Wish I could stop friends with open borders keeping their troops in my land

[mazz0]

It's bloody annoying! I sent someone up to look around Tomyris's land and it's empty, so it's not as though she's overflowing! It happens to be slightly handy right now and Teddy's trying to invade me and her horses are getting in his way, but most of the time it's just very annoying, ruining the aesthetic.

 

[Larsenex]

Oh fun, you are so ripe for a surprise war. Let me tell you about the 'Black Queen'. ....

She had nearly the same amount of troops in my lands. She and I were 'allies' and she 'declared' her life long love of me, Trajan! I thought I was in love. So love told me to build her an empire that both of us would rule! Off I march to that jerk and his empire called 'Kongo'! Upon the very last city that was defeated..not his capital mind you..but his last. She popped up and said, hey, thanks for letting me park all my troops in your empire! Oh and surprise, WE ARE AT WAR!!!!

All this while nearly all my military forces were many many 'tiles/miles' away for me to do a damn thing about her betrayal!

Soooo

My advice...always keep at least some troops in your empire for just such a situation. Oh and this was near industrial era, she was taking a HUGE hit in warmongering but did it anyway!

Cheers!

 

[Olleus]

Did her troops not teleport out on the DoW?

 

[knightblaster]

Careful because you could end up getting wardecced. Happened to me with open borders and friendly/green face. I think she may have moved the troops outside the borders before DOW, but don't remember. In any case, when the friendlies start using open borders to move lots of their troops in and around your territory, it's time to get a bit worried and shore up defenses if needed. You could be looking at DOW soonish.

 

[Iberian]

Should be open borders as well as shared military bases. Open boarders should only allow civilian units to pass through. Shared military bases should allow military units to move through.

Then they still need to fix the AI to have a destination when moving outside their territory. No treating open borders territory the same as their civilizations territory. So flag each tile that is within the units controlling civilization as a 1 and all units would remain in territory flagged as 1 unless they were moving to a destination via a move command. Then process the route to the new location prioritizing the tiles with a 1 flag and setting up the shortest route.

 

[isau]

This actually makes me wonder if it is some kind of bug.

And oh yeah, never trust anyone named Catherine in a civ game.

 

[mazz0]

She's been doing it for ages. I should build up a few troops though, they won't even need to be that strong, in ahead of her technologically.

There's a very simple fix - units should require more maintenance the further they are from your land (unless they're in allied land - then you could choose just to have open borders).

Speaking of distance from your land, there should be an additional cost for cities far from your capital, especially overseas.

 

[ExemplarVoss]

Simple fix: don't give them open borders.

Weird maintenance shenanigans doesn't seem like an interesting or workable solution.

 

[Raider]

Simple fix: don't give them open borders.

Weird maintenance shenanigans doesn't seem like an interesting or workable solution.

Agreed, something like this occurring goes back to fundamental problem with game design. The fact that a player (AI or otherwise) can make this many units and then be forced to park them all over the map because there isn't enough space for to keep them in their own territory just shows how poorly thought-out the interplay between unit costs, 1UPT and other economics of the game is. If you are going to design a game that uses 1UPT, there should not be a scenario in the game where a player has more units than tiles in their territory.

And that doesn't even touch the issue that, even short of full map covered, even limited carpet of doom is silly and hardly better than a stack of doom.

 

[mazz0]

Simple fix: don't give them open borders.

Weird maintenance shenanigans doesn't seem like an interesting or workable solution.

That's not a "fix". Open Borders are important, but they shouldn't allow friendly troops to completely block access to your own tiles for civilian units.

Do you think Civ IV had weird maintenance shenanigans?

 

[mazz0]

Agreed, something like this occurring goes back to fundamental problem with game design. The fact that a player (AI or otherwise) can make this many units and then be forced to park them all over the map because there isn't enough space for to keep them in their own territory just shows how poorly thought-out the interplay between unit costs, 1UPT and other economics of the game is. If you are going to design a game that uses 1UPT, there should not be a scenario in the game where a player has more units than tiles in their territory.

And that doesn't even touch the issue that, even short of full map covered, even limited carpet of doom is silly and hardly better than a stack of doom.

Like I said in the original post, her land wasn't full, it was almost empty.

 

[Zenstrive]

It happened to me too. Greece just park their units, even when I refused to renew open borders. Strange

 

[Brutus2]

Yep. In my game Japan has tons of units and they have been moving around in my land all game. Never attacked me and had no destination, just shuffling around my territory the whole game. Meanwhile he had a ton of open land available to settle but instead of making settlers, he just spams tons of knights and catapults for no reason other than to troll me

 

[KrikkitTwo]

First part of Solution
Allow units from different civs, but also different "layers" to occupy the same tile (Kongo Settler, Greek Knight)...unless the military unit civ is at war with the others, then (and only then) they block/kill it

Second Part of Solution
Give religious units their own layer... (so Kongo settler, Greek Knight, German Apostle....Kongo and Germany can be at war, but if Greece is at war with either of them the units die/are blocked)


possible extended Solutions
your military unit can "bump" any friendly military unit in your borders
make it easier to upgrade units (including upgrade options for religious units

 

[Agent327]

Interesting discussion. Open borders means open borders. If you don't want 'friendly' units all over your country, don't sign open borders. I never do, especially not if the 'friendly' neighbour is large. Neighbours are nice, but they should stay on their own lawn.

 

[Big J Money]

How long does open Borders last? Come to think of it, how do Allies last?

 

[pietro1990]

o prepare for a suprise atack civ 6 has the same stupid AI like civ 5 where it moved all his army at youre land when they have open borders and declare war as soon as they do all the units go back outside the borders.

The random suprise atacks even though they are friendly are the same as civ 5 the high warmonger penalty for declaring war is olso a civ 5 vanilla game mechanic.

Seems like they returned to the civ 5 vanilla AI in diplomacy. I have the feeling it are the same guys who made civ5 AI that makes civ 6 AI.

 

[qadams]

One possible solution for 1UPT: All those surplus military units should be able to be parked in an encampment with a barracks and/or stable. They could be stacked deeply there, maybe up to five or ten units, but when deployed would have to move separately or in corps.

 

[criZp]

Do they actually do this because they have no space in their own land, or do they do it just because they can?

 

[pietro1990]

Do they actually do this because they have no space in their own land, or do they do it just because they can?

because they can the poster of this topic says there are no units at their cities