Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
What difficulty do you recommend?
Acularius' GEM for Caveman2Cosmos
- Thread starter Acularius
- Start date
What difficulty do you recommend?
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
I play on
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
You mean "Noble"? Because there is no "normal" difficulty. Or do you mean all the way at super easy "Settler"?
philipschall
Warlord
- Joined
- Aug 14, 2009
- Messages
- 221
Alright, here's the latest GEM based on a couple days of autoplaying. This is balanced so no Civ flounders as a 1-city state. Every civ has room to expand, but only so much before conquest becomes the only route to expansion.
For whatever reason, this map has been CTD-ing a lot, it begins around turn 550 and then hits in 30-40 turn intervals. Completely random. Using the worldbuilder past turn 600 could also trigger a CTD. Raging barbarians seems to worsen the problem. Barbarian Civs probably do as well. I recommend turning both of those off if you aren't playing with viewports. (The reason I wasn't using viewports was because I needed to see the entirety of earth in the worldbuilder, also I'm not that well versed in their use.)
It has 37 civs. I know many want less civs than that, but I can't figure out how to remove them without giving existing civs ridiculous room for expansion, and thus handing them the keys to certain victory. For instance, having only 1 civ in the americas is a bad idea because they would be able to expand into all of the americas without any competition before the age of exploration. That singular american civ would be dominant.
There are some new civs in here that may at first seem confusing as to why they're there, here's my explanation:
Rajput: Stops persia from blobbing into the indian subcontinent, stops India or Chola from becoming dominant
Jurchen: Stops Yangshao or Korea from owning all of Siberia
Scythia: Stops Hitties, Babylon, or Persia from expanding into the steppes
Canton: Stops Yangshao from dominating China
Burma: Stops Tibet, India, or Chola from dominating all of SE asia.
Possible canidates for removal: Rajput, Tibet, Swahili, Ethiopia, Hittites, Burma (if tibet gets removed)
Many more civs will be open to removal once the supply limit/max travel distance system is in place, which will hopefully be within the year.
I fixed Carthage by replacing the leader with Dido. The problem was Hannibal's "Populist" trait, which gave -6%
and -1, giving them 0 production.
I'll play around with it some more for the next couple days, I'm open to suggestions about the map.
Included is the spawninfos, the pre-1500 map, and the corrected 5 civs map.
For whatever reason, this map has been CTD-ing a lot, it begins around turn 550 and then hits in 30-40 turn intervals. Completely random. Using the worldbuilder past turn 600 could also trigger a CTD. Raging barbarians seems to worsen the problem. Barbarian Civs probably do as well. I recommend turning both of those off if you aren't playing with viewports. (The reason I wasn't using viewports was because I needed to see the entirety of earth in the worldbuilder, also I'm not that well versed in their use.)
It has 37 civs. I know many want less civs than that, but I can't figure out how to remove them without giving existing civs ridiculous room for expansion, and thus handing them the keys to certain victory. For instance, having only 1 civ in the americas is a bad idea because they would be able to expand into all of the americas without any competition before the age of exploration. That singular american civ would be dominant.
There are some new civs in here that may at first seem confusing as to why they're there, here's my explanation:
Rajput: Stops persia from blobbing into the indian subcontinent, stops India or Chola from becoming dominant
Jurchen: Stops Yangshao or Korea from owning all of Siberia
Scythia: Stops Hitties, Babylon, or Persia from expanding into the steppes
Canton: Stops Yangshao from dominating China
Burma: Stops Tibet, India, or Chola from dominating all of SE asia.
Possible canidates for removal: Rajput, Tibet, Swahili, Ethiopia, Hittites, Burma (if tibet gets removed)
Many more civs will be open to removal once the supply limit/max travel distance system is in place, which will hopefully be within the year.
I fixed Carthage by replacing the leader with Dido. The problem was Hannibal's "Populist" trait, which gave -6%
and -1, giving them 0 production.I'll play around with it some more for the next couple days, I'm open to suggestions about the map.
Included is the spawninfos, the pre-1500 map, and the corrected 5 civs map.
I fixed Carthage by replacing the leader with Dido. The problem was Hannibal's "Populist" trait, which gave -6%
good feedback thx. And thanks for doing this, im curious as to which civs you removed.. The thought of starting a new game sux but its probably worth it.
I probably should clarify i started on immortal and had increasing difficulty on, so they didn't start with 2 settlers.
*edit* i changed populist to not having the -1
and only -5% in the svn earlier today btw.Went to start a new game and after I selected a civ I noticed all the AI had different difficulties. Some were Deity & Immortal while most were the normal Noble. I don't think this is intentional. Anyway, how do I change it?
philipschall
Warlord
- Joined
- Aug 14, 2009
- Messages
- 221
Whoops, that is a personal change. I'll fix it in the newer version tomorrow.
I managed to edit it myself was easy enough.
I noticed you removed england but left in japan. This seems strange to me, I kinda like england. I think you should put in england and/or portugual. Celts seems like they will have the best land in the world in terms of river/grassland/resources, and no-one else to compete for it with apart from rome. With greece and goths removed you might want to think about putting portugal or england, anyway up to you of course. Perhaps just give england some more room on there island? Might want to think about doing the same for Japan - im not sure. Maybe giving england & japan a free tribe could be a good idea even. Is it possible to have the tribes generated say 50 turns into the game or something? Having them at the start might be too stong, hmm..
If you don't really want to put in either Portugal or england I was thinking maybe replace celts with spain or portugal. They are further away from rome and germany, I feel like the land over there is slightly weaker of a start (very slightly). Personally, I just don't like having celts in mainland europe, particularly when so many other prominent ones have been removed. I know historically its accurate, but I would much prefer spain, dutch, portugal or france to be honest.
One other thing, does Inca have someone else in south america? I can't remember, I know maya is there. If there is no-one else apart from pascal then I strongly suggest you move him into brazil area and maybe think about moving inca further south. Aztec/Maya/Apache are all quite close together so I think moving mayans from central america to south america is wise. If there is someone there already that im not remembering, perhaps just remove pascal altogether.
How hard is it to allow players to select there own leaders btw? Do you know? Like is it possible to set the starting locations for the civs, but have mutiple leaders possible within each civ? This would be nice feature.
I noticed you removed england but left in japan. This seems strange to me, I kinda like england. I think you should put in england and/or portugual. Celts seems like they will have the best land in the world in terms of river/grassland/resources, and no-one else to compete for it with apart from rome. With greece and goths removed you might want to think about putting portugal or england, anyway up to you of course. Perhaps just give england some more room on there island? Might want to think about doing the same for Japan - im not sure. Maybe giving england & japan a free tribe could be a good idea even. Is it possible to have the tribes generated say 50 turns into the game or something? Having them at the start might be too stong, hmm..
If you don't really want to put in either Portugal or england I was thinking maybe replace celts with spain or portugal. They are further away from rome and germany, I feel like the land over there is slightly weaker of a start (very slightly). Personally, I just don't like having celts in mainland europe, particularly when so many other prominent ones have been removed. I know historically its accurate, but I would much prefer spain, dutch, portugal or france to be honest.
One other thing, does Inca have someone else in south america? I can't remember, I know maya is there. If there is no-one else apart from pascal then I strongly suggest you move him into brazil area and maybe think about moving inca further south. Aztec/Maya/Apache are all quite close together so I think moving mayans from central america to south america is wise. If there is someone there already that im not remembering, perhaps just remove pascal altogether.
How hard is it to allow players to select there own leaders btw? Do you know? Like is it possible to set the starting locations for the civs, but have mutiple leaders possible within each civ? This would be nice feature.
Faustmouse
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2012
- Messages
- 3,524
Will the updated 5 Civ Map be in the release Version V28 or do I have to download it extra?
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
I agree, infact one of the best movies made was "Zulu."
I am committing my psGiant Earth - pre-columbian to svn since I fixed the difficulty levels up yesterday, I figured you'd want it corrected for v28 which is being released soon.
Both the 5 civ and the pre-columbian versions of philipschall edition of GEM will be in v28. You won't need to download it.
Both the 5 civ and the pre-columbian versions of philipschall edition of GEM will be in v28. You won't need to download it.
Acularius
King
Just thinking about it...
From Europe, remove the Spanish and English, as the English AI tends to go stillborn and the Spanish have only one way to go which is an unfair advantage against France and Rome.
That should free up a fair amount of room in Europe for better growth. I do think Africa is fine with the current setup (Although moving the Zulu/Swahili) can be given to popular demand sort of thing.
Asia wise, Remove a Cambodia or Khmer, preference, although I would side with the more robust leader in this case.
You could theoretically remove the other 2 city states and just leave Sumeria the Fertile Crescent. [Or the most robust leader]
North America from the games I've seen develops really well with the amount of civs present.
South America develops decently as well since the Jungle and mountains keep the Incans and Tupi in check.
As for Central America, the removal of the Aztecs should allow the Mayans to take control while putting on the pressure in both North and South America... as of right now the Mayans are usually just bogged down in their initial city besieged by an Aztec stack.
I would remove Japan, other than Hirohito the other leaders tend to bog down Japan's natural bonuses which would be oversea trade.
Just my 2 cents overall, I haven't seen the latest tweaked version, and the previous version of that I created a 'no preset' map... which was simply copy and pasta.
From Europe, remove the Spanish and English, as the English AI tends to go stillborn and the Spanish have only one way to go which is an unfair advantage against France and Rome.
That should free up a fair amount of room in Europe for better growth. I do think Africa is fine with the current setup (Although moving the Zulu/Swahili) can be given to popular demand sort of thing.
Asia wise, Remove a Cambodia or Khmer, preference, although I would side with the more robust leader in this case.
You could theoretically remove the other 2 city states and just leave Sumeria the Fertile Crescent. [Or the most robust leader]
North America from the games I've seen develops really well with the amount of civs present.
South America develops decently as well since the Jungle and mountains keep the Incans and Tupi in check.
As for Central America, the removal of the Aztecs should allow the Mayans to take control while putting on the pressure in both North and South America... as of right now the Mayans are usually just bogged down in their initial city besieged by an Aztec stack.
I would remove Japan, other than Hirohito the other leaders tend to bog down Japan's natural bonuses which would be oversea trade.
Just my 2 cents overall, I haven't seen the latest tweaked version, and the previous version of that I created a 'no preset' map... which was simply copy and pasta.
Yeah philipschall really shouldn't have removed Tupi, im pretty sure inca is all alone with only mayans in central america.
As you say Aztec/Maya and now Apache are all close (too close). I definately think we should replace Mayans with Tupi.
I just started a game as japan yesterday, the island isn't too bad in all honesty. Its definately got more room than england. Plus with no other island civs like aboriginals etc, they have a nice opportunity to go island hoping
Also meiji gets 2 free trade routes (through his traits) so I plan to beeline for great lighthouse and this should definately allow me to keep up with some of the bigger civs imo.
Long story short, I think japs are ok. Actually I think maybe we should remove one of the two dormant volcano's near the japanese capital. They are just useless tiles that you can't use and it would be more fair to make one of them another lake tile with kelp for example (MUCH more useful).
As you say Aztec/Maya and now Apache are all close (too close). I definately think we should replace Mayans with Tupi.
I just started a game as japan yesterday, the island isn't too bad in all honesty. Its definately got more room than england. Plus with no other island civs like aboriginals etc, they have a nice opportunity to go island hoping
Also meiji gets 2 free trade routes (through his traits) so I plan to beeline for great lighthouse and this should definately allow me to keep up with some of the bigger civs imo.
Long story short, I think japs are ok. Actually I think maybe we should remove one of the two dormant volcano's near the japanese capital. They are just useless tiles that you can't use and it would be more fair to make one of them another lake tile with kelp for example (MUCH more useful).
Acularius
King
I would keep at least one volcano in Japan, but the one blocking off Shikoku could possibly be removed.
I didn't know that Tokugawa was changed to a different leader, I just remembered that he tended to have an extreme trade malus an island nation shouldn't suffer.
That and I never understood that malus, it was Tokugawa's successor that closed up Japan, not Tokugawa himself... [Or maybe I read that portion of history wrong]
I personally just think that either the Mayans or the Aztec from Central America need to be removed.
You could also remove one of the Sioux tribes, to free up space for the other Sioux tribe and the Iroquois.
Korea could be removed then, seeing as it suffers the same syndrome as Spain and only has one way to go, which is an unfair advantage to the surrounding AI.
Past that, I would have to look at the scenario and take a good hard look at everything before I recommend further removal of civilizations.
I think originally, the decision to place as many civs as possible was the 'drive' or demand at the time... but realistically to have a good game, the AI needs room to expand and to dominate a local position.
Too much removed from the Americas, and you will have them knocking on Europe's door (although interesting) far before Europe can hope to manage to defend against it.
One option that I highly recommend keeping on, is 'no city razing', which I know isn't the most realistic choice, however the AI manages to handle land grabs easier.
I might try a game without Rev on until it has been reworked...
I didn't know that Tokugawa was changed to a different leader, I just remembered that he tended to have an extreme trade malus an island nation shouldn't suffer.
That and I never understood that malus, it was Tokugawa's successor that closed up Japan, not Tokugawa himself... [Or maybe I read that portion of history wrong]
I personally just think that either the Mayans or the Aztec from Central America need to be removed.
You could also remove one of the Sioux tribes, to free up space for the other Sioux tribe and the Iroquois.
Korea could be removed then, seeing as it suffers the same syndrome as Spain and only has one way to go, which is an unfair advantage to the surrounding AI.
Past that, I would have to look at the scenario and take a good hard look at everything before I recommend further removal of civilizations.
I think originally, the decision to place as many civs as possible was the 'drive' or demand at the time... but realistically to have a good game, the AI needs room to expand and to dominate a local position.
Too much removed from the Americas, and you will have them knocking on Europe's door (although interesting) far before Europe can hope to manage to defend against it.
One option that I highly recommend keeping on, is 'no city razing', which I know isn't the most realistic choice, however the AI manages to handle land grabs easier.
I might try a game without Rev on until it has been reworked...
philipschall
Warlord
- Joined
- Aug 14, 2009
- Messages
- 221
New map, Notes:
Added England
Swapped Swahili for Zulu
Swapped Maya for Tupi
Acularius, many changes you called for were already added, such as changing Japan's leader, trimming states from the Fertile Crescent, ETC
Included is 5civs and the regular GEM, as well as the spawninfos.
Added England
Swapped Swahili for Zulu
Swapped Maya for Tupi
Acularius, many changes you called for were already added, such as changing Japan's leader, trimming states from the Fertile Crescent, ETC
Included is 5civs and the regular GEM, as well as the spawninfos.
Acularius
King
Currently not on my actual laptop, so I won't be able to look at the map until I get back to it.
Lexotan_sedlex
Warlord
- Joined
- Sep 22, 2010
- Messages
- 178
Hello,
Near the city of carthage (north of africa) need be placed a desert land because the wonder "Carthaginian Culture" need desert.
Near the city of carthage (north of africa) need be placed a desert land because the wonder "Carthaginian Culture" need desert.
Acularius
King
I just loaded up Japan, to take a look.
Some suggestions, because I never tampered with the original resource placement, such as coal or iron.
-You can place 2 coal resources in Japan, or at least one in Kyushu, the Southern island, or Hokkaido, the northern one (preferably on one of the mountains).
- Remove the dormant volcano on th second half of Shikoku, and replace it with silk, while changing the silk south of the Kyoto starting location into beef, to better represent beef being present in that area... apparently it is rather famous for it.
-(Optional) You can also change a mountain that is to the eastern tile of Kyoto to a lake to better represent Lake Biwa. I tend to prefer putting mines on those mountains though when the option unlocks.
This was just viewing with sgt posted on the SVN, and I took into consideration the newer changes in my comments...
I'm not very fond of the England option, mainly because I've never seen the AI preform well as England and it only seems capable in human hands... granted with raft making opened up earlier this might have changed so I kind of like confirmation of it.
You could easily remove Rome if you want. Which shouldn't unbalance the area too much. Carthage will still be kept in check navally by Greece and eventually the Celts.
Past that, in my head, the maps looks pretty balanced from the SVN version I'm looking at.
Maybe in the removal of Rome, the addition of England is more viable since both the Celt and German ai have the Italian peninsula to worry about and may leave more of the Isles, Northern France and the Iberian peninsula alone.
Some suggestions, because I never tampered with the original resource placement, such as coal or iron.
-You can place 2 coal resources in Japan, or at least one in Kyushu, the Southern island, or Hokkaido, the northern one (preferably on one of the mountains).
- Remove the dormant volcano on th second half of Shikoku, and replace it with silk, while changing the silk south of the Kyoto starting location into beef, to better represent beef being present in that area... apparently it is rather famous for it.
-(Optional) You can also change a mountain that is to the eastern tile of Kyoto to a lake to better represent Lake Biwa. I tend to prefer putting mines on those mountains though when the option unlocks.
This was just viewing with sgt posted on the SVN, and I took into consideration the newer changes in my comments...
I'm not very fond of the England option, mainly because I've never seen the AI preform well as England and it only seems capable in human hands... granted with raft making opened up earlier this might have changed so I kind of like confirmation of it.
You could easily remove Rome if you want. Which shouldn't unbalance the area too much. Carthage will still be kept in check navally by Greece and eventually the Celts.
Past that, in my head, the maps looks pretty balanced from the SVN version I'm looking at.
Maybe in the removal of Rome, the addition of England is more viable since both the Celt and German ai have the Italian peninsula to worry about and may leave more of the Isles, Northern France and the Iberian peninsula alone.
