i'm playing this one right now. i'm only at turn50 but it looks promising so far. desert/mountain/river, 3xstones, salt and even marble, incense, spices and oasis nearby. and no, its not a "legendary start"
thanks mate!
Deity OCC Science Victory - G&K Strategy and Tips
- Thread starter Sadato
- Start date
thanks mate!
Snowbeavers
Chieftain
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2008
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- 19
Thanks for the tips. This time I was Incan, had a city of pop 37, 745 bpt, RAs with everyone all game but at turn 311, I still have like 5 more techs to get through to finish nanotech and complete the spaceship.
Am I missing something with the tech tree? I have tons of wonders too but just can't get through the tech tree fast enough.
Arabia beat me by 20 turns or so. Sigh...
Something seems out of whack. In my game i ended with around the same BPT, but only could muster 5 RA's. You had 7 and based on your turns had 2-3 more cycles worth.
What are your benchmarks? When did you get Education, University, Oxford, Astronomy, Observatory, Public School, Research Labs? When was your first RA signed? Did you resign as soon as they ended? If the AI is broke, loan them the money. Did you build porcelein tower for +50% RA? Did you get +50% RA from rationalism? Did you time the jump to rationalism?
exactly, that are the right questions. As an example, in my last inca game some of the important points that i remember were: ToA, HG, Petra all mine, Petra at turn 75 or so, hit rationalism ~110, on the next turn was able to build oracle - > scientific revolution hit somewhat preaty early (around turn 145), public school around turn 150, of course both Leaning TP and PT were mine, finished freedom tree around turn 200. Hit turn 200 with about 600-650 bpt. At the end my bpt was 820, pop 50. Prety solid game all around, but not even close to finish around turn 220 as other comrades wrote earlier.
Hyperion529
Prince
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i managed to send the spaceship at turn 244 in my latest korea game. it was a near perfect game i think. only had one very short war early on (always bribed the AIs to fight each other after that) and thus didnt have to waste any production on military units. but i still have no idea how it's possible to finish sub230, though. maybe sweden as a friend could help a bit, but i doubt that would shave off a whole 15 turns...
Spoiler :
Finishing OCC Science or Culture sub T230 will require an excellent starting location, a suitable civ like Korea, Babylon or Inca and luck with wonders. You should also get Education T80-90 (T80s is very possible with Babylon), be able to sign RAs, rushbuy Uni, Oxford the Astronomy, rushbuy Observatory (unless you've an amazing production), finish left side of Rationalism asap (if going for science win), get Public School T130-135, finish Freedom by T180-190 (if going that route to science win, preferably earlier (like T170+) if going for culture win). It ain't an easy task even with favorable conditions
I'm trying to win as OCC with Pachacuti on King's difficulty and I get everything by the right time ~120 University (I start with ToA) and all, but I can never get 5-6 RA's simultaneously with education, not because I don't have money (I always have like 4k or something), but I can't get every AI to befriend me. I sometimes get 3 AI's friendships and not at once... I win in the end anyway, but its not even 250, but like 350+ which is really annoying. Any tips about getting these RA's ? or how and what should I do so I get 5+ dof's by the time I get to education? P.S. My locations are always great, by the 350 turn, I had a city of 50 population. Anyway, I think I'm doing everything on time and micromanaging properly, the only issue is that I don't get these RA's on time.
i managed to send the spaceship at turn 244 in my latest korea game. it was a near perfect game i think. only had one very short war early on (always bribed the AIs to fight each other after that) and thus didnt have to waste any production on military units. but i still have no idea how it's possible to finish sub230, though. maybe sweden as a friend could help a bit, but i doubt that would shave off a whole 15 turns...
Spoiler :
Very Nice!
I just finished on 248 with Korea. I am actually dissapointed I didn't break 230 with this start. (I must have overwrote autosave start, as i only have a normal save from turn 5 if anyone wanted it). I really had a hard time getting RA's. I only had 4 for most cycles, 3 sometimes and 5 once or twice. If I could have had a constant 5 or more I think 230 is beatable. I was done for all intents by 220 or so, i just had to hard tech the remaining 3 techs with only a great scientist to move it along.
Spoiler :
Hyperion529
Prince
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- 303
yes, number of RAs probably makes the difference. i only had 3 DoFs at a time to make RAs with in that game (plus Genghis, who was whiped out by France about 5 turns after declaring friendship with me. should have seen that coming :/)
I've really been trying every trick in the book to get friends with everyone. I've found that if you get 1 scout right off the bat (2 is even better if they're 5 turn builds) and meet 5 or 6 civs by turns 30-40, they'll DOF you from turns 50-80. This is completely anectdotal, I've just found it happens a lot to me so i keep doing it
I think 120 is too late. You are missing out on an early cycle of RAs you can get between turns 80-100. After that, I do everything I can to not anger them. Signing DOF with someone's enemies gives a temporary hit, but usually i can get DOF and renew them with each opposing force no problem. I'm hesistant to buy off too many CS as I usually fear the diplo hit.
Starting location has a lot to do with this as well. If you're up in a corner or cut off by mountains you'll have an advantage. CS buffers help. In my Korea game I was very close to Japan, so he wasn't down with friendship and i had to pay other AI to attack him to keep him from attacking me. It wasn't until they beat him down in the later part of the game that he wanted to be friends, so i only had 2 crappy RAs out of him at the end.
One other important factor is keeping the balance of power. Trying to keep AI from being eliminated or severely weakened helps with RAs.
My question is if I can't build the petra because I don't qualify how do I increase food for a citizens boost, I've tried the ToA and watermill but they are only good to a point also I didn't have a farm tile. Also what are the number or types of units I need to have in my territory so I don't get dow'd.
No farm tiles? Not good. Do you have deer, cattle, sheep or salt in that city? What are you using for food? Not being able to build Petra (which is OK for food, but not great) seems like the least of your problems.
Sounds like you may need to befriend a bunch of maritime CSs.
Sounds like you may need to befriend a bunch of maritime CSs.
i managed to send the spaceship at turn 244 in my latest korea game. it was a near perfect game i think. only had one very short war early on (always bribed the AIs to fight each other after that) and thus didnt have to waste any production on military units. but i still have no idea how it's possible to finish sub230, though. maybe sweden as a friend could help a bit, but i doubt that would shave off a whole 15 turns...
Spoiler :
did you build ToA, HG and Petra?
Hyperion529
Prince
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unfortunately i missed ToA, but got HG and Petra early. the only other wonders i wanted and missed by a few turns were the Kremlin and Brandenburg Gate (for the scientist points).
you went philosophy -> mathematics or vice versa?
Goblin_Fury
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2008
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- 10
@Hyperion529
Very impressive. Can you describe how to get such a ridiculous science income? I can't seem to break 400-500 bpt in late game, which leads me to pretty much always lose. Usually get NC fairly early, but education keeps getting delayed.
Very impressive. Can you describe how to get such a ridiculous science income? I can't seem to break 400-500 bpt in late game, which leads me to pretty much always lose. Usually get NC fairly early, but education keeps getting delayed.
Bpt It is really great. I expect that it is result of completed Freedom policy (x2 Academy yield) + working specialist (Korea get +2bpt/specialist).
If I do not finish Freedom (going for Order if my culture per turn is pretty low) I usually finish at 500-600bpt at the end. With Freedom I got some times 700+ but 1000+ is really huge.
Depends a lot on starting location and your opponent. In particular number of first wave of RAs depends very strongly on your opponent. By this time you don't have much possibilities to befriend other civs. Moreover, on King level others Civs frequently don't have enough gold. Any way, I feel that later RAs are much more important. Playing a game when one civ or two civs conquers others you can get at the end 1 or 2 (at most) RA and it is hard (on King at least) to win faster than T350+. On the other hand if there are some descent Civs you can sign RAs with, than even sub 300 is possible (on King again).
The rule is - higher level you can win faster since you get more
from RAs.Hyperion529
Prince
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yep, NC first and HG + Petra right after. used the techboost from NC to get masonry for marble iirc. didnt try for GL as it is nearly impossible to get on deity. cant remember if i built or rushbought the library though.
thats right, the bpt on the screenshot is mainly the result of the freedom finisher, which doubles the yield on academies (then 20 science for Korea) and also on the landmarks i settled with great artists (4 science with Korean UA). i also settled next to a mountain and thus had access to an observatory (extra +50% science) and focused on population growth whenever i wasnt building anything crucial in the city. because i also had a relatively large culture and gold output in that game, i was able to take the policy in the Patronage tree that gives science from allied city states and (at least in the late game) ally all of them that were not puppeted by the AI players. this accounted for about 200 bpt i think.
the bpt at the time of the screenshot are actually even lower than they were before (i dont remember exactly, but peak bpt was higher than 1300) because i had already finished all the spaceship techs and focused on production, e.g. didnt run any scientist specialists (and probably no merchants and artists) anymore.
