but what we actually got was a rather limted cIV mod, i suppose firaxis thought they could grab some easy revenue before somebody made a free mod

 

[Öjevind Lång]

It seems to me that we got sold the name of colonization but what we actually got was a rather limted cIV mod, i suppose firaxis thought they could grab some easy revenue before somebody made a free mod

I fear this is the simple truth. If Firaxis prove me a liar, no one would be more grateful to them than I. Can't they produce a good game without Brian Reynolds? (Soren Johnson doesn't count since he has gone back to his old employer.)

 

[wolfigor]

I must agree in full with Öjevind Lång.
I've been an avid player of the original Colonization and I found it extremely deep and challenging.
A real fun to play and I got pretty much disilluded to play this new version.

probably I'm so unhappy of colonization2 because I played the old one and expected (at least) the same level of deepness + modern graphic + new improvements.

It didn't really happen, isn't it?


Maybe if I didn't play the original colonization1 I would have emjoyed this new version more.

The main problem with Colonization1 was being repetitive... after winning a few times it didn't give you anything new.
Until after some time you got homesick to play it again.

Something thatimproved from Col1 is the combat system... if you remember in Col1 Horses and muskets were used as hit points: a dragoon lloose a battle and become a foot soldier, and other lost combat and become a colonist.
Interesting but very unrealistic.

 

[1EyedKing]

Great posts, Ojevind.

It's good to know some players are true critics and can really appreciate the amount of thought and dedication put on games, whether pixel-shaded or not.

 

[Raion]

You can trade by moving your wagon around. A unit such as a colonist or soldier to talk to the chief of an indian settlement.

Open borders can be used for the other European Nations in the game.

 

[revooo]

The main problem with Colonization1 was being repetitive... after winning a few times it didn't give you anything new.
Until after some time you got homesick to play it again.

I don't agree with that. Because there were so many ways to try to win it never got boring.

Me too thinks the new version is a bit disappointing. Let's hope for a patch to improve AI.
On my 1st game I was competing closely with the other Europeans. All of a sudden they got wiped down in 3-4 turns. Turned out the Indians decided to get pissed off and pillaged all colonies because the AI forgot to put defense in the colonies. From that point my game was ruined.

Also the 2 american maps that come with the original game are not worked out quite well. The indians are a bit misplaced around the map.

Finally cool thing was when you raided inca's or aztec's you got loaded with treasure, now you get a bid mediocre amounts of money like you get from other Indians. That makes no sense imo.

 

[parachute4u]

Come on Sid, stop being an ostrich! Let the daylight hit your face, and see that there really IS more to making a game than making pretty screenshots.

"Sid Meier's" is just a brand, I am waiting for the "Sid Meier's Teddy-Bear". He made some great game, but that was long ago. Not sure he actually owns a computer nowadays.

 

[obsolete]

I can't believe I was a sucker for the pre-order of it.

I can't believe there are people who still pre-order.

 

[Raion]

The game can be modded so get to work. I can not believe what some people complain about with a game. The game varies within the game so have at it.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

The game can be modded so get to work. I can not believe what some people complain about with a game. The game varies within the game so have at it.

Not everybody is good at modding, and some even have the effrontery to expect a good game when they pay for it.

 

[biggp07]

I can't believe there are people who still pre-order.

It was the one and only time I have ever pre-ordered a computer game. Thought I would put some faith in Firaxis. Apparently I missed someting along the way that might have swayed my decision to do that. Seriously though, of all the possible ways you could have replyed to postings in this thread, you chose this? It makes me wonder about your other 2,241 posts. Did they contribute anything useful?