[WIP] Project Civ: A Quality-Oriented Civ Pack

[Beefie]

Hey Irkhalla really liking the looks of your mods and your work ethic!
Seen on steam and here you're planning on changing Sumer. People have been discussing them again on the suggested civs thread here and somebody hit on this:
Unique Ability: Fertile Crescent: +20% growth in all cities during a golden age. (By Kurtbob)

Thought this could work well with your mod and add more emphasis to a tall Sumer.
Anyway feel free to ignore me and I eagerly await the next Civ!

 

[Irkalla]

Hey Irkhalla really liking the looks of your mods and your work ethic!
Seen on steam and here you're planning on changing Sumer. People have been discussing them again on the suggested civs thread here and somebody hit on this:
Unique Ability: Fertile Crescent: +20% growth in all cities during a golden age. (By Kurtbob)

Thought this could work well with your mod and add more emphasis to a tall Sumer.
Anyway feel free to ignore me and I eagerly await the next Civ!

There's one thing about that... If you're doing what you're supposed to in Civ, you should enter a golden age around late medieval and not leave it until information era. I think my record for longest golden age is somewhere around 220 turns or so on Standard pace. It would have been longer, but I messed up and got out of the golden age for a couple turns. My capital was a great artist factory, and I had Chichen Itza and all that jazz... It was awesome.

Point being, having that for a trait would be like having two free Temples of Artemis for any player having a skill above the median.

 

[Irkalla]

Due to recent developments, Poland is now officially cancelled. We're also shelving a civ that we haven't even announced yet.

 

[killmeplease]

Point being, having that for a trait would be like having two free Temples of Artemis for any player having a skill above the median.

well this strategy has its costs, you have to prioretise great artists and golden age wonders effectively crippling other aspects of your development like science
and the temple of artemis is a crap, imho, i have never built it.

 

[turingmachine]

the temple of artemis is a crap, imho

A global +10% Food Yield modifier is not crap...

Oh yeah, it does something pointless with ranged units too.

 

[killmeplease]

A global +10% Food Yield modifier is not crap...

Oh yeah, it does something pointless with ranged units too.

iirc, its not a food yield modifier, its a growth modifier
that is +1 food if you have 10 food surplus per turn

 

[turingmachine]

iirc, its not a food yield modifier, its a growth modifier
that is +1 food if you have 10 food surplus per turn

Nah, see that's the thing. The description says growth modifier for whatever reason, but what it actually is (and you check this simply by checking the XML) is a 10% global food yield modifier.

Bad civlopedia description by Firaxis.

 

[killmeplease]

Nah, see that's the thing. The description says growth modifier for whatever reason, but what it actually is (and you check this simply by checking the XML) is a 10% global food yield modifier.

Bad civlopedia description by Firaxis.

interesting..
i wonder if all other effects (policies, beliefs) labeled as growth modifiers are really food modifiers?

 

[kirbdog]

There's one thing about that... If you're doing what you're supposed to in Civ, you should enter a golden age around late medieval and not leave it until information era. I think my record for longest golden age is somewhere around 220 turns or so on Standard pace. It would have been longer, but I messed up and got out of the golden age for a couple turns. My capital was a great artist factory, and I had Chichen Itza and all that jazz... It was awesome.

Point being, having that for a trait would be like having two free Temples of Artemis for any player having a skill above the median.

Your first paragraph contradicts the second.

Waiting for the renaissance era and acquiring a bunch of great artists (i.e. working artist slots and increasing the costs of other GP's like scientists) is not "free." Golden Ages already have great benefits for any civ, and growth multipliers abound in the game already, so it is hard to see how this is particularly unbalanced.

 

[kirbdog]

I was wrong. It is a food multiplier.

 

[killmeplease]

"growth modifier" = "surplus food modifier"

(surplus multiplier, not food multiplier, because food that gets eaten never gets multiplied in Civ 5)

well for food beliefs and policies it is said "growth modifier" in the XML and i'm sure that its what they actually do
not sure about artemis and floating gardens as for them its said that they increase food yield
i should check if you (and i) is right next time i'll capture a city having artemis

 

[turingmachine]

"growth modifier" = "surplus food modifier"

(surplus multiplier, not food multiplier, because food that gets eaten never gets multiplied in Civ 5)

so i was right
artemis is crap

All you need to do is check the XML:

  <Building_GlobalYieldModifiers>
    <Row>
      <BuildingType>BUILDING_TEMPLE_ARTEMIS</BuildingType>
      <YieldType>YIELD_FOOD</YieldType>
      <Yield>10</Yield>
    </Row>
  </Building_GlobalYieldModifiers>

It's a 10% global food yield modifier.

 

[kirbdog]

I apologize for the misinformation. I was assuming that "food yield" might be some programmer's short form for surplus food. But I was wrong. See screenshot.

Spoiler :

 

[killmeplease]

yeah.. so theres a pretty weird interface
not only misleading effect description
12-8=5
policy/belief modifiers are applied to the surplus food though
so, recurring to sumerian trait, it could have a growth effect not a yield one
which definitely wont be OP

 

[kirbdog]

Apparently Temple of Artemis and the Aztec's UB floating gardens hang this way, while all other "growth" bonuses behave the other way (modifying the surplus), in the current state of the game.

 

[Irkalla]

Two civs are now officially cancelled, they were never announced; Assyria, and Brazil. Don't ask about the Brazil icon, I'm not sure what I was going for with it. Haven't messed with it much either.



Sorry about the recent lack of stuff, I'm just scared to work on -anything- at the moment :V

For the record, Sumer is now considered Safe. In Brave New World, it will create a new City-State in Ur's stead.

Brazil may very well find its way into G&K and Vanilla, though. I always wanted to see a Vargas-lead Brazil. What made Getulio Vargas unique among the world leaders of his time, in my opinion, was his ability to meander between communism and fascism, while at the same time being viewed as opposed to America, Fascism, and Communism. It was rather skillful in my opinion.

 

[Irkalla]

Alright guys, I want your opinion on a few things.

The first of these things will involve replacing Greece as a civilization with three civilizations bound together in a pack. The civilizations that will replace Greece are Athens, Macedonia, and Sparta. Greece will cease to exist as an entity. I'll get some icons up in a few.

Athens will have Pericles as its leader, and probably will get Greece's current trait or some modification thereof. Perhaps it will have some naval UU and a unique building... perhaps something that relates to democracy. Since the game will probably act funny if I outright remove Greece from the game, Athens will probably succeed it.

Macedonia will have Alexander as its leader, and will probably have a trait that goes something like this... "Nepotism - Receive a free courthouse when annexing a city." They'll get companion cavalry, and something else to go along with that.

Sparta will be modified to feature the hoplite as its UU.






The second of these things involves Sparta's UU. Not considering the above, I want to rework Sparta's UU. Instead of the defensive bonuses, I want to give them a bonus vs. classical units, as well as buff their strength back up to normal. How does that sound?

 

[Donasin]

Initially I was very put-off by it, but after some thought I really like restructuring Greek faction into three states, especially considering how a bit of the original civilization lives in each new faction.

Beyond that I am earnestly excited to play-test the unreleased Civs, especially Mississippi/Cahokia.

 

[SuperWaffle247]

I think gameply-wise it sounds good but at the same time I feel like you'd have to break up some other Civs like India and maybe even China, because your definition of what Greece is and thus what a Civ can encompass has become more specific. That being said, looks very good.

 

[Irkalla]

I think gameply-wise it sounds good but at the same time I feel like you'd have to break up some other Civs like India and maybe even China, because your definition of what Greece is and thus what a Civ can encompass has become more specific. That being said, looks very good.

India can be broken up into India and Mughals, I think. I believe someone else is working on that, though. I might eventually consider it down the line. But really, India isn't nearly as generic as Greece is. I think Greece has to be the most genericized civ in the game.