[RD] Prostitution

[Lohrenswald]

Now this is a topic I am not very well versed in, so you'll have to excuse the slightly lacluster first post.

I am not very good at "defending" my position on this, which is that prostitution is unethical and should be prohibited (at least prohibited to buy sex).

This has to do with my views about how the individual is driven by external factors, that it is sort of alienating, that it doesn't "create anything of value" and that it's I'd say indecent. Sex should be an activity in of itself between those who really want it, not some petty service.

but I believe I am in the minority opinion, and in this thread you can tell me how wrong I am either with counterarguements or about how weak my "arguements" are.

 

[Bugfatty300]

What's so special about sex that it shouldn't be a service?

 

[Lohrenswald]

What's so special about sex that it shouldn't be a service?

Something about how it's such a basic and fundamental part of humanity, I guess

 

[REDY]

The sex as service is good thing. There are people who have not sex among primary needs but there are also people who cannot live well without it. Even people having no problem in getting friends with benefits should have problem to get some practices which would satisfy them. But then there are lot of ugly or shy people whose life would be more frustrating. There are indeed some other options than buying sex, but as with all services the paid service seems to be most effective.

There is now even project where even state train "sex therapists" to provide subsidized sex service to people with disabilities. I think that in Germany and Northern Europe it already works.

 

[Bugfatty300]

Something about how it's such a basic and fundamental part of humanity, I guess

Eating food is a basic fundamental part of being human too. I don't suppose you think restaurants = brothels, so can you be more specific about sex?

 

[Lohrenswald]

Eating food is a basic fundamental part of being human too. I don't suppose you think restaurants = brothels, so can you be more specific about sex?

I sort of do, though, I think

On the other hand, food aren't people, so there's that

 

[abradley]

My complaint is that prostitutes are too often outside the safety of the law.

Nearly everybody preys on them.

 

[Bugfatty300]

I sort of do, though, I think

Really? So why make a thread about prostitution? A thread about why buying and selling a hotdog should be crime would be much more interesting and original.

On the other hand, food aren't people, so there's that

Sex isn't people either.

Who grows and makes the food you buy? People do.

Who makes sex? People do.

Why are they different?

 

[abradley]

Eating food is a basic fundamental part of being human too. I don't suppose you think restaurants = brothels, so can you be more specific about sex?

IMO, having sex isn't the same as eating.

 

[Bugfatty300]

IMO, having sex isn't the same as eating.

Yep. Having sex is way more trivial to eating food.

A life without sex just kind of sucks. A month without eating means you die.

If anything it seems like selling and profiting from such an essential necessity like food is way more unethical than selling pleasurable body touching.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

I don't see anything wrong with prostitution in principle. It has potential for abuse and criminal activity like pimping and human trafficking, but having it legal and regulated is overall the better option than driving the entire sex industry underground.

This has to do with my views about how the individual is driven by external factors, that it is sort of alienating, that it doesn't "create anything of value" and that it's I'd say indecent. Sex should be an activity in of itself between those who really want it, not some petty service.

That's a weird principled view. Let me strawman it.
While we're at it, we should prohibit any commercial activity that could be enjoyable for both parties. Art should be done for art's sake and any creative endeavour is cheapened and profaned when you turn it a transaction. Musicians and actors should be forbidden from performing for money, the concept of intellectual property ought to be abolished completely, publishing should be seen the same way as pimping and sex slavery.

My complaint is that prostitutes are too often outside the safety of the law.

Nearly everybody preys on them.

And your solution is to make sure it stays outside of the law ?

 

[Old Hippy]

Now this is a topic I am not very well versed in, so you'll have to excuse the slightly lacluster first post.

I am not very good at "defending" my position on this, which is that prostitution is unethical and should be prohibited (at least prohibited to buy sex).

.

the problem with this is that in the past, local working girls have been blackmailed into doing things and paying for protection from the very law enforcement agencies charged with regulating the sex trade, coupled with the drug trade it means you end up with a very corrupted police vice squad.and an underground sex trade where health checks are not routinely carried out

much better to legalise it and have a Union for the workers (Prostitutes Collective here) that encourages them to use condoms and take licence plate numbers for their safety as well as get regular health checks for the publics safety

 

[FriendlyFire]

Robots = problem solved

 

[Old Hippy]

Robots = problem solved

that just brought to mind some horrible Fallout 3 memories

 

[GoodSarmatian]

that just brought to mind some horrible Fallout 3 memories

3 ? No.
New Vegas.

Spoiler :

 

[Snerk]

Prostitution is one of those (many) issues I can't land on one side of the matter. In a perfect world sex could be a service bought and sold without much problems like most other services. Where sex workers all had other options for making a living.
In the real world the sex trade is intertwined with so much misery, drugs, violence and various crimes that it's hard not to view it as a problem. Weather this problem is best tackled by prohibition or not I don't know.

Robots = problem solved

Damn right. Surely it's only a matter of time before real like sex robots are a thing and will make human prostitutes obsolete.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

Damn right. Surely it's only a matter of time before real like sex robots are a thing and will make human prostitutes obsolete.

I don't think human prostitutes will ever be obsolete. We have people today who are willing to pay extra for "organic" food or "artisinal" products.
Even if we make perfect imitations with realistic skin and pheromones there wull always be people who will swear that they can see, feel, taste the difference.
I see a future of sex robots for the masses and human prostitutes for hipsters and the wealthy.

 

[Snerk]

Yeah sure I can see that. But either way it would go a long way in solving the issue.

 

[Traitorfish]

Prostitution is one of those (many) issues I can't land on one side of the matter. In a perfect world sex could be a service bought and sold without much problems like most other services. Where sex workers all had other options for making a living.
In the real world the sex trade is intertwined with so much misery, drugs, violence and various crimes that it's hard not to view it as a problem. Weather this problem is best tackled by prohibition or not I don't know.

Arguably, a lot of that baggage is a result of prohibition. Both directly, for the simple fact that criminalisation tends to attract criminals, and indirectly, because it sustains traditional taboos on sex work. If prostitutes are by definition criminals, or in slightly more liberal systems forced to deal with customers who are by definition criminals, then it's largely going t o end up being done by people for whom that isn't a strong counter-incentive, who are likely to be vulnerable or desperate, or people who don't have a choice. If it's possible to work as a prostitute without stepping outside the bounds of the law, then it becomes an actual career option, if not perhaps the most enviable one.

Prostitution is always going to be trickier to normalise than forms of sex work like stripping or porn, because there's always going to be a market for low-cost transactions in unsafe environment, but prohibition isn't going to make it any easier.

 

[Paul in Saudi]

As I see it, prostitution is not wrong per se. We all know stories about young, (nubile, eager, tanned) lades working their way through law school. But (in my experience, in several nations on three continents.) These cases are rare.

Most hookers are forced into prostitution by poverty or traffickers. In the sex trade, markets fail. There are always more willing buyers than sellers, so unfair means are always used to increase the supply.

Prostitution should be suppressed not because of moral considerations. We should suppress it to suppress the crimes and ills that usually accompany it. Policemen should break up brothels and arrest streetwalkers to reduce disease, human trafficking, exploitation and the drug trade.

In a perfect world the sex trade would be fine. Our world is not perfect. While I admit this view will reduce the right of a few women willing to sell themselves, and the many men willing to buy sex, it protects the rights of people being exploited.

I am unaware of any place or time where legalization of the sex trade was not accomplished without much human misery.