Nobles' Club 295: Asoka of India

SIP is certainly good. But judging from the screenshot of the start position, there is no early happy resource. If I play as Cyrus or Nappy (CHA leaders who start with Agri), I'll definitely SIP. But with Asoka, I'm afraid that the lack of early happiness would be a bottleneck to make use of high :food:. Another factor which makes me settle on PH is the 3 :move: Indian UU: if settling on PH, normal worker will waste 1 turn in moving from the city to the corn, but Indian UU can move 2 tiles and improve the corn on the same turn. I think SIP and settle on PH create a trade-off between "early :food:" vs "early :hammers:".

Emperor from T0 to T212
Spoiler :

Settings as below, no huts:


T0 demo screen showed Mansa in the game, not good :trouble:


Settle on the forest PH. Agri-BW-TW. Built my second city near the Copper. Met Louis up north. Qin was on my east. Both my neighbours were backstabbers. Built some Axes for early defense. Mansa founded Buddhism, Zara founded Hinduism. Gifted a city to Louis, because I thought he might get auto-spread Buddhism from Mansa while Qin was already Hindu.

Shaka DoW Mansa in 600BC. Some turns later Mansa bribed Zara and Biz to attack Shaka :crazyeye:. They made peace after several centuries.


Shaka DoW Mansa again in 400AD. Next turn Mansa brought some war-allies again :crazyeye:


They were busy killing each others for a long time. Qin started plotting near 600AD or 620AD. In 760AD, poor Shaka got a distant dogpile from Qin the backstabber :backstab:


Zara made peace with Shaka. But Mansa peaceful vassal to AC :trouble:


Poor Shaka capitulated to Biz in 1200AD :twitch:


Peacefully expanded to 11 cities. Both Louis and Qin were busy building wonders, which delayed their early expansion. Managed to get Qin to Friendly via bureau and shared religion.
Lib MT. Pre-built HAs and upgraded them to Cuirs. It was amusing that we built Taj Mahal when playing as India :lol:.


Biz DoW Louis just 2 turns before my Cuirs were ready. Had to bribe Biz out of the war, because I didn't want Louis capitulate to Biz :sad:.


Louis converted to self-founded Christianity thus lost many tech trading opportunities with the Hindu block. He capitulated quickly:


Begged 1 :gold: from Zara and Biz before attacking Qin. Didn't beg from AC though, as AC can only be bribed into wars at Friendly while he was only Pleased with Qin. Qin was willing to capitulate after losing his capital. But I took Shangai before accepting the capitulation, as there was a wonder I really wanted in this city :satan::


Qin capitulated on T212


Yes, as some of you have noticed, 9 fast workers for 11 cities are too few :blush:. That's why many forests are not chopped :o.


Qin had a stack of 30+ units, mostly Knights and catapults/trebs. Lured Qin's units onto flat land then eliminated them.


Next target would be Biz. But Biz was quite close to RP - he might soon get Rifles. Maybe it's time to start building Cannons. :undecide:
 
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Emperor from T0 to T212
Spoiler :

Lib MT. Pre-built HAs and upgraded them to Cuirs. It was amusing that we built Taj Mahal when playing as India :lol:.
Build the Taj in Agra noob :nono:
Spoiler :
:p

Yes, as some of you have noticed, 9 fast workers for 11 cities are too few :blush:. That's why many forests are not chopped :o.
Build more. Now.

Next target would be Biz. But Biz was quite close to RP - he might soon get Rifles. Maybe it's time to start building Cannons. :undecide:

Can't look at the details of your game but you seem to be in a very strong position with a powerful vassal (direct his research)

Focus on science and workers.

Avoid unnecessary buildings (granaries and barracks are ok, maybe forges in high population cities. Else Wealth)

Avoid unnecessary techs, beeline steel.

Grow your cities to the max. (workers!)

Draft and Whip an unstoppable army.
:cheers:

 
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@soundjata
Thanks for comments and suggestions!
Spoiler :

Very good point about Taj and Agra. Unfortunately in BTS it's impossible to move a building from one city to another, so I just enter into city screen and change Bombay's name to Agra :high5:

:D

About the tech order, yes, I think it's time to beeline Steel (and yes, 9 turns for Steel at Emperor level - a result of not having enough workers :hammer2:). Also need at least 7 or 8 more fast workers.
But the preparation for the attack might take a while, because Biz is very close to Replaceable parts (I asked in trade table what Biz would give me for RP, he's only willing to give 70 :gold: - not even his full gold available, so he'll soon finish it). Biz's favourite civic is Nationhood - he might draft a lot after I DoW him :eek2:. Another trouble comes from Mansa, who trades everything to everyone. Only 2 turns after he and AC got MT, most of the AIs had it :trouble:. So, apart from Cannons, I probably need some Rifles for protection against the flank attack from Biz & Shaka's Cuirs or Cavs.

In terms of vassal, it's a little subtle. Louis is still in his own religion + Theocracy, and he's hated by Biz and Zara. I'm thinking about giving Paper to Louis and asking Louis to adopte OR, then spreading Hindu to him. If Louis converts to Hindu, at least Hindu AIs would become Cautious towards him.
 
@konata_LS hard to tell without a save :)

Spoiler :
But you do have a couple of vassals protecting your flanks don't you?

I'm not sure of the importance of diplomacy now.
When you have enough power (combined with vassals! Threshold could be 1.5x to be checked), AIs won't attack anyways.

I would be looking for a research plan (Self research what? Vassals research what? Trade for what with whom?)
Then Army buildup plan (more and faster :gripe:)
The rest is mostly logistics : Which way to go? Clockwise or anti? Who to strike first : the weak AI or the strong AI?
:high5:
 
From T212 to T303
Spoiler :

Settings as below, no tribal village:


Gave Louis Paper to make him adopt OR. Spread Hindu to Louis and gave Gunpowder to convert Louis to Hindu. After Louis converted to Hindu, he stopped being Zara and Biz's WE.

Went for Steel and RP-Rifling, then Communism. Built maces, Rifles, Grens and Cannons, combined with Cuirs from previous wars. Attack Biz and his vassal Shaka. Both of them had Rifling. Biz was under Nationhood and he drafted a lot. It was possible to use :espionage: to switch Biz in bureaucracy, but I was too busy spamming Cannons and forgot about espionage things :blush:.
Sometimes it's hard to understand AI's city placement: if Biz loves Nationhood, would it be logical to grab the spot marked "x" with double fish, build Global Theatre and draft like crazy? Why did he ignore the double fish spot and settle a city in the red circle :dubious:? the red circle spot has no food, no strategic resource; it's only a single flood plain with some brown tiles :dubious:


After losing most of his land, Biz capitulated on T266:


Shaka capitulated on the same turn:


Research Artillery, built Arty, MGs, upgraded some units. DoW AC and his vassal Mansa. Luckily, AC adopted Free religion, which ended his Friendly relation with Zara, so AC and Zara didn't sign defensive pact.
We have enough on our hands right now :ar15:


This war was surprising for me. Both AC and Mansa had Arty, AC was close to AL and he had a big stack. Since my main army was in Biz and Shaka's land, after healing the wounded units in the captured German cities, I moved my stack towards east and attacked AC/Mansa from Mansa's side. I thought AC would soon send his main stack in Mansa's land to attack me, but surprisingly, I only met a few AC's units in Mansa's land, because AC moved his stack to another direction and attacked Qin. Qin captured a border city of AC, though AC took it back one or two turns later. During the capture - recapture, AC suffered heavy losses under Qin's PRO Rifles:


Without AC's help, Mansa had only 5 or 6 units in Djenne. As a result, my stack looked ridiculous and overkill :o


AC refused to capitulate as long as Mansa was alive. Had to destroy Mansa. Also gifted a captured Malinese city to Shaka, since that city was surrounded by Zulu culture. AC finally capitulated on T299:


During my war with Zara, domination:


Zara had Industrialism for a long time, but he didn't have Oil so he couldn't build tanks he's too busy building Stasis chamber :D. Got 7 GGenerals for a leader who is not IMP - there were a lot of wars, for sure :lol:


Killed 20+ Arty, all from AC and Mansa. With Zara and Mansa in the game, combined with Hindu lovefest, these AIs traded frequently between them. Zara already had Genetics at the end of the game :trouble:.


While many UUs (Praets, Quechuas, Immortals...) work better under Marathon speed than Normal speed, Indian UU is the opposite: 3 :move: faster workers can move in the forests and chop on the same turn, this is not evident under Marathon speed, but it becomes significantly better under Normal speed.
Indian UBs comes late, but +2 :)- is nice to deal with war weariness and emancipation anger. With cheap Org factory, most cities only need 2 or 3 turns to build Mausoleum. Constitution is required for AL, after all.

Unlike the pushover AI Asoka, in human players' hands, Asoka is a good warmonger. SPI trait offers great flexibility for the wars: he can adopt slavery, vassalage, theo, or draft whenever the situations call for it. Cheap CHs and lower civics upkeep allow people to keep some extra captured cities. I don't think ORG is as strong as FIN, but I like ORG, just because I personally like having many cities, founded or conquered. Waring as ORG leaders is fun. Maybe that's why I never play OCC - I understand some people like playing OOC, and some OOC games are fun indeed. But for me, OCC deprives me of my greatest pleasure of playing BTS.

An interesting thing about the leaders' traits combo: among the 52 leaders in BTS, there is no ORG leader who is PRO. Some ORG leaders such as JC or Darius are paired with very powerful UUs for an early rush. Maybe is this a hint from Sid :think:? With ORG leaders, do not turtle in the corner with few cities, the player can afford a larger empire with less cost. Expand or conquer as much as one can and never look back.

Thanks for the map :)
 
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