What is poetry?

Opinion is subjective, but so is news - because of its emotional impact; no matter how 'objective' facts are conveyed, there's always - implicit or explicit - emotional content.

As for arbitrary grammar rules: it's what makes up the essence of poetry, nay language itself.
 
Opinion is subjective, but so is news - because of its emotional impact; no matter how 'objective' facts are conveyed, there's always - implicit or explicit - emotional content.

As for arbitrary grammar rules: it's what makes up the essence of poetry, nay language itself.

Your first statement is, in and of itself, subjective. Except "Opinion is subjective" which is objective ,which is my opinion. :)
 
Back to topic - we left off with a sonnet from the Portuguese -, here's


Camoës

He lived his youth in the remote castle
and served a spiritless, listless court.
He fled, hank'ring wildly after a greater fate,
solely to the recently founded states.

Disdained for his silence and uncertain aim
by merchant and soldier alike;
on board, in the fort delivered to the vile plot
he could not defeat, just serve his powerless hate.

Yet his dream ventured into fulfilment:
not conquering strange wonderlands
with mighty armada,

he wrought in chilly grotto's dusk
- damned poet, vagabond and exile -
the heavy strophes of the Lusiada.

Grotto, Macao

J. Slauerhoff


(Translated from Dutch.)

By the way, the musical instrument, other than the flute or lyre, held by the Muse in Akhmatova's poem below, might also have been a shawm.
 
here let me give you an example of a poetry that changed my look at life

Sex

Sex is passion
Sex is desire
Sex is hot
Sex is fire
Sex is fast
Sex is slow
Sex is to much for kids to know
Sex is pain
Sex is pleasure
Sex is warm no matter what type of wheather it's on
Sex is ambition trying to achieve a goal
Sex is enthusiasm interesting to the soul
Sex is wonderful
Sex is great
Sex is can be the strongest thing to make your back brake
So sex is not just a word it's somthing that people do
and before you have sex dont forget to strap up to
 
[FONT=&quot]Well, thanks for sharing these invaluable contributions. And now I'd like to present an actual poem by Thomas Hardy (1840-1928), mainly known for such pessimistic novels as Far from the madding crowd (1874), The return of the native (1878) en Tess of d'Urbervilles[/FONT][FONT=&quot](1891; tranlated into motion picture by Roman Polanski as [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Tess)


Two lips

I kissed them in fancy as I came
away in the morning glow;
I kissed them through the glass of her picture-frame:
she did not know.

I kissed them in love, in truth, in laughter,
when she knew all, long so!
That I should kiss them in a shroud thereafter
she did not know.


[/FONT][FONT=&quot]These two quatrains actually remind me of the following haiku:[/FONT]


It cut straight through me
right next to my love's deathbed
I stepped on her comb

Yosa Buson (1716-1783)
 
Another poem by Kavafis, this time from Cavafy.com:

Ithaka

As you set out for Ithaka
hope the voyage is a long one,
full of adventure, full of discovery.
Laistrygonians and Cyclops,
angry Poseidon—don’t be afraid of them:
you’ll never find things like that on your way
as long as you keep your thoughts raised high,
as long as a rare excitement
stirs your spirit and your body.
Laistrygonians and Cyclops,
wild Poseidon—you won’t encounter them
unless you bring them along inside your soul,
unless your soul sets them up in front of you.

Hope the voyage is a long one.
May there be many a summer morning when,
with what pleasure, what joy,
you come into harbors seen for the first time;
may you stop at Phoenician trading stations
to buy fine things,
mother of pearl and coral, amber and ebony,
sensual perfume of every kind—
as many sensual perfumes as you can;
and may you visit many Egyptian cities
to gather stores of knowledge from their scholars.

Keep Ithaka always in your mind.
Arriving there is what you are destined for.
But do not hurry the journey at all.
Better if it lasts for years,
so you are old by the time you reach the island,
wealthy with all you have gained on the way,
not expecting Ithaka to make you rich.

Ithaka gave you the marvelous journey.
Without her you would not have set out.
She has nothing left to give you now.

And if you find her poor, Ithaka won’t have fooled you.
Wise as you will have become, so full of experience,
you will have understood by then what these Ithakas mean.



Translated by Edmund Keeley/Philip Sherrard
 
Excellent! some serious response... I was wondering, perhaps more people could post a favourite poem from their national heritage? Being Dutch, I've translated a few works by poets from the Netherlands, works that might otherwise not be accessible to the community at large. Just a thought.
 
Here is one from my favorite poet. Probably a significantly different style and tone than what most people enjoy/are used to.


a smile to remember

we had goldfish and they circled around and around
in the bowl on the table near the heavy drapes
covering the picture window and
my mother, always smiling, wanting us all
to be happy, told me, "be happy Henry!"
and she was right: it's better to be happy if you
can
but my father continued to beat her and me several times a week while
raging inside his 6-foot-two frame because he couldn't
understand what was attacking him from within.

my mother, poor fish,
wanting to be happy, beaten two or three times a
week, telling me to be happy: "Henry, smile!
why don't you ever smile?"

and then she would smile, to show me how, and it was the
saddest smile I ever saw

one day the goldfish died, all five of them,
they floated on the water, on their sides, their
eyes still open,
and when my father got home he threw them to the cat
there on the kitchen floor and we watched as my mother
smiled

Charles Bukowski
 
Varwnos, posting Cavafy makes you awesome. He wrote about the obscure Hellenistic history that I like. :D

Valiant are you who fought and fell gloriously;
fearless of those who were everywhere victorious.
Blameless, even if Diaeos and Critolaos were at fault.
When the Greeks want to boast,
"Our nation turns out such men" they will say
of you. And thus marvellous will be your praise. --

Written in Alexandria by an Achaean;
in the seventh year of Ptolemy Lathyrus.
 
Varwnos, posting Cavafy makes you awesome. He wrote about the obscure Hellenistic history that I like. :D

True, though his range of subjects covered the whole of Greco-Roman history. Which isn't particular to Kavafis - though it is one of his specialties -, as the following poem shows.


Cleopatra

Alexandria's palaces
were covered with sweet shade.

Pushkin

She had already kissed Anthony's dead lips,
and on her knees before Augustus had poured out her tears...
And the servants betrayed her victorious trumpets blare
under the Roman eagle, and the mist of evening drifts.
Then enters the last captive of her beauty,
tall and grave, and he whispers in embarassment:
"You alike a slave... will be led before him in the triumphs..."
But the swan's neck remains peacefully inclined:

And tomorrow they'll put the children in chains. Oh, how little remains
for her to do on earth - joke a little with this boy
and, as if in a valedictory gesture of compassion,
place the black viper on her dusky breast with an indifferent hand.

February 7, 1940

Anna Akhmatova
 
Sorry for not posting for a week - though I noticed a slight increase in poetic interest with the addition of such threads as Will poetry save us? (it depends) and American poetry sucks (which seems like a generalization without justification) -, I've been less than inspired lately. Here's a work in progress:


The night was green

Poison of our youth
O sweetness
sweetness of youth
sweet bird of truth

And the golden globe
travels round the earth
And a bloodred dawn
appears beneath the morning sky
 
This is poetry:

The Hermit of the Mountain
(By me)

Oh wise hermit of the mount
What know ye of him?
I knew ye of him plenty
But I didn’t really

High atop his mountain home
The hermit wept for his people
Tears are not what he wanted
He knew everything yet he knew nothing

What he said be not what you heard,
but what you felt
No one could fault him,
No one could stand him

For he told the truth
No matter how uncouth
You just had to listen
You just had to cringe

In case ye wonder,
True story this be
No lie I would tell
If so then send me to hell

No high-altitude hobo knows so much
Yet sees so short
Yet smells so bad
And baths so little

Thus be how I knew,
I had to seek his wisdom.
I climbed the slope
And a glimmer of hope…

What know ye of my life I asked the recluse
Your life is forfeit screamed the hermit
Who with a rusty hatchet
Chased me around the mountain

Lock the doors
And hide the whores
This hermit be crazy
But at least he’s not lazy
 
Some more American poetry, two versions on the same subject:


Spinoza

Here in the twilight the translucent hands
of the Jew polish the crystal glass.
The dying afternoon is cold with bands
of sweat. Each day the afternoons all pass
the same. The hands and space of hyacinth
paling in the confines of the ghetto walls
barely exist for the quiet man who stalls.
in there, dreaming up a brilliant labyrinth.
Fame does not trouble him, that reflection
of dreams in the dream of another mirror, nor affection,
the timid love of women. Gone the bars,
he is free from metaphor and myth, to sit
and polish a stubborn lens: the infinite
Map of the One who is all of His stars.



Baruch Spinoza

A haze of gold, the Occident light a spark
in the window. The assiduous manuscript
is waiting, weighed down with the infinite.
someone is building God almost in the dark.
a man engenders God. It is a Jew
with sad eyes and lemon-coloured skin;
time carries him the way a leaf, dropped in
a river, is borne by the waters to
its end. No matter. The magician moved
carves out his God with exquisite geometry;
from his disease. from nothing, he's begun
to construct God, using the word. No one
is granted such prodiguous love as he:
the love that does not hope to be loved.

(translation by Willis Barnstone, futilely corrected by me)




Although it is not named in either poem, the subject is as much the Ethica as Spinoza himself. The author is one of my favourites:


Jorge Francisco Isidoro Luis Borges (24 August 1899 – 14 June 1986) was an Argentine writer born on 24 August 1899 in Buenos Aires, Argentina. He was brought-up bilingual in Spanish and English. In 1914 his family moved to Switzerland where he attended school, then traveled around Spain. On return in 1921, he began his career as a writer with the publication of poems and essays in Surrealism literary journals. He worked as a librarian, spending most of his time at work writing articles and short stories. He suffered political persecution at the hands of the Peron administration and became a public lecturer.
Due to a hereditary condition Borges became blind in his early fifties. In 1955 he was appointed director of the National Public Library (Biblioteca Nacional) and professor of Literature at the University of Buenos Aires. In 1961 he came to international attention when he received the first International Publishers' Prize Prix Formentor, his work was published in the US and in Europe. He died in Geneva, Switzerland, in 1986.
J. M. Coetzee said of Borges: "He more than anyone renovated the language of fiction and thus opened the way to a remarkable generation of Spanish American novelists."


(Quoted from Wikipedia)




 
¿ Qué es poesía ?[FONT=&quot], dices mientras clavas
en mi pupila tu pupila azul;
i Qué es poesía !¿ Y tú me lo preguntas ?
Poesía … eres tú.[/FONT]

That's better.
 
I don't think so; I quoted from the original, which may not be identical to modern day Castilian.
 
I don't think so; I quoted from the original, which may not be identical to modern day Castilian.

There has never been the word pupil and I doubt that Bécquer was that stupid to make a laísmo.
 
Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

¿ Qué es poesía ?[FONT=&quot], dices mientras clavas
en mi pupil tu pupil azul;
i Qué es poesía !¿ Y tú me la preguntas ?
Poesía … eres tú.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]Gustavo Adolfo Bécquer [/FONT] [FONT=&quot](1836-1870)[/FONT]


What is poetry? you say and strike
in my eye your eye azure;
What is poetry! You ask me this?
Poetry... it is you.




You will note that pupila azul does not work when pronounced - always useful when reading poetry. However pupil azul works just as well as eye azure. And I quoted from Becquer's Rimas, 3rd edition, Madrid 1986. Use of laismo/laisme is not a matter of - lack of - intelligence, by the way, if you checked your own link.

And now I'd like to return to topic:




Descartes

I am the only man on earth, but perhaps there is neither earth nor man.
Perhaps a god is deceiving me.
Perhaps a god has sentenced me to time, that lasting illusion.
I dream the moon and I dream my eyes perceiving the moon.
I have dreamed the morning and the evening of the first day.
I have dreamed Carthage and the legions that laid waste to Carthage.
I have dramed Lucan.
I have dreamed the hill of Golgotha and the Roman crosses.
I have dreamed geometry.
I have dreamed point, line, plane, and volume.
I have dreamed yellow, blue and red.
I have dreamed my sickly childhood.
I have dreamed maps and kingdoms, and that grief at dawn.
I have dreamed inconceivable sorrows.
I have dreamed my sword.
I have dreamed Elizabeth of Bohemia.
I have dreamed doubt and certainty.
I have dreamed the whole of yesterday.
Perhaps there was no yesterday, perhaps I was never born.
I may be dreaming of having dreamed.
I feel a twinge of cold, a twinge of fear.
Over the Danube, it is night.
I shall go on dreaming of Descartes and of the faith of his fathers.

[FONT=&quot]Jorge Luis Borges

[/FONT]
(Translation by Alistair Reed; all poems by Borges are taken from the Selected poems, edited by Alexander Coleman, 1999.)


While we have seen this technique before on this thread, giving a similar personal effect (with the subject of eros, a powerful force to the extent of once being a god - as opposed to agape, being affectionate, rather than physical love), Borges uses it here to combine his own experiences with those of Descartes, who posed doubt in the stead of faith.

The dream - or dreaming - is a recurrent theme with Borges, perhaps linked to his growing blindness over the years. (There's a similar treatment of Kafka - whose most famous dream, or nightmare, is in his Die Verwandlung -, which I may quote later.)

I'm not using the original Spanish here, just the translation, because Borges' virtuosity - he also published fantastic stories, for those opposed to poetry - works very well in English translation, even if every rhyme cannot be equalled, the reason always can. I'm not sure if I prefer this one over the two on Spinoza, who was ofcourse inspired by Descartes' Discours sur la méthode. So there's a trinity of sorts here.
 
Top Bottom