Will Hitler be seen in a more positive way in the far future?

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The Lithuanian population of Vilnius was really that negligible? I'm surprised; I knew Lithuanians were mostly rural until after the Second World War, but I hadn't realise the contrast was so stark, even near the Polish border.
 
The Lithuanian population of Vilnius was really that negligible?
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Yes. All censuses which I know indicate this (and of course all of them cannot be biased):

Census year (country organizing census) - % of Lithuanians in Vilno (number of Lithuanians out of total population):

1897 census (Russia) - 2,0% (3,131 Lithuanians out of 154,532)
1916 census (Germany) - 2,6% (3,699 Lithuanians out of 140,890)
1917 census (Germany) - 2,1% (2,909 Lithuanians out of 138,787)
1931 census (Poland) - 0,8% (1,579 Lithuanians out of 195,021)
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World War 2
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1959 census (Soviet Union) - 33,6% (79,400 Lithuanians out of 236,100)
2001 census (Lithuania) - 57,5% (318,510 Lithuanians out of 553,904)
2011 census (Lithuania) - 63,2% (331,500 Lithuanians out of 524,566)

The Polish census of 1931 could be slightly manipulated in an Anti-Lithuanian way, but still - there is no big difference between 0,8% and 2%.

Percent of Lithuanians in Vilno in 1897 was actually exactly the same (2%) as that of Poles in Wrocław (Breslau) in 1900... :)

According to 1900 census (German one), there were 8,466 Polish-speakers (2%) out of 422,709 total population in Breslau.

As you can see even as late as 2001 Lithuanians had only narrow majority in Vilno. And the countryside around Vilno remains mostly Polish until today.

After WW2 most of surviving Poles from Vilno were deported or emigrated to Poland (1931 - 128,628 Poles; 1959 - 47,200 Poles; 2001 - 104,446 Poles).

Of course population of Vilno in 1939 was considerably higher than in 1931. So we cannot simply calculate 128,628 minus 47,200.

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That said, one of the most prominent Lithuanian archaeologists was born in Vilno on 23 January 1921:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marija_Gimbutas

Marija Gimbutas (Lithuanian: Marija Gimbutienė; January 23, 1921 – February 2, 1994), was a Lithuanian-American archaeologist known for her research into the Neolithic and Bronze Age cultures of "Old Europe" and for her widely accepted Kurgan hypothesis, which located the Proto-Indo-European homeland in the Pontic Steppe. Gimbutas's assertion that Neolithic sites in Lithuania and across Europe provided evidence for matriarchal pre-Indo-European societies was not well received in scholarly circles, but became a keystone of the Goddess movement.

(...)

Gimbutas was born as Marija Birutė Alseikaitė to Veronika Janulaitytė-Alseikienė and Danielius Alseika in Vilnius, the capital of Lithuania. Her parents were members of the Lithuanian intelligentsia, a social class which rose from the farming class during imperial Russian rule.[1] Her mother received a doctorate in ophthalmology at the University of Berlin in 1908 and became the first female physician in Lithuania, while her father had received his medical degree from the University of Tartu in 1910.
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It was a small community but it did exist (just like Polish community in Breslau :p).
 
The Polish census of 1931 could be slightly manipulated in an Anti-Lithuanian way, but still - there is no big difference between 0,8% and 2%.
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It is also probable that many Lithuanians emigrated after Vilno became part of Poland, and hence the decrease from 2% to 0,8%.

Emigration was the case with many Germans from Western Poland after 1918 (for example from Poznan or Bydgoszcz).

Many of those emigrating Germans were state officials / families of soldiers from German garrisons / soldiers themselves, etc.

After German administration was replaced by Polish administration those people had nothing to do here. Also German settlers who settled from 1886 to 1918 on land forcibly bought from Poles by the state (see: Königlich Preußische Ansiedlungskommission in den Provinzen Westpreußen und Posen / the Prussian Colonization Commission, the task of which was changing the ethnic structure of the region by removing Poles and bringing in Germans) were chased away.

On the other hand, Germans who settled already before 1886 were allowed to stay. But many of them decided to emigrate anyway.

Germanization (both through settlement and strong attempts to assimilate Polish people) in "Provinz Posen" was initially in fact quite efficient.

Percent of Poles in "Provinz Posen" was reduced from ca. 73.0% in ca. 1815 to ca. 59.8% in 1890*, but then increased to 61.3% in 1900* and continued to increase. The Prussian "Colonization Commission" was brought to life by Bismarck in 1886 precisely because he noticed that % of Poles was increasing again.

*Including soldiers from garrisons as population (if not including soldiers then perhaps % of Poles in 1890 was just over or exactly 60.0%).
 
In my old thread - LINK - I claimed that Hitler hated Jews because he considered them superior to Germans, not inferior.

Here are excerpts from a letter written by Adolf Hitler to Martin Bormann on February 3, 1945, which confirm that I was right:

http://blackbirdlibrary.pbworks.com...st a uniquely unique genocide__ EBSCOhost.pdf

I have never been of the opinion that the Chinese or Japanese, for example, are racially inferior. Both belong to old cultures and I admit that their tradition is superior to ours. (…) I even believe that I will find it all the easier to come to an understanding with the Chinese and the Japanese, the more they persevere in their racial pride. (…) Our Nordic racial consciousness is only aggressive toward the Jewish race. We use the term Jewish race merely for reasons of linguistic convenience, for in the real sense of the word, and from a genetic point of view there is no Jewish race. Present circumstances force upon us this characterization of the group of common race and intellect, to which all the Jews of the world profess their loyalty, regardless of the nationality identified in the passport of each individual. This group of persons we designate as the Jewish race. (…) The Jewish race is above all a community of the spirit. (…) Spiritual race is of a more solid and more durable kind than natural race. Wherever he goes, the Jew remains a Jew (…) presenting sad proof of the superiority of the 'spirit' over the flesh.
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This excerpt quoted above is what Hitler personally wrote (!). OK - that was as late as 1945, but still.

And also:



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As you can see, Hitler actually did not believe that Jews constituted a race in a biological sense of this word. Therefore ones who say that Hitler's Anti-Semitism was not a form of racism, but another kind of deep hatred, are largely correct.

Everyone talks of Hitler's and Nazi Anti-Semitism but forgets about their Anti-Slavism.

Hitler's Anti-Slavism was also not 100% racism, though it was certainly closer to racism than his Anti-Semitism. Let's remember that the Nazis did not consider Slavs to be Non-Aryans. They considered Slavs to be Aryans, but the worst category of Aryans (behind Nordics, Mediterraneans, etc.), and also heavily mixed with Mongoloids.

This is testified for example by fact that Hitler's attitude to various Slavic nations varied greatly - South Slavs, who were not an obstacle to German "Drang nach Osten" and did not occupy Germany's future Lebensraum (which at the same time was believed to be ancient Germanic land of Goths, Vandals, Varangians, Rus', etc., illegally occupied by primitive Slavs very recently, just 1500 years ago) were not considered as sub-humans - so basically Hitler's racial doctrine was strongly influenced and motivated by his political goals. His "official racial hierarchy" was also changing throughout time, as the list of his political and military friends, allies and enemies was changing:

Some examples of Hitler's views on Slavs below:

http://blackbirdlibrary.pbworks.com...st a uniquely unique genocide__ EBSCOhost.pdf

In his book from 1928, Hitler wrote:

It is only natural that in the Bolshevik revolution Jewry took leading positions in all fields of Russian life. Slavdom [Slawentum] as such and out of itself lacks any organizational talent. It is not capable to build states and to preserve them. If you pull out all non-Slavic elements out of Slavdom its state structures will immediately collapse.
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And also:

http://home.alphalink.com.au/~radnat/kangarooreich/partfortytwo.html

On 6 August 1942, Hitler said:

St. Petersburg must disappear utterly from the earth's surface. Moscow, too. Then the Russians will retreat into Siberia. (...) As for the ridiculous hundred million Slavs, we will mould the best of them as we see fit, and we will isolate the rest of them in their own pig-styes; and anyone who talks about cherishing the local inhabitants and civilising them, goes straight off into a concentration camp!
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And also:



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As for Hitler's racism against Blacks - only in this case (unlike in cases of Slavs or Jews), Hitler's attitude can be described as 100% racist.

Black people were considered by Hitler as so inferior that they did not pose any danger to Germans, therefore there was no need to exterminate them:



Slavic people were to be expelled or exterminated only in areas designated for future German Lebensraum. So that was politically motivated.

Gypsies were perhaps considered by Germans as inferior as Blacks, but they were "contaminating" their neighbourhood, not some distant Africa.

Maybe this is why Nazi Germans decided to exterminate them, while not giving any orders on final solution of Black people.

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To summ up:

- Jews were to be exterminated because they were considered superior (in terms of "spiritual race") to Germans, and they were dangerous candidates for world domination (which of course the Nazis wanted to prevent because they wanted Germans to dominate the world - not some alien Jews).

- Slavs were to be removed from "Ancient Germanic Territories" (Poland+Ukraine*+Russia) which at the same time were to become future "Lebensraum" for the Master Race. Hitler wanted to expell Western and Eastern Slavs back to Asia (behind the Urals), where - he believed - they originally came from.

- Most of South Slavs weren't considered enemies, since Hitler didn't plan Germanic colonization of the Balkans (these poor and infertile mountains weren't attractive at all for German Master Race, he could allow those silly Slavs to vegetate there), and many Slavs shared Anti-Semitism with Germans.

*There was Gothic presence in Ancient Ukraine (see: Jordanes, "Deeds of the Goths" - it was surely one of Hitler's favourite reads, alongside Viking Sagas).
 
Domen said:
In my old thread - LINK - I claimed that Hitler hated Jews because he considered them superior to Germans, not inferior.

Here are excerpts from a letter written by Adolf Hitler to Martin Bormann on February 3, 1945, which confirm that I was right:

http://blackbirdlibrary.pbworks.com...st a uniquely unique genocide__ EBSCOhost.pdf



This excerpt quoted above is what Hitler personally wrote (!). OK - that was as late as 1945, but still.

And also:



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As you can see, Hitler actually did not believe that Jews constituted a race in a biological sense of this word. Therefore ones who say that Hitler's Anti-Semitism was not a form of racism, but another kind of deep hatred, are largely correct.
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The evidence you quote doesn't show that Hitler thought the Jews were superior to the Germans. It shows that Hitler thought that the Jews and the Germans alike were "spiritual races" and that "spiritual race" was a more real and important concept than "natural race" or the like. It doesn't show that he thought that the Jews were a stronger spiritual race than the Germans, only that he considered the general phenomenon of spiritual race - whether applied to Jews, Germans, or anyone else - to be stronger than that of natural race.
 
It shows that Hitler thought that the Jews and the Germans alike were "spiritual races
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He didn't write that Germans were a "spiritual race" - he wrote that thing only about Jews. And he also complained that a Jew is always a Jew, meaning that Jews can't be part of the German nation at the same time (in his opinion), but will always remain strangers. I.e. that Jews are unwilling to assimilate.

Germans in Hitler's view were not a "spiritual race" but rather a nation (Volk) consisting of several races. Well obviously he was aware of assimilation of "Non-Nordic races" into the German nation throughout history, so he didn't believe in racial purity of Germans, though he tried to make them more pure.

Hence "elements" classified as "racially suitable for Germanization" by Nazi anthropologists, were planned to be forcibly assimilated.

German anthropologists were studying the "racial composits" in various populations.

For example in 1940 "scientists" from the SS examined 57 Slavic Kashubian males (aged 17 to 60) from Northern Poland:

http://www.dziennikbaltycki.pl/arty...ria-jak-ss-badalo-kaszubow,id,t.html?cookie=1

Translation:

Physical appearance of 57 Kashubian males was analyzed.

Most important part of evaluation were racial-anthropological measurements & classification, concerning how fit were individual men for purposes of Nazi policy. And so: 12 of examined men were judged "useless" ("prevalence of Eastern and East Baltic features, partially with Mongoloid admixture"), 10 were judged as "still useful" ("prevalence of Eastern or East Baltic features, but with noticeable elements of Nordic and similar features"), 15 as "well useful" ("moderately racially mixed") and 20 as "very useful" ("prevalence of Nordic features").

In general: prevalence of the latter group indicated, that in Kashubian nation ("Volk") there was still a very large number of "Nordic features". Summarizing the entire study, authors of the report wrote: "features mentioned above give us the opportunity to exclude from the Kashubian Volk all undesirable elements and then to develop the Kashubian Volk (meaning: its Nordic features) for purposes of German policy."
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And now the funny part:

Modern DNA studies show that Kashubian males are actually more "genetically Slavic" than any other Slavs, except for Lusatian Sorbs.

Kashubians have higher percentage of R1a Y-DNA haplogroup - associated with Slavs in this part of Europe - than any other ethnographic group in Poland. However, of course genetic research was unavailable for Hitler's scientists. So they had to rely on arbitrary anthropological studies using arbitrary methodology.

When Germans attacked Leningrad, they found more peasants with "Nordic features" and blonde hair in neighbouring villages than in Northern Germany.

Obviously so called "Nordic features" (based on highly arbitrary classifications - each pre-war anthropologist had a different classification of what was "Nordic" and what was not) developed in Prehistoric, Stone Age Northern Europe, therefore also in Finland, Estonia, Baltic states, Northern Russia, etc.

Indo-European invaders, who came from the South (from areas of modern Ukraine and Central Russia) absorbed those Stone Age populations.

Not only Proto-Germanic tribes but also Proto-Slavic, Proto-Baltic as well as Finno-Ugric invaders from the east absorbed those "Nordics".
 
Official German policy towards ethnic Polish people in areas incorporated to the Reich was determined in the report issued by dr. Erhard Wetzel and dr. Günther Hecht (both doctors were members of Rassenpolitisches Amt of NSDAP - Office For Racial Policies of NSDAP) on 25 November 1939, titled:

"The issue of treatment of population of former Polish areas from racial-political point of view"

Their conclusion in that report was, that as many "common people" as possible were to be Germanized, while the rest of population (racially unsuitable elements) were to be expelled to Generalgouvernement. Different policy was to be applied against Polish educational, political, cultural and economic elites. Polish elites were to be exterminated - no matter the "race" of their members - in order to facilitate the speed of Germanization of the common people.

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Polish people expelled from areas of Poland incorporated directly to III Reich - New Reichsgaue (LINK) - photos from Bundesarchiv:

Spoiler :







And here "Aktion Saybush" in 1940 to 1941 - expulsion of Poles from the city of Żywiec and areas around Żywiec:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_Saybusch

https://www.google.pl/search?q=Akti...0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1525&bih=720&dpr=0.9#imgdii=_

Spoiler :



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Another "Early Bastion of Germanness" was to be the region of Zamojszczyzna in Eastern Poland (the city of Zamość and areas around):

http://www.freenations.freeuk.com/voices-sprync.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zamość_Uprising

That expulsion was already part of the German implementation of their Generalplan Ost:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost

Over 110,000 local Poles from 300 towns and villages were expelled in that region (Zamojszczyzna) - many of them expelled to death camps. Their homes were then settled by German colonists, such as Erika Steinbach (well, Erika actually settled in Gdynia - a.k.a. Gotenhafen, the Gothic Harbour):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gdynia#During_World_War_II_.281939.E2.80.931945.29

The city and seaport were occupied in September 1939 by German troops and renamed Gotenhafen after the Goths, an ancient Germanic tribe, who had lived in the area. Some 50,000 Polish citizens, who after 1920 had been brought into the area by the Polish government after the decision to enlarge the harbour was made, were expelled to the General Government. Kashubians who were suspected to support the Polish cause, particularly those with higher education, were arrested and executed. The main place of execution was Piaśnica (Groß Plaßnitz), where about 12,000 were executed. The German gauleiter Albert Forster considered Kashubians of "low value" and did not support any attempts to create a Kashubian nationality. Some Kashubians organized anti-Nazi resistance groups, "Gryf Kaszubski" (later "Gryf Pomorski"), and the exiled "Zwiazek Pomorski" in Great Britain.
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Nazi appeal to Polish people who thought that they had German ancestors to report themselves to authorities for the purpose of Germanization:



Excerpt:

"Throughout the centuries" - the appeal says - "German colonists have been marching eastward (...) in order to shape that land in accordance with the German Spirit. Because of Polish policies, and especially because of persecution by the Polish state (...) those German colonists felt alone and abandoned. In the political struggle, which was usually being fought on economic-social background, they eventually forgot about their links to Germanness, and the Polish language entered into their families. These Germans can in present times be once again restored back to the German Nation. Of German Seed is everyone, who can prove that at least one of his or her grandparents had German ancestry. (...)"

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German poster from 1941:

The poster says:

"In time from October 1939 to March 1941, 408525 Poles and Jews have been displaced"



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Fragment from another poster:

"After the Campaign of 18 Days, Huge Action of Colonization began" - it says:

"All ethnographic groups of Germans are returning to land of their ancestors" [i.e. Goths, Vandals, etc., according to Nazi beliefs]:

Spoiler :

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During WW2 over 200,000 Polish children were kidnapped from parents and transported to Germany to be adopted by German parents and raised as Germans.

Genocide does not necessarily consist of physical extermination of individuals (i.e. a collection of a very large number of murders is not necessarily a genocide), but it is all about erasing a peoples or a nation, a race, a religious group, or an ethnic group as a community.

Genocide is derived from Greek word "genos", which means: nation / kind / race / ethnos / stock / tribe.

Therefore genocide is an attempt to eliminate a community such as these ones mentioned above.

Hitler did not intend to physically exterminate all Polish (or Slavic in general) people, he wanted to exterminate all nation-building elites as well as those simple individuals who were "racially unsuitable" according to his own arbitrary criteria, while the rest of simple Slavic individuals were to be turned into stray biological material and then recycled in ethnic sausage machines, eventually being turned into Germans (i.e. Germanized).

The Nazis wanted nations and ethnic groups to disappear - whether through assimilation into Germans, or through physical destruction.

At first, the Nazis wanted to fragment the Polish nation - citizens of Poland - into many groups hostile to each other; after that they wanted to "deal" with each group separately, in turn, either by physical extermination, expulsion, assimilation, etc. - regardless of means applied, the ultimate goal was to be the same in each case: disappearance of each group as an ethno-cultural-religious community):

From the "project concerning the dealing with foreign elements in the East" written by Heinrich Himmler and published on 28 May 1940 (before that approved by Adolf Hitler on 25 May 1940). The title of this document is "Einige Gedanken uber die Behandlung der Fremdvolkischer in Osten". Here are some of its fragments translated to English (the first fragment is the Introduction):

"... On Saturday 25 May 1940 I presented to the Fuehrer my project concerning the dealing with foreign elements in the East. The Fuehrer - after reading it - judged it as righteous and reasonable... The Fuehrer ordered me to call to Berlin Governor-General Hans Frank, in order to show him my project and tell him that the Fuehrer approves it...

... We must take care for the largest possible amount of national groups. Not just Poles and Jews, but also Belarussians, Ukrainians, Highlanders, Kashubs and Lemkos... It is important for us not to deal with one, unified nation, but it is in our interest that this nation is fragmented into plenty of individual, small parts. We must prevent any consolidation of national culture between those parts, because our goul is to crumble those people into countless fragments... We need to disintegrate into shapeless mass 15 million population of the General Gouvernement and 8 million in new eastern provinces of the Reich...

... In several years from now, perhaps no more than 4 or 5, the - for example - Kashubian issue shall no longer exist - as there will be no trace of Kashubians... The same refers to Masurians... I also expect that the word "Jew" will disappear completely, thanks to deportation of all Jews to Africa... After just a bit longer time we shall be able to also completely remove from our territories all memory of such tribes like Ukrainians or Highlanders... The same in broader terms will also concern the Poles...

... For non-German population in eastern territories there should not exist any school higher than four-class primary school. Education programme of these communal schools shall include the knowledge of counting to 500, not higher. It shall also teach children the principles given by God: submission to Germans, necessity of being honest, hard-working and brave. I do not - on the other hand - consider as necessary to teach them reading... Apart from this type of schools no other ones can exist in the East...

... Parents wanting better education for their children will be obliged to send a proper request to local SS or Police authorities. If their children represent a desirable racial type, they will be evacuated to Germany for education, they will be given new surnames and they will stay there forever... Parents of such children must either disclaim them - and probably as the result also resign from having further progeny, which will remove the danger of this subhuman nation breeding types with leadership skills - or emigrate to Germany, in order to, after changing their surname, enter the German world. But caution and supervision will still have to be applied regarding such parents...

... After systematic operations, only population consisting of just subhuman elements will remain in the General Gouvernement. This depersonalized, deprived of their identity mass of people will become a human resource, designed as laborers for construction projects in Germany...

... Deprived of culture, under severe, consistent and righteous leadership of the German Nation Poles will participate in the task of creating eternal cultural values, such as the construction of monuments and great buildings. Regarding the latter ones, they will repeatedly enable their creating, providing necessary amounts of labour force..."
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Germanization to a full scale, the unworthy eliminated, sad history uncovered for all willing to read, very impressive knowledge and posts, are you a History Professor, Domen?

On the other hand, didn't Poles do to Eastern (Orthodox) Slavs, to a degree, and over a much longer period of time, what the Germans tried to accomplish during WWII?
I'm talking about Polonization and forced Catholicism applied by Polish governments and especially the Polish Catholic Church over centuries of domination of lands and populations of the Ukrainians, Belorussians and Rusyns-Ruthenians(who, most people don't even know existed, and still do).
Wasn't the Greek(Eastern) Catholic Church developed by Poles(the Catholic Clergy) to dominate and over time exterminate the Christian Orthodox faith of these people?


Also, aren't Poles now being mass Lithanianized in Modern Lithuania?
 
didn't Poles do to Eastern (Orthodox) Slavs, to a degree, and over a much longer period of time, what the Germans tried to accomplish during WWII?
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No, these two things cannot be compared.

We can compare the Polonization of eastern territories of Poland-Lithuania with Germanization of West Slavic and West Baltic territories (East Germany, Pomerania, Silesia, East Prussia) throughout centuries, between the Middle Ages and the 19th century, but certainly not with Nazi policies during WW2.

In West Slavic areas various German rulers already from the Middle Ages did apply laws discriminating Slavophones and favouring Germanophones (just like in Britain Anglo-Saxons introduced legal apartheid between the English and the Britons, a.k.a. the Welsh, "foreigners", as invaders called native inhabitants).

But that couldn't be compared to what the Nazis did in WW2.

I'm quite sure that throughout history the number of Germanized Poles surpassed the number of Polonized Belarusians, Lithuanians, Ukrainians, etc.

When you are losing ground on one front, you need to exploit opportunities on another front.

I'm talking about Polonization and forced Catholicism applied by Polish governments and especially the Polish Catholic Church over centuries of domination of lands and populations of the Ukrainians, Belorussians and Rusyns-Ruthenians(who, most people don't even know existed, and still do).
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All Early Modern rulers were enforcing their own religion in their own kingdoms, and demanding the population to convert to their religion.

"Cuius regio, eius religio" - whose kingdom, his religion.

Poland-Lithuania was during some part of its history (notably in the 16th century) actually one of the most religiously tolerant countries in Europe.

Polonization of some population groups within the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth took place for other reasons than discriminatory state policies.

Wasn't the Greek(Eastern) Catholic Church developed by Poles(the Catholic Clergy) to dominate and over time exterminate the Christian Orthodox faith of these people?
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The Uniate Church was a kind of compomise - Orthodoxes recognized supreme authority of the Pope, Catholics allowed them to keep their religion. Uniate Churches were similar to Orthodox Church when it comes to customs, traditions, etc. The main difference was that they pledged loyalty to Popes in Rome.

See the Union of Brest-Litovsk (1595 - 1596): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_of_Brest

In an "average" kingdom of that time, the king and the nobles would have simply expelled or executed religious dissidents.

You are of course correct that Orthodox Church (those who did not recognize the Roman Pope) were discriminated in Poland-Lithuania.

One of reasons why Cossack Uprisings started (including the most famous Khmelnytsky's Uprising in 1648) was bad treatment of Orthodoxy.

Poles also commited crimes when they invaded Russia early in the 17th century, which included burning one district of Moscow and even cannibalism.

At one point Polish-Lithuanian army, besieged by Russian reinforcements, was forced to eat local Russians to survive, waiting for the relief. It reminds me of Crusaders in the Holy Land, who were also eating local Muslims in times of starvation. Haroon in some thread quoted sources about that.

Also, aren't Poles now being mass Lithanianized in Modern Lithuania?
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The Lithuanian government is trying to Lithuanize them*, but they are sticking to their Polish identity reasonably well, and fighting for their rights.

Remember that one of Lithuania's MEPs in the European Parliament - Waldemar Tomaszewski - is a local Pole. So they have their representation.

BTW - there are even more Poles in Belarus than in Lithuania. And I think that they are facing more problems under Lukashenko's regime. Many Poles in Belarus have already been Belarusianized, considering that Poles according to official data of Belarusian government no longer are the majority among Roman Catholics in Belarus (at least according to official censuses there are more of Catholic Belarusians - while traditionally Roman Catholics identified as Poles).

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*Poles in Lithuania definitely don't enjoy the same rights as historical minorities in other EU countries:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RyX5vX9Qfs


Link to video.

German minority in Poland enjoys a lot of rights and privileges, despite the events of WW2 and all German crimes against Poland.

But Lithuanians, for some reason, can't get over the so called "stealing of Vilnius" (in which only 2% of population identified as Lithuanians).

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As for what the Poles did to Eastern Slavs.

Well - already in another thread I claimed, that it was Poland-Lithuania which, in some way, broke their unity.

I.e. without Poland-Lithuania, there would have been no Ukrainians and Belarusians today, but only Russians.

Polonization did not go exactly as expected (i.e. Ukrainians, instead of Eastern Poles) - but a "Neither Russian Nor Polish" hybrid was created:


Link to video.

And, by the way - lexically, Ukrainian and Belarusian languages are closer to Polish than to Russian:

http://elms.wordpress.com/2008/03/04/lexical-distance-among-languages-of-europe/

"The theory of lexical distance among European languages by Kostiantyn Tyshchenko":

http://filocultglottologokaarlomari...uages-by-kostiantyn-tyshchenko/?doing_wp_cron



Some other versions:

 
As long as there is "Main Kampf" and as long as people can read it, Hitler will not be seen in a more positive light.

Here are some excerpts from "Main Kampf":

Everything what we admire on this Earth - science, art, technical abilities and inventiveness - is the creative product of a very small number of nations, and maybe even of just one race. The entire culture is based on their existence. If they become ruined, they will take with them into graves entire beauty of this Earth. If we divide the human race into three categories: creators, defenders and destructors - the Aryan race can be considered as representatives of this first category. Aryan races - sometimes in ridiculously small numbers - take control of other nations and are favoured by huge numbers of their subjects of lower ranks, who stand at their disposal, and are developing accordingly to conditions of life in conquered lands, such as fertility, climate, etc. Aryans have innate intellectual and organizational talents. Throughout centuries they are creating culture which is authentically preserving its traces in the ground and in peoples subordinated to their rules. The main sin of conquerors is acting against the principle of preserving the purity of blood and mixing it with subjugated native populations, which inevitably leads to the end of their existence as a chosen nation. (...) Culture in its early history was of course more dependent on labour provided by worse human material than that of domesticated animals. Only after the subjugation of conquered races, the same fate happened to the world of animals - contrary, to what many people would like to believe - becase initially ploughs were pulled by slaves, and only later by horses. (...) An Aryan conquered sub-humans, to make them work under his control, according to his will and his purposes. Even though he was demanding hard work from his sub-human subjects, he not only protected them, but also provided them with better existence than that which they had lived previously as free men. As long, as an Aryan felt being the leader, he was not only preserving his rule, but was also the supporter and the protector of culture. But when only those subjugated nations started to rise from their knees and probably started to transform their language into a similar one to the language of conquerors, the previously sharp barrier between the master and the servant collapsed. The Aryan man renounced his purity of blood, and thus renounced his right to exist in the country, which he himself had created for his kind. He was drowning, crippled by a mix of races, and gradually losing forever his civilization-building skills, until finally he was becoming more and more similar to natives, both in intellectual and physical terms. Only for some more time, he could cherish the blessings of civilization. This is how old civilizations and empires collapse, leaving space for new creations. The mixing of blood and the lowering of the level of racial purity, which accompanies it, is the only and the exclusive reason, why old civilizations disappear - not lost wars are ruining humanity, but precisely the loss of strength to resist, the source of which is the purity of blood. In our German language, there is a word which perfectly describes the sacrifice for the well-being of the community. This is "Pflickterfullung" - the readiness to obey in fulfilling service. The fundamental idea of such attitude is idealism, contrary to egoism, and such attitude is the ability of an individual to sacrifice himself for the society. In times when we experience the disappearance of ideals, we can observe immediate loss of strength of the society, which is the essence of any society and the indispensable condition for existence of culture. In such times the leading power within the nation becomes egoism.

(...)

The exact opposite of an Aryan is a Jew. In no other nation in the world the instinct of self-preservation is as strong as in this "chosen nation". The best proof of this fact is, that the Jewish nation still exists. Is there any other nation, which during the last two thousand years so negligibly changed its internal character as the Jewish race? What other race has been in reality involved in more revolutionary changes than this one, and survived without any harm the most terrific misfortunes? How significant these facts are in showing their firm will to survive and to preserve their species. Intellectual abilities of Jews have evolved during centuries. Today we think about Jews as cunning people, and in a sense this was the case in every epoch. Original Aryans were probably nomads, and only later, after some time, they settled - this is a proof, that Aryans were never Jews! No, a Jew is not a nomad, because even nomadic peoples had a certain, defined attitude to work. Work was as long the base for their further development, until they gained certain intellectual abilities. But nomads gained the ability of developing ideals, so their concept of life can be strange for the Aryan race, but not indifferent. That concept never applied to Jews, a Jew was never a nomad, he was always a parasite on flesh of other nations. It often happened that a Jew was abandoning previous spheres of his life, not due to his own plans, but as a consequence of his expulsion by other nations, whose hospitality he was abusing. The expansion of Jews into all corners of the world is typical for parasites! A parasite is always searching for new feeding grounds for its kind. Jewish life inside other nations can last forever, if only he succeeds in creating an impression, that he is not a racial problem, but a "religious community". This is the first, major lie! In order to exist as a parasite within a nation, a Jew must use work, in order to conceal his real internal nature. The more intelligent is a particular Jew, the greater will be his success in this fraud. He can in some instances succeed so much, that the majority of a given society will believe, that a Jew is in fact a Frenchman, an Englishman, an Italian or a German, despite being an adherent of a different religion.
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This extensive passage, by the way, once again shows that Hitler considered Jews as superior to Aryans.

Hitler was frustrated by Aryan tendency to melt into their subjects and merge with them, as the result of which - said Hitler - Aryan empires were collapsing. On the other hand, he noticed that the Jewish nation continued to exist longer than any Aryan-sponsored empire. Aryan nations can't be "chosen", because they melt into their subjects, "which inevitably leads to the end of their existence as a chosen nation". Whether he considered Jews to be a "biological race" or a "spiritual race" (as in that letter from 1945, which I quoted above), he considered them as people able to preserve their "chosen" identity - unlike most of Aryans.

========================================

Of course ignoramus Hitler got most of things wrong, including his claim that Jews were never nomadic.

Hebrews were initially nomadic:

http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/33_nomadic.html
 
What is funny is that Hitler's comparison of Aryans and Jews is actually a rant about how Aryans are inefficient and unsuccessful parasites while Jews are efficient and successful parasites. Of course he doesn't use the word "parasites" when describing Aryans (he only uses it when describing Jews), but a "master race of rulers" who gave up any personal work centuries ago (when their "innate leadership skills" evolved, so that they could stop working and start conquering and ruling), and instead prefer to order slaves subjected to their rule to pull ploughs for them (rather than using horses) - is what exactly, if not parasites? He also counted Aryans as part of "creators", but I guess he turned his Aryans (he believed that he was a leader of "Aryans") into "destructors".
 
Domen said:
Prof. Richard Pipes said: "Communism and Nazism were twin bastards of Marxism."

Do you agree ??? I agree.
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The only way I can make sense of this is in thinking about the rise of Nazism as a reaction to socialist parties in Germany.

Don't think that was his intention though.
 
Didn't Nazism have many of the characteristics of Communism, though?

Didn't the Nazis claim to have eliminated class? I mean, I know they hadn't. But nor any more had the Communists.

But both would have seen, or said they saw, that all citizens were "in it" together.

What do the letters NSDAP stand for?

Still, I don't really recollect when Hitler could have claimed to have been influenced by Marxism except as a reaction to it.

Yet, who knows? He was a remarkably muddled thinker. So that may have been the result of reading Das Kapital. Enough to muddle anyone, I think.
 
Borachio said:
Didn't the Nazis claim to have eliminated class? I mean, I know they hadn't. But nor any more had the Communists.
Click to expand...
Liberals generally claim to aspire towards the abolition of social class, too. It's simply that they don't imagine the abolition of social class to entail the abolition of social difference, and this is also true of the Nazis.
 
Nazism, Communism, and Liberalism: the bastard triplets of Marxism, then.

I think I'm getting the hang of it, now.
 
That's pretty much the orthodox reactionary position: that fascism, socialism and liberalism are all modernist ideologies and therefore fundamentally objectionable.

It's not a position I agree with, but it's at least coherent, which can't really be said for totalitarianism theory, or at least not in its neoconservative mode.
 
@Domen, he is a guy in the past who believed a lot of nonsense. If we held that against everyone in the past, there would be no-one who wasn't despised.
 
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