ssh08
Pleased
lurker:
maybe siam was friendly/allied with brussels prior it being captured and thats whats causing the bug?
RB3 - Daring Deity with Ottomans
- Thread starter Sullla
- Start date
lurker:
maybe siam was friendly/allied with brussels prior it being captured and thats whats causing the bug?
SevenSpirits
Immortal?
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2007
- Messages
- 512
I'd say so. Just be sure to liberate all of Monty's captured city states.
Liquidated
Goofed Up on Cough Syrup!
Lurker Comment:
Yeah, stick a fork in Civ5 and call it dinner. Well, more quality LoL time!
This SG needed to happen, if only just to chronicle how broken basic gameplay is.
Cheers!
-Liquidated
Yeah, stick a fork in Civ5 and call it dinner. Well, more quality LoL time!
This SG needed to happen, if only just to chronicle how broken basic gameplay is.
Cheers!
-Liquidated
lurker's comment:
for what its worth - the unit list you can access from the main screen (left hand upper corner - then the military icon) actually does activate/center on the unit you click on
TheArchduke
Feeling at home..
Lurker:
You can upgrade a unit in an allied CS territory.
Now I am not sure what happened there though.
Wow. Such helpless AI..
You can upgrade a unit in an allied CS territory.
Now I am not sure what happened there though.
Wow. Such helpless AI..
Sullla
Patrician Roman Dictator
It wasn't just one Siamese rifle at Brussels that turned into infantry though - they ALL did, including about four others that were wandering around in our territory. Perhaps due to the Open Borders bug, somehow the game was interpreting the Siamese units in our territory as being within their own borders (?) The game's coding seems to have a lot of holes in it. It reminds me of Civ5's erratic diplomacy, which some people have attributed to the AI "playing to win", but which looks to me to be another tactic known as "bad programming."
lurker's comment:
Well, not entirely. Remove insta-heal, nerf horses. Done.
Lurker Comment:
As long as this statement is close to true, there's a lot of balance that still needs to come
Well, not entirely. Remove insta-heal, nerf horses. Done.
Alright, time to end this lousy war. And uh, start another one.
To begin with, I wanted to do something with that massive 6000 gold we were sitting on. I noticed that MLP was in 2nd place to produce a great scientists, after Byzantium which was almost done. So I purchased a public school in MLP and added another scientist there; hopefully it will finish before the game ends. I also purchased a factory and windmill in Istanbul, which speeded up Big Ben to only 12 turns.
Well... I still had a bunch of gold so, what to do with it? More units wouldn't really help against the Aztecs, and I wasn't quite ready to go to war with Siam yet. However, Egypt looked like an easy foe. To that end, I decided to purchase 2 more artillery, and send them down to attack Egypt.
Turn 1: I got a little over ambitious in attacking Monty, and he counterattacked. He almost killed a rifle! It survived though.
Meanwhile this stupid French musketeer won't get out of the way. He stayed there throughout all my turns, blocking up the road system. Have I mentioned lately how much I dislike 1UPT?
We spawn another great general, and since we don't really need 4 great generals, I use this one to start a golden age. We're now getting 700 gpt LOL, and Big Ben is due in just 8 turns.
Turn 2:Again I get lucky and survive a counterattack from Monty without losing any units. I should really be more careful there, but I just want to hurry. I sold our excess luxuries to Siam for 700g, who says that our military is "the laughing stock of the world". Really? More than Greece's hoplites? Well I guess those are still holding him off somehow. Meanwhile I liberate Helsinki.
Turn 3:Replacable parts finishes and I begin biology. I bombard Tlatetelolco but can't quite take it. Armies are en route to attack Egypt.
Turn 4: Monty tries to defend by rushing walls in cities in whatever cities I attack, but it doesn't matter. Tlatetelolco and Tlaxcala both fall this turn. I upgrade some of our rifles to infantry.
Turn 5: We're still rolling in gold, so I send 500g to Vienna, which allies with us. This gives us a solid line of allied cities on the other side of Siam. Later I also allied Genoa, to complete the line.
Ramesses won't give me anythign when I demand gold from him, so it's time for war! Here's what I declared war on him with. It's not much, but it's easily enough to defeat his army of muskets and war chariots. How is a deity AI still using war chariots at this point in the game? That's just not right.
Turn 6: despite Napoleon's interference in the worst possible place, I capture Texcoco, and advance towards both Cape Town and the capital of Tenochtitlan. Monty still refuses to give anything but an even peace.
Since I had no respect for Montezuma at all, I went on settling new cities right next to him while the war continued
Turn 7: Finally my luck runs out, and I lost a cavalry to one of Montezuma's knights. I noticed that some knights were getting a bonus against mounted- I'm not sure why. Anyway I press on, liberating cape town, and conquering both Tenochtitlan and one more Aztec city. Heliopolis also fell this turn.
After that I made peace, getting nothing but a resource for gold trade.
turn 8: Funniest AI message yet- Monty warns us not to settle any more cities near him! Yeah right. Meanwhile Big Ben and electricity finish. The golden age also ends. However, we can now rush buy a coloseum for only 510 gold, less than we make in one turn. I used our 2 great scientists to bulb telegraph and electronics (for mechanized infantry) while starting on the Taj mahal and railroad.
Turn 9: I liberate Kuala Limpur from Egypt. Our Sipahi gets stuck after taking the city, but for some reason Egypt ignores it and futily counterattacks the city instead. I upgraded most of our infantry into mechanized infantry. People were unhappy, and every city already had a coloseum (I bought a lot of coloseums during these turns) so I had to buy a theather somewhere, instead. Kind of ridiculous that it really doesn't matter where you buy these things.
Turn 10: We get a new great scientist. Time to finish off the Egyptians- look at how powerful mechanized infantry are!
4 move, and strong enough to take a city in one blow! That's... probably not the way it's supposed to be. They can do that to Thebes too but I couldn't quite reach it this turn. So...
Turn 11: Railroad finishes, and I take Thebes. That's all I did on this turn, most of the units haven't moved yet. Oh, except for one other thing.
I realized we've been neglecting an important part of our economy! We haven't made use of our UA at all! Time to pick up some of that massive barbarian galley loot.
With this many cities, the late game just flies by (meaning very few turns to do anything. The turns themselves take forever to play. Maybe 30 minutes/turn). We're researching most techs in just 3 turns, buying whatever we need anywhere. Our army went from rifles to infantry to mechanized infantry just in the last 10 turns. The era of infantry lasted just 5 turns- is that really how the game is supposed to work?
I leave it to alpaca to finish off the game. My guess is that you'll be able to win it in about 10 turns. We have Siam completely surrounded with our units west and south, our city state allies on the east, and Greece to the north. Somehow, miraculously, Greece still has its capital, so we might have to take that too.
To begin with, I wanted to do something with that massive 6000 gold we were sitting on. I noticed that MLP was in 2nd place to produce a great scientists, after Byzantium which was almost done. So I purchased a public school in MLP and added another scientist there; hopefully it will finish before the game ends. I also purchased a factory and windmill in Istanbul, which speeded up Big Ben to only 12 turns.
Well... I still had a bunch of gold so, what to do with it? More units wouldn't really help against the Aztecs, and I wasn't quite ready to go to war with Siam yet. However, Egypt looked like an easy foe. To that end, I decided to purchase 2 more artillery, and send them down to attack Egypt.
Turn 1: I got a little over ambitious in attacking Monty, and he counterattacked. He almost killed a rifle! It survived though.
Meanwhile this stupid French musketeer won't get out of the way. He stayed there throughout all my turns, blocking up the road system. Have I mentioned lately how much I dislike 1UPT?
We spawn another great general, and since we don't really need 4 great generals, I use this one to start a golden age. We're now getting 700 gpt LOL, and Big Ben is due in just 8 turns.
Turn 2:Again I get lucky and survive a counterattack from Monty without losing any units. I should really be more careful there, but I just want to hurry. I sold our excess luxuries to Siam for 700g, who says that our military is "the laughing stock of the world". Really? More than Greece's hoplites? Well I guess those are still holding him off somehow. Meanwhile I liberate Helsinki.
Turn 3:Replacable parts finishes and I begin biology. I bombard Tlatetelolco but can't quite take it. Armies are en route to attack Egypt.
Turn 4: Monty tries to defend by rushing walls in cities in whatever cities I attack, but it doesn't matter. Tlatetelolco and Tlaxcala both fall this turn. I upgrade some of our rifles to infantry.
Turn 5: We're still rolling in gold, so I send 500g to Vienna, which allies with us. This gives us a solid line of allied cities on the other side of Siam. Later I also allied Genoa, to complete the line.
Ramesses won't give me anythign when I demand gold from him, so it's time for war! Here's what I declared war on him with. It's not much, but it's easily enough to defeat his army of muskets and war chariots. How is a deity AI still using war chariots at this point in the game? That's just not right.
Turn 6: despite Napoleon's interference in the worst possible place, I capture Texcoco, and advance towards both Cape Town and the capital of Tenochtitlan. Monty still refuses to give anything but an even peace.
Since I had no respect for Montezuma at all, I went on settling new cities right next to him while the war continued
Turn 7: Finally my luck runs out, and I lost a cavalry to one of Montezuma's knights. I noticed that some knights were getting a bonus against mounted- I'm not sure why. Anyway I press on, liberating cape town, and conquering both Tenochtitlan and one more Aztec city. Heliopolis also fell this turn.
After that I made peace, getting nothing but a resource for gold trade.
turn 8: Funniest AI message yet- Monty warns us not to settle any more cities near him! Yeah right. Meanwhile Big Ben and electricity finish. The golden age also ends. However, we can now rush buy a coloseum for only 510 gold, less than we make in one turn. I used our 2 great scientists to bulb telegraph and electronics (for mechanized infantry) while starting on the Taj mahal and railroad.
Turn 9: I liberate Kuala Limpur from Egypt. Our Sipahi gets stuck after taking the city, but for some reason Egypt ignores it and futily counterattacks the city instead. I upgraded most of our infantry into mechanized infantry. People were unhappy, and every city already had a coloseum (I bought a lot of coloseums during these turns) so I had to buy a theather somewhere, instead. Kind of ridiculous that it really doesn't matter where you buy these things.
Turn 10: We get a new great scientist. Time to finish off the Egyptians- look at how powerful mechanized infantry are!
4 move, and strong enough to take a city in one blow! That's... probably not the way it's supposed to be. They can do that to Thebes too but I couldn't quite reach it this turn. So...
Turn 11: Railroad finishes, and I take Thebes. That's all I did on this turn, most of the units haven't moved yet. Oh, except for one other thing.
I realized we've been neglecting an important part of our economy! We haven't made use of our UA at all! Time to pick up some of that massive barbarian galley loot.
Spoiler :
With this many cities, the late game just flies by (meaning very few turns to do anything. The turns themselves take forever to play. Maybe 30 minutes/turn). We're researching most techs in just 3 turns, buying whatever we need anywhere. Our army went from rifles to infantry to mechanized infantry just in the last 10 turns. The era of infantry lasted just 5 turns- is that really how the game is supposed to work?
I leave it to alpaca to finish off the game. My guess is that you'll be able to win it in about 10 turns. We have Siam completely surrounded with our units west and south, our city state allies on the east, and Greece to the north. Somehow, miraculously, Greece still has its capital, so we might have to take that too.
lurker:
With the ammount of gold you are making I would just purchase a Mech Inf. or two in the north and send them by sea to Athens while you march towards Siams capital. Looking at the minimap I see you haven't scouted there yet, but the capital is bound to be either by the sea or close to it, and Mech Infs should make short work of it. Doing this should save you several turns, but more importantly it will save you the drudgery of attacking your way by land.
With the ammount of gold you are making I would just purchase a Mech Inf. or two in the north and send them by sea to Athens while you march towards Siams capital. Looking at the minimap I see you haven't scouted there yet, but the capital is bound to be either by the sea or close to it, and Mech Infs should make short work of it. Doing this should save you several turns, but more importantly it will save you the drudgery of attacking your way by land.
The late game units really show the weakness of the AI (even more so than horsemen, if that were possible). It can barely even handle the possibilites of 2-move units, so of course it has no hope at dealing with units that can move 4 or attack at range 3, and crack cities in one turn.
Attacking Athens by sea is a good idea. I'm kind of curious to see if Siam will ever take it for us, though.
Attacking Athens by sea is a good idea. I'm kind of curious to see if Siam will ever take it for us, though.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,617
lurker's comment:
Thanks for a interesting read.
Hopefully they can get there act together with the expansions. As of right now I have more interest in going back and playing Civ4!
I feel the best aspect of 4 vs. 3 was getting rid of building costs and not having to look at each city and decide if building something would justify the expense. I can't believe 5 brought that HORRID feature back and added roads to the list. I've always been a big fan of road everywhere, since you never know when you could need it.
Reading the traffic jam comments about the French unit really show the stupidity of roads costing money.
Here is hoping somebody comes up a great mod to make the game intresting.
I can't recall the mod name, but my Civ3 days were greatly extended with the mod that added a lot more buildings and terrain.
Thanks for a interesting read.
Hopefully they can get there act together with the expansions. As of right now I have more interest in going back and playing Civ4!
I feel the best aspect of 4 vs. 3 was getting rid of building costs and not having to look at each city and decide if building something would justify the expense. I can't believe 5 brought that HORRID feature back and added roads to the list. I've always been a big fan of road everywhere, since you never know when you could need it.
Reading the traffic jam comments about the French unit really show the stupidity of roads costing money.
Here is hoping somebody comes up a great mod to make the game intresting.
I can't recall the mod name, but my Civ3 days were greatly extended with the mod that added a lot more buildings and terrain.
Lurker:
Probably Rise and Rule.
Probably Rise and Rule.
anti_strunt
Warlord
- Joined
- May 27, 2005
- Messages
- 180
Lurker's Lament
I'm going to be so sad when this is over (which looks to be pretty soon)... This is the most fun I've had with Civ 5, heck, on the Internet, in weeks!
I'm going to be so sad when this is over (which looks to be pretty soon)... This is the most fun I've had with Civ 5, heck, on the Internet, in weeks!
ssh08
Pleased
part of it is how terrible the tech tree is, and how its basically a straight line through to most techs
Lurker babbling:
Your DoW on Monte was your first in the game -- all previous had been declared on you. I would have thought that given both your lead and that unprovoked aggression, a Deity AI would have had all 5 civs instantly ally and/or DoW against you, regardless of any previous mutual antagonisms. They certainly had no hesitation DoW on you in the early game. Perhaps the AI's algorithm for determining actual military power is wacked, as seen by Siam's nonsensical insult.
Not that it would have mattered much, but at least you'd have had a tiny challenge instead of boringly crushing one at a time.
Your DoW on Monte was your first in the game -- all previous had been declared on you. I would have thought that given both your lead and that unprovoked aggression, a Deity AI would have had all 5 civs instantly ally and/or DoW against you, regardless of any previous mutual antagonisms. They certainly had no hesitation DoW on you in the early game. Perhaps the AI's algorithm for determining actual military power is wacked, as seen by Siam's nonsensical insult.
Not that it would have mattered much, but at least you'd have had a tiny challenge instead of boringly crushing one at a time.
javaja
Chieftain
Lurker
When you liberate a city state, the unit that capped the city gets shifted to an adjacent tile, does not occupy the city (because you can't share tiles, even with allies.)
And yes, you can upgrade units in any "friendly territory" including allied city states, and anyone you have open borders with. So neither of those specific issues were bugs.
<snip> I misread which city state bugged / didn't ally.
When you liberate a city state, the unit that capped the city gets shifted to an adjacent tile, does not occupy the city (because you can't share tiles, even with allies.)
And yes, you can upgrade units in any "friendly territory" including allied city states, and anyone you have open borders with. So neither of those specific issues were bugs.
<snip> I misread which city state bugged / didn't ally.
Mojoqmeyvam
Warlord
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2009
- Messages
- 129
Lurker:
Roads costing maintenance is really silly. If they're going to keep roads as a costing-something improvement, then it should cost a flat fee, not gpt. Really, it should cost nothing, but maintenance is simply absurd.
Roads costing maintenance is really silly. If they're going to keep roads as a costing-something improvement, then it should cost a flat fee, not gpt. Really, it should cost nothing, but maintenance is simply absurd.
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