CFC Fantasy Baseball Keeper League 2014!

It seems there is some interest in a keeper league for this year's CFC Fantasy Baseball owners. So, here is the thread for it!

Note: not to be confused with the "official" CFC Fantasy league, which is a redraft league, which will still also be happening with our steady handed commissioner El J at the helm. I will be commish'ing this if we can get it rolling.

The League:

- Keep 5 MLB players
- Keep unlimited rookies/prospects. Anyone can be drafted (even if not in Yahoo yet).
- When a player is drafted, their draft round becomes their keeper value. Keeper Values increase by 4 each season. To keep a player you lose the keeper value corresponding to that draft round. For instance if I draft Mike Trout in round 16, to keep him the following year, I lose draft pick 12.
- Lowest keeper value is a (2). This means you can keep 2 (2)'s, 1 (3), 1 (4), etc., but you lose corresponding draft picks;
- No minimum keepers. Any (2)'s kept eat up first and second round draft picks, in that order;
- Waivers and FA's slot in 12-17 by o-rank;
- Anyone with a value of 7 or below keeps their keeper value when dropped during the season; if numbered over 7 they lose their keeper number;
- Rookies/prospects that are dropped lose their "keep unlimited" status if dropped during or after their rookie MLB season. Trading preserves their status;
- No moves cap;
- CFC league stats;
C,1B,2B,3B,SS,CI,MI,OF X 4, UTIL, SP x 4, RP x2, P x 5. (12 hitters, 11 pitchers, 6 or 7 bench depending on Yahoo restrictions, 1 DL spot;
- No mid-season draft pick trades; you must keep a player to trade them in the offseason.
- rookies are determined by MLB rookie status
- offline draft

Record keeping (keeper lists, rookie lists, etc.) will be handled by me each year.

Currently interested/probably in:
El Justo
illram
Oneyahawk
KMRBlue
Sanabas
Backwards Logic

CFC regulars who I will shame into playing:
Backwards Logic
dgfred
Darkness
classical_hero
Lambert Simnel
pacesplace
Owen Glyndwr

Let's do this....

Deep, auction, sensible system and I'm in.

i'm in.

Let's do this. Time for last place!

Tentatively in, based on what the ending roster sizes are, stats used, keeper restrictions, and how you can keep players. I'd like to see the same stats used as the CFC league - it's the most balanced setup I've ever played and works well without it being overwhelming.

For discussion's sake, I'm not against auction leagues, though I prefer snake style. That said this being a keeper league, auction based leagues work way better than snake style. As far as number of keepers go, I'm in two minds personally: keep a ton of players (more dynasty than keeper if you want to be technical about it), or keep very few players (ie, build a core of 4-5 players max). Keeping 7/8/9/10 players makes it too easy to keep everyone valuable, though a dynasty league would allow for teams doing 'crappy' to punt their valuable veterans and load up on younger talent for next year and beyond. Keeping four or five players forces some pretty tough decisions come end of the year.

I don't care on number of teams, so long as they are all active. That said, while I don't mean to point fingers already, but sanabas you do have a nasty tendency to join the CFC league and then go completely inactive in it. Are you going to commit to this league, or are you going to just take up a roster spot from someone who will be active? I'm not trying to be a pain here, I'm just looking out for the league as a whole, that's all. The roster size should be deep based on the number of teams, and I do like a deep bench. Discuss!

Can we actually go full Roto scoring this year instead of head to head?

Backwards Logic said:

That said, while I don't mean to point fingers already, but sanabas you do have a nasty tendency to join the CFC league and then go completely inactive in it. Are you going to commit to this league, or are you going to just take up a roster spot from someone who will be active? I'm not trying to be a pain here, I'm just looking out for the league as a whole, that's all.

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What? Since you've joined CFC I have been a part of 1 hockey and 2 baseball leagues, and finished 2nd, 3rd & mid-table. None of them were abandoned teams.

Not trying to be a pain here, but if you join, are you going to pay attention to your own team, or are you just going to make up crap about other players?

B_L has an excellent track record, one the best fantasy managers here imo. i don't think there's anything to worry about with him.

sanabas said:

What? Since you've joined CFC I have been a part of 1 hockey and 2 baseball leagues, and finished 2nd, 3rd & mid-table. None of them were abandoned teams.

Not trying to be a pain here, but if you join, are you going to pay attention to your own team, or are you just going to make up crap about other players?

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So, I pulled up this gem from 2012 which illustrates my point:

It must be rocket science, that's why I'm good at it.

I don't remember if I bothered to play last year.

I would love to have a proper keeper league. I would actually pay attention in that case.

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Bolding mine. You also last played in 2010, where your team made a whopping 7 transactions, none of which occurring after May 16th. While I can't check it due to Yahoo's archiving system, I believe you kept the same lineup from May onwards also. When it comes to players dropping out and hurting the league, I have a pretty good memory of who the offenders are. Because, you know, I pay attention. When I get invites to a league, I'm going to look out for the whole of the league, because there's nothing worse than inactive owners, especially in a keeper league. This needed addressing.

But I'm willing to let it drop if you can say with 100% honesty you're going to stick around in this league, even if your team starts sucking. My team sucked in the first half last year, yet I managed to get it back to third place by the end, so yea, I've been there.

Riiight. Because I don't make many moves, my team must be abandoned. And even assuming your pretty bad memory got this one right, a sample size of one equals a nasty tendency. Teams that have been abandoned for 4 months typically don't miss the playoffs by just 3 games, nor do those unchanged lineups beat the #1 team 10-6 late in the season, nor win their consolation playoff match 13-2. Team may have sucked enough to miss playoffs, but it clearly wasn't abandoned. I've certainly never been heavily invested in a non-keeper league, once the draft is done I will be less interested. But there's a big difference between checking in once a week to set rosters & make moves if needed, and leaving in a dead lineup for 4 months.


You are, quite simply, making crap up.

i don't think he's making stuff up. he's been in our league a long time and is respected. and fwiw, i remember that post as well due to the snarky-ness of it. it's water under the bridge though. so please join if you're genuinely interested and are ready to commit yourself. we won't question it going forward. however, the issue B_L raised is completely valid and needs to be thoughtfully considered.

Sans is a very active owner in the other league I am in with him. I remember sans being in one or two of our prior leagues and I do not remember him quitting. I think he was the crappycat islanders. In any case today is a new day.

Still fleshing out keeper ideas. I will post some concrete ideas for discussion later tonight or tomorrow.

illram said:

Sans is a very active owner in the other league I am in with him. I remember sans being in one or two of our prior leagues and I do not remember him quitting. I think he was the crappycat islanders. In any case today is a new day.

Still fleshing out keeper ideas. I will post some concrete ideas for discussion later tonight or tomorrow.

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His trash talk fits in well.

For what it may be worth, Y! is doing the things that prelude opening the new season.

J

El Justo said:

i don't think he's making stuff up. he's been in our league a long time and is respected. and fwiw, i remember that post as well due to the snarky-ness of it. it's water under the bridge though. so please join if you're genuinely interested and are ready to commit yourself. we won't question it going forward. however, the issue B_L raised is completely valid and needs to be thoughtfully considered.

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Accusing me of occasional snarkiness, that I have no issues with. Because it's true, and that post is probably the best example.

Trash talk I have no problems being on the receiving end of, helps keep things interesting if it is entertaining trash.

'You shouldn't be part of this league because I expect you'll quit', backed up with lies as evidence, that I do have an issue with. Particularly when it convinces other owners, as it appears to have convinced you. Valid concern my butt.

B_L should not be in this league, because I have it on good authority that he kicks puppies. This equally valid concern should be addressed, I don't want him quitting on a long-term league the way Mike Puppykicker Vick quit on the NFL.

i tend to agree with B_L. sorry. i've been doing this a while and i remember that post by you and -poof- you were gone. anyhow, maybe it's time to drop it. ya know ?

Again, riiiiight. I post, in January, 2 months before the league even starts, and essentially say (somewhat snarkily, true) "I'm interested if it's a keeper league." It turns out to not be a keeper league, so I stop reading the thread. At least until I discover you assumed I was playing for unknown reasons, and post:

sanabas said:

The 14th missing person would appear to be me, seeing as how I haven't signed up at yahoo, haven't sent people emails in order to find out the league id in order to go and sign up, and am not particularly interested if it's not a keeper and/or auction league.

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I didn't join a league I wasn't interested in playing, and that qualifies as abandonment? Backwards logic indeed. But good entertainment, anyway.

The biggest problem I see is with the term 'drop it'. Both past and present.

whatever, man. just don't carry on like a tool all season long; that is, if you decide to join.

sanabas said:

'You shouldn't be part of this league because I expect you'll quit', backed up with lies as evidence, that I do have an issue with. Particularly when it convinces other owners, as it appears to have convinced you. Valid concern my butt.

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Never said that, but whatever floats your boat. You played in a league where you stopped making transactions, and I'm pretty sure your lineup stayed inactive as well. All I asked is if you were going to stick around this time.

B_L should not be in this league, because I have it on good authority that he kicks puppies. This equally valid concern should be addressed, I don't want him quitting on a long-term league the way Mike Puppykicker Vick quit on the NFL.

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I expect this kind of behavior in OT, but certainly not from a CFC staffer. I didn't expect you'd dip this low to make a point.

Look, at the end of the day my concerns were based on this: you joined the league in 2010, made a ton of noise before the season started about stat setup and formatting, then after the middle of May went silent in yahoo and in the forum thread as well. Yes, your team ended up in eighth, but back then the stats allowed for inactive teams to still score points. That got changed after the season. I'll go back to my earlier olive branch of if you say you're going to stick around this time, I'll take it at face value and move on. However, if you're going to act like a petulant child this whole season, I'll grant your wish and not join. Rather simple.

El Justo said:

whatever, man. just don't carry on like a tool all season long; that is, if you decide to join.

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Doesn't a tool get used?

San can be annoying, but he knows fantasy baseball. In the league illram referred to, he has won once and played in the finals last year, losing a nailbiter.

For the record, I much prefer some form of team continuity. I think it lends to a stronger core of players. Redraft leagues are too easy to ditch.

BTW My inclusion is predicated on a slow draft.

J