AMAZON Diplomacy Discussion

Yeah I still can't believe they built it on there home island.
 
I wouldn't give up the barbarian city until we know precisely the locations of their other cities. They've said that they were unable to make a strong push towards Merlot, so I wonder how much land is left on Anjendia to divide up.
 
This is strange since I thought they had more cities then us as it was. They can't all be on thier home island.
 
I wouldn't give up the barbarian city until we know precisely the locations of their other cities. They've said that they were unable to make a strong push towards Merlot, so I wonder how much land is left on Anjendia to divide up.

This is a good point that I overlooked: They have already begun settling based on our previous agreement. Granted, I thought giving them the barb city was a bit 'out there', but I also thought we'd have the advantage in a crowded settling area from the Creative trait.

One other option would be to suggest they raze Carib. This would waste hammers, but would remove the diplomatic issue of whose hammers were being wasted, eliminate the problem of it's barbs for the Amazon, and give us a clean map on which to divide up settling. But maybe that's as :smoke: as giving them the city.

This is strange since I thought they had more cities then us as it was. They can't all be on thier home island.

Amazon has 5 cities:

Spoiler :
Civ4ScreenShot0226.jpg


If only one is Anjenida/whatever, it's possible the other 4 are on their island. We could certainly have settled 4 on our home island. If that's the case, I'm not sure why they didn't use them on more contested territory.
 
If only one is Anjenida/whatever, it's possible the other 4 are on their island. We could certainly have settled 4 on our home island. If that's the case, I'm not sure why they didn't use them on more contested territory.

They basically claim that Marathon isn't safe to settle because of Merlot.

From my reading of their email, they only have 1 city on Anjennida near the horses, and plan to settle one more soon to the south. I don't think that's likely to conflict with anything we plan.
 
I know Irgy has limited internet access at the moment, so I'm posting this message from Amazon for him:

To all of our Friends in the Mighty ETTT Alliance:

We Zenobians hope that our allies are prospering, and we wish to share some important news.



First, our spies have confirmed, that Merlot has indeed made contact with Mavericks. We are not sure when this unfortunate event occurred, but we discovered it at the beginning of this very Year of Our Lady 800.



With this unhappy, albeit inevitable turn of events, a new M&M alliance is no-doubt soon to form. Although we were enjoying the advantage that our enlightened ETTT had been providing, we also relish the opportunity to feast upon the sweet candy-coated hides of our enemies, like so many delightful chocolate confections.

Towards this end, we would like to respond specifically to our friends in the Continuum regarding the recent hostilities with Merlot. While we would prefer that all of our friends remain united in open opposition to the evil Merlot, we can certainly appreciate the logistical difficulties with a restricted turn timer. Therefore, if you wish to press the King of Merlot for peace with his Kingdom, we would bear no grudge against you for that. As is said in our land, “I ain’t mad at cha.” Although, we are curious whether Merlot has actually offered peace, because we were suspecting that this war with Merlot would be a permanent state of affairs, having serious doubts tat the proud Merlot King would ever seek peace with the ETTT.



Additionally, our scout Marian has located Merlot’s copper source, on Marthaton, which they are currently attempting to mine, as well as the city nearby, called “The circus.” At this very moment, we have Pyrgomache, armed with large, broadly bladed weapons en-route to this city. Finally, since the evil, drunken Merlot warriors were the aggressors, we anticipate that their people will become weary with the war, while the Zenobians remain resolute in their righteous quest to avenge the murder of our beloved scout Dora the Explorer… May she rest in peace. Consequently, we will not be seeking any cease fire, or peace treaty with Merlot at this time.



We can confirm that the peninsulas are quite similar, if not identical. On the peninsula with plains at the tip we have discovered copper, incense and cow. On the desert peninsula, between us and the Sirius, we have found ivory, horse, bananas and marble. We have not located any stone yet.

We still have not seen any Maverick or Merlot boats near our waters, but with recent developments, they may prefer to just turn around rather than risk being sunk.

Last, we can confirm that we are pursuing Construction, however, we are in the midst of political and religious upheaval as we have thrown out the Barbarous, Pagan government and replaced them with a strong Bureaucratic government that will keep our Religion Organized. As Christianity was recently discovered in our lands, we have also declared Christianity to be our official State Religion. However, we still believe in a degree of religious freedom, and welcome your Missionaries to our lands. We hope that you will welcome ours as well. News of the Continuum’s mysterious Stonehenge has already resulted in some of our people adopting the Buddhist faith, and we hope this trend of religious diversity continues in the lands of The AMAZON.


Be Well,

Sommerswerd, Zenobian Captain
 
Finally, since the evil, drunken Merlot warriors were the aggressors, we anticipate that their people will become weary with the war
I don't know, is this poetry or ignorance, in C4 (unlike C3) ww has nothing to do with who is agressor. Imo you get it for lost in foreign land.

the last part is also poetry, they 've Christianity but hope for Budd, what is the the remark about SH?
 
I think in regards to WW I think they mean the players will regret starting this war.

As for wanting buddism I think they want temples and monastaries. For Happy cap and increase in Research.
 
Latest version, hoping to send this today. I was intending to respond to comments and Amazon's recent communication, but neither required many changes. So the biggest change is just me taking a whole lot of the whine out of the Carib section.

There's still some disagreement in the team about what to do with Carib, but I think it's reasonable to say that unless and until we're sure we want to give it to them we should at least passively continue on with our claim to it.

Hello again


Carib

We agree that barbarian cities are worth letting each other know about as soon as possible, were simply slower in getting our message out. We respect that you did indeed ask our opinion before capturing it, I apologise if our response was a little defensive but we wanted to be clear on the matter.

It is good to hear it is filled with only warriors. With the technology for macemen we may then even be able to take this city with a single unit.


Anjennida

While we are certainly willing to consider suggestions such as the one you have made for the settling line, we are not happy with the proposed distribution of land. We place very little value in the desert tip in particular, and while we agree that we can do more with working the seas we hardly consider desert and coastline to be a fair trade for the jungled grasslands in the south. By my count this deal would leave twice as much of the grassland in your territory as ours, and while we agree there are things to compensate for that it still seems like a poor deal. Also, the horses cannot be shared as resources until the discovery of Astronomy, leaving us with limited military options in the meantime.

Another (less important but worth pointing out) weakness of the above division is that for all that it shortens the cultural border on Anjennida, it also creates a new cultural border across the very narrow channel between Anjennida and Bode. We have an excellent city location planned on the coast Bode which would include at least one tile of Anjennida in its BFC, so if that area of Anjennida is part of your land then a new cultural conflict is created across the channel

However, the idea of dividing the land in a way other than vertically is appealing. We would consider options with a different dividing line than the one proposed.

Personally however I still think the best way to tackle this problem is to create a sensible dot-map, and assign cities in a fair way. We would happily make a proposal using such a method ourselves but we still don't know the exact locations of your existing cities, which we would obviously need to account for. The discovery of Paper for drawing maps soon may make this process somewhat easier, but it may be worthwhile resolving it before then.


Religion

We will endeavor to spread Confucianism to your cities as soon as is practical. We also congratulate you on founding Christianity.
 
Sorry - I didn't comment on this earlier, but this looks fine to me. I think waiting for Paper to dotmap makes sense. We should have it before we are ready to send settlers to Anjennida in any event.

The idea of sending a maceman or two to capture it soon sounds like a good one.
 
I was planning on sending something like this to the ETTA:

Fellow ETTA members,

We have completed our research of Paper, and have distributed it to the ETTA. We think it would be the best use of our research capabilities if we work on Astronomy as soon as Optics is available. We will need to accumulate some gold to do so, and are planning to put minimal beakers into Philosophy while we wait for Optics.

We would like to know if the rest of the ETTA agrees with this course of action, and what the others were planning to research.

Regards,

Trystero, Team Sirius diplomat

Edit: updated to reflect having finished Paper.

Edit2: updated again since Quatronia has finished Optics.
 
Ok, I've made something of a dotmap of Anjennida. It's a quite tricky dotmap to make really, so I'm quite happy with the end result.

It's probably actually a slightly better deal for Amazon, but it's a lot better than their previous proposal. I can't see how to make a better layout really.

What it comes down to, is that we want most cities to be coastal, but there's going to be some tiles left in the centre as a result. I've then given the central city to Amazon, which is why it's a bit better for them. If I gave it to us, it would be a lot better for us. In exchange for that central city, we claim the whales at the top.

Anyway, judge for yourselves whether we're happy with this proposal or not.
attachment.php
 

Attachments

  • Anjennida Dotmap.jpg
    Anjennida Dotmap.jpg
    151.7 KB · Views: 146
That seems fair deal to me Irgy.

EDIT: This plan may help us in the Domination struggle for land, if we can make sure to get some extra culture to claim those greyed out land.
 
I think that looks like a very fair proposal. The cities are packed a bit closer than I'm used to, but I'm learning that overlap isn't always a bad thing.
 
Ok, well if people are happy with it I'll send it off as a proposal this afternoon. That was easier than I thought, have to see if Amazon agree with it as easily though. I'm sure they'll complain about something. Maybe I should build in a concession to make so they feel like they're winning the negotiations, but I can't think of any good candidates.
 
Do we want to send a message to Amazon to let them know we will have Carib taken in about 3 turns?
 
Back
Top Bottom