Phrederick
Warlord
One idea I heard a while back, which I liked, was using a siege unit for the medic 3. He can still bombard with no problem, and it's doubtful that he'll ever do much defense.
The Emperor Masters' Challenge 2 (on Warlords)
- Thread starter aelf
- Start date
aelf
Ashen One
Thanks for your input, guys. But you still haven't come to a consensus on how to use the GG 
Well, you still have time to discuss because this round ended just as we got our first GG.
I had a hard time playing today. My mouse is not working very well. I can't click or drag things properly
And there is a bug in Warlords that causes my mouse to hang, forcing me to reboot. I'm pretty sure it's due to Warlords because this isn't the first time and it never happened when I'm not playing.
Nevertheless, I managed to play a rather long round. It did consume all of the time I have tonight, though. I'll try to post the update tonight. But if I can't finish it I'll post tomorrow.
Well, you still have time to discuss because this round ended just as we got our first GG.I had a hard time playing today. My mouse is not working very well. I can't click or drag things properly
And there is a bug in Warlords that causes my mouse to hang, forcing me to reboot. I'm pretty sure it's due to Warlords because this isn't the first time and it never happened when I'm not playing.Nevertheless, I managed to play a rather long round. It did consume all of the time I have tonight, though. I'll try to post the update tonight. But if I can't finish it I'll post tomorrow.
the lack of consensus is obvious so you really need to boil it down to a couple of simple choices:
1. use up the warlord on a chariot or another unit with atleast some exp, in order to push them to level 5 so you can build the heroic epic
**this decision would have to be based on your highest exp unit at the moment and how much more exp it would take to get it to level 5**
-short term immediate benefit, if you can keep the unit alive you might have an easier time getting a 2nd general.. but all units die eventually-
2. burn up the general on a military academy giving you a permanant 25% boost to production
*personal experience indicates to me that this is mediocre and often unnessessary*
3. settle the general in the city that will later have the heroic epic, in order to add exp to every unit built after that
*consider this well.. if you take this option the best option for all other generals would be to add them to this specific city*
long term is where this really shines. if you get 3 generals and settle them in the same spot, with theo and barracks you have units that start with 11 exp. city raider 3 macemen anyone?? (any 3 promotions is great on offense or defence, siege etc but would only be coming from that one city.. still good though)
of cource in the unlikely event you have a coastal city with great production your naval units would also benefit from the settled generals.
since we cant settle the decision is yours aelf. consider it carefully before proceding
NaZ
1. use up the warlord on a chariot or another unit with atleast some exp, in order to push them to level 5 so you can build the heroic epic
**this decision would have to be based on your highest exp unit at the moment and how much more exp it would take to get it to level 5**
-short term immediate benefit, if you can keep the unit alive you might have an easier time getting a 2nd general.. but all units die eventually-
2. burn up the general on a military academy giving you a permanant 25% boost to production
*personal experience indicates to me that this is mediocre and often unnessessary*
3. settle the general in the city that will later have the heroic epic, in order to add exp to every unit built after that
*consider this well.. if you take this option the best option for all other generals would be to add them to this specific city*
long term is where this really shines. if you get 3 generals and settle them in the same spot, with theo and barracks you have units that start with 11 exp. city raider 3 macemen anyone?? (any 3 promotions is great on offense or defence, siege etc but would only be coming from that one city.. still good though)
of cource in the unlikely event you have a coastal city with great production your naval units would also benefit from the settled generals.
since we cant settle the decision is yours aelf. consider it carefully before proceding
NaZ
Phrederick
Warlord
I really don't understand the idea behind using the GG to get the heroic epic. When it wasn't an option in vanilla civ, how often were you unable to build it when you wanted to begin building it? That rarely happened for me, although although I rarely went for an early HE. I often get 20/26 through 26/26 experience on my macemen, which is around when I begin the HE.
If you have a 14/17 unit, you're only three battles away from being able to build it. If it's a city raider unit, use it on the last defender. Usually that's the result of losing at least one battle, so it'll be against a weakened unit anyway. You might have to delay the next siege for him to heal up, but that's a smaller opportunity cost than using the GG on a sub-optimal option.
If you want to get a Medic 3 unit (that's going to be where my first GG goes when I get Warlords, regardless), then do it, with the nice bonus of immediately having HE available. Don't choose it because of the HE, though.
I'd agree with NaZ, that settling the general for +2xp is the best option, if you don't want a medic 3.
If you have a 14/17 unit, you're only three battles away from being able to build it. If it's a city raider unit, use it on the last defender. Usually that's the result of losing at least one battle, so it'll be against a weakened unit anyway. You might have to delay the next siege for him to heal up, but that's a smaller opportunity cost than using the GG on a sub-optimal option.
If you want to get a Medic 3 unit (that's going to be where my first GG goes when I get Warlords, regardless), then do it, with the nice bonus of immediately having HE available. Don't choose it because of the HE, though.
I'd agree with NaZ, that settling the general for +2xp is the best option, if you don't want a medic 3.
Dr Elmer Jiggle
King
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2003
- Messages
- 811
NaZdReG said:
As somebody (I think you) recently pointed out, there is presumably already a level 5 or very nearly level 5 unit available unless he unexpectedly died in the latest round. I think that's why I'm personally not too keen on the idea of using the general to create a medic. If you need to use him as a warlord, then putting the promotions into the medic tree isn't a bad idea, but if you don't even need to use him as a warlord, then is it really so important to have a Medic III that you'd use him anyway?
In other words, if the warlord is going to enable Heroic Epic, then getting a Medic III is a nice bonus, but I don't think Medic III is reason enough.
There's a thread in the Warlords forum titled something like "Military Academies" where the overwhelming conclusion seems to be that military academies kind of stink. The most important point is that the more other production bonuses you have (forge, Heroic Epic, factory, ...) the less important the military academy is. Once you have a forge and the Heroic Epic, the military academy only increases your production 11% above what it would be without the academy.
Most of the time I agree with this, but I don't think it's always true. In a recent game, I got my last great general as the game was drawing to a close. I had two cities that I was using for most of my military unit production. One had barracks/stable, instructor, west point, Pentagon for 11 XP infantry / 13 XP cossacks. The other had barracks/stable/drydock and Pentagon for 5XP infanty / 7 XP cossacks. Since most of my units weren't going to see a lot of combat before the game was over, I felt like it was much more useful to put an instructor into the secondary city and use that to build all my cossacks and naval units with 9 XP each. Getting the Heroic Epic city up to 13/15 wasn't going to help me as much.
Dr Elmer Jiggle
King
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2003
- Messages
- 811
Phrederick said:
In Vanilla, you only needed a level 4 unit (10 XP) to build the Heroic Epic. Now you need level 5. Usually that still isn't terribly difficult, especially if you've been at war enough to create a great general, but what happens if your final battle was a real last ditch effort to take the enemy's well-defended final city, and you lost all of your most experienced units (this actually happened to me recently)?
I do think it's situational, but there are cases where a warlord can speed up the Heroic Epic substantially.
Also, it's kind of fun to play with the new promotions since that's part of what you got for your $30.
aelf
Ashen One
Round 5: 595BC - 170AD
A slow going round reminiscent of the previous Emperor's Challenge.
Killer upkeep had quickly set in, and in the initial turns the only thing that kept our science budget afloat was plunder money. When the treasury dried, research naturally slowed to a crawl...
One turn into the round, Madrid came out of revolt and began to starve. I whipped a Buddhist temple for 2 pop, and the city was still starving at size 4. I whipped an obelisk for another 2 pop, switching the build order so that the temple would be built first. The city was still unhappy and starving at size 2! Blasted heretics. Will you not learn the power of our gods?!
Oh well, I guess it had to begin from size 1 again. A courthouse was started next, which we would chop for.
Anyway, our victorious War Chariots rolled into yet another Spanish city with no casualties:
I was considering whether to keep it. We couldn't really afford more upkeep, but since the city is between Madrid and Barcelona, I thought it would provide continuity to our borders. And it does have gems that we could eventually work (IW was certainly needed soon).
Our 14 xp chariot became level 5 after the Battle of Toledo:
I gave our hero March to help it in its numerous future quests. So now we can build the HE even without getting a warlord unit (more reason to use the GG as a GMI?).
We signed peace with Isabella because WW was starting to take a toll on our cities. She didn't have anymore cities nearby anyway.
In a few turns, we finished researching CS and entered the Medieval era in 400 BC:
Not a particularly quick CS slingshot, I guess. But that's the best we could do with what we got. In fact, Bureaucracy didn't give us much of a financial boost as there is no high commerce tile in Thebes' fat cross until Calendar (and even then there's only one silk).
I balanced Thebes' output between production and commerce, and started on a Confucian temple so that it could grow one size larger. Memphis, meanwhile, took over the role of the priest city:
Soon, slow research drove me to find another city to plunder. We needed to get Masonry done so that Thebes could take advantage of the commerce and hammers the marble quarry yields.
Another chance to steal a worker! And Huamanga was situated in a spot that we would want to claim anyway. Yes, there's a spear guarding it (in addition to the standard archer), but that's what Flanking chariots were for...
The results were still disastrous. We lost three WCs: one Flanking I, one Combat II and one Combat III
One Combat II WC could be promoted to Combat III after that, though. Should've promoted one WC with Shock before this 
Well, at least we got the city, and the plunder helped us finish up Masonry. I thought about it and decided to research Monotheism after IW (which we need quickly to improve the jungle cities, especially the gems). Small chance we could get the Great Library now, so Literature was no longer a priority. Monotheism would allow us to lighbulb Theology with a GP.
Meanwhile, Memphis had outgrown its happiness limit, so I whipped the half-built courthouse for 2 pop:
Notice I appointed two priests there. This was to stagnate growth and accelerate GP production. We needed a shrine soon to pull us out of this financial black hole.
And then danger came to our doorstep. Actually, it came by the backdoor. Remember Huayna's wandering stack of archers? They returned, and with a vengeance. It headed straight for Barcelona from our vulnerable south. The city was only defended by a lone warrior. I rushed a Combat I WC from Memphis there, as well as the March WC (which was on the way back to Memphis). The Combat I WC reached Barcelona in time, but the March WC could not:
4 archers vs 1 Combat I WC and 1 warrior. The odds were not in our favour. If only the March chariot had made it in time...
And then Huayna marched his stack past and started pillaging some roads in the jungle
I tried asking him for peace, since I couldn't touch his archers when they were well covered by the terrain. Our friend would only agree if we returned him Huamanga. Of course not! We weren't going to lose 3 valuable WCs for nothing. I let him pillage whatever road he could find in the jungle. The stack headed towards Madrid. I moved the March and Combat I WCs to follow. Outside Madrid, our WCs finally caught up with it while it was in the open (it wanted to pillage the corn). And, with the help of the WC defending Madrid, they destroyed the stack:
I tried talking to Huayna again to see if he had been humbled by his stack's destruction. Indeed he had, for he agreed to sign peace for no payment:
After that, aside from a few barbarians walking around in the jungle, our workers were left undisturbed to build roads and improve the land. I spread Confucianism to a few conquered cities to help them grow. Our economy eventually began to show signs of recovering.
[to be continued in the next post]
A slow going round reminiscent of the previous Emperor's Challenge.
Killer upkeep had quickly set in, and in the initial turns the only thing that kept our science budget afloat was plunder money. When the treasury dried, research naturally slowed to a crawl...
One turn into the round, Madrid came out of revolt and began to starve. I whipped a Buddhist temple for 2 pop, and the city was still starving at size 4. I whipped an obelisk for another 2 pop, switching the build order so that the temple would be built first. The city was still unhappy and starving at size 2! Blasted heretics. Will you not learn the power of our gods?!
Oh well, I guess it had to begin from size 1 again. A courthouse was started next, which we would chop for.Anyway, our victorious War Chariots rolled into yet another Spanish city with no casualties:
I was considering whether to keep it. We couldn't really afford more upkeep, but since the city is between Madrid and Barcelona, I thought it would provide continuity to our borders. And it does have gems that we could eventually work (IW was certainly needed soon).
Our 14 xp chariot became level 5 after the Battle of Toledo:
I gave our hero March to help it in its numerous future quests. So now we can build the HE even without getting a warlord unit (more reason to use the GG as a GMI?).
We signed peace with Isabella because WW was starting to take a toll on our cities. She didn't have anymore cities nearby anyway.
In a few turns, we finished researching CS and entered the Medieval era in 400 BC:
Not a particularly quick CS slingshot, I guess. But that's the best we could do with what we got. In fact, Bureaucracy didn't give us much of a financial boost as there is no high commerce tile in Thebes' fat cross until Calendar (and even then there's only one silk).
I balanced Thebes' output between production and commerce, and started on a Confucian temple so that it could grow one size larger. Memphis, meanwhile, took over the role of the priest city:
Soon, slow research drove me to find another city to plunder. We needed to get Masonry done so that Thebes could take advantage of the commerce and hammers the marble quarry yields.
Another chance to steal a worker! And Huamanga was situated in a spot that we would want to claim anyway. Yes, there's a spear guarding it (in addition to the standard archer), but that's what Flanking chariots were for...
The results were still disastrous. We lost three WCs: one Flanking I, one Combat II and one Combat III
One Combat II WC could be promoted to Combat III after that, though. Should've promoted one WC with Shock before this Well, at least we got the city, and the plunder helped us finish up Masonry. I thought about it and decided to research Monotheism after IW (which we need quickly to improve the jungle cities, especially the gems). Small chance we could get the Great Library now, so Literature was no longer a priority. Monotheism would allow us to lighbulb Theology with a GP.
Meanwhile, Memphis had outgrown its happiness limit, so I whipped the half-built courthouse for 2 pop:
Notice I appointed two priests there. This was to stagnate growth and accelerate GP production. We needed a shrine soon to pull us out of this financial black hole.
And then danger came to our doorstep. Actually, it came by the backdoor. Remember Huayna's wandering stack of archers? They returned, and with a vengeance. It headed straight for Barcelona from our vulnerable south. The city was only defended by a lone warrior. I rushed a Combat I WC from Memphis there, as well as the March WC (which was on the way back to Memphis). The Combat I WC reached Barcelona in time, but the March WC could not:
4 archers vs 1 Combat I WC and 1 warrior. The odds were not in our favour. If only the March chariot had made it in time...
And then Huayna marched his stack past and started pillaging some roads in the jungle
I tried asking him for peace, since I couldn't touch his archers when they were well covered by the terrain. Our friend would only agree if we returned him Huamanga. Of course not! We weren't going to lose 3 valuable WCs for nothing. I let him pillage whatever road he could find in the jungle. The stack headed towards Madrid. I moved the March and Combat I WCs to follow. Outside Madrid, our WCs finally caught up with it while it was in the open (it wanted to pillage the corn). And, with the help of the WC defending Madrid, they destroyed the stack:
I tried talking to Huayna again to see if he had been humbled by his stack's destruction. Indeed he had, for he agreed to sign peace for no payment:
After that, aside from a few barbarians walking around in the jungle, our workers were left undisturbed to build roads and improve the land. I spread Confucianism to a few conquered cities to help them grow. Our economy eventually began to show signs of recovering.
[to be continued in the next post]
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Messages
- 12,418
Well a few breakdown ideas
1. Super Medic... This means the 'Leader unit' needs 17 exp once it its attached.. the advantage here is you Might be able to Split the Experience wit another unit (say your highest unit to get him to 26 exp..guaranteeing Westpoint)
(so ideally it would be placed on a stack of 2...one your high exp/combat unit, and another with 7 exp and only Combat 1/ Medic promotions so far... although he could have slightly less exp and build up to Medic 3 through mop up operations)
2. Super Combat... combining it with your +March WC (last we saw) unit that'll be enough to get two more promotions on top of That (at 26 and 37 exp).. allowing you a Combat 5 March unit (heals at 15% each turn everywhere), or a Combat 6 unit
Or if you go/went Flanking: Leadership, and the 'Three levels of Flanking'...then the rest in the Combat path
guaranteed HE/WP and faster #2 GG
3. Instructor for Military city
good option as Heroic Epic is approaching, but you might not have HE long enough for it to matter until Intercontinental wars go.
4. Military Academy...probably the Worst
1. Super Medic... This means the 'Leader unit' needs 17 exp once it its attached.. the advantage here is you Might be able to Split the Experience wit another unit (say your highest unit to get him to 26 exp..guaranteeing Westpoint)
(so ideally it would be placed on a stack of 2...one your high exp/combat unit, and another with 7 exp and only Combat 1/ Medic promotions so far... although he could have slightly less exp and build up to Medic 3 through mop up operations)
2. Super Combat... combining it with your +March WC (last we saw) unit that'll be enough to get two more promotions on top of That (at 26 and 37 exp).. allowing you a Combat 5 March unit (heals at 15% each turn everywhere), or a Combat 6 unit
Or if you go/went Flanking: Leadership, and the 'Three levels of Flanking'...then the rest in the Combat path
guaranteed HE/WP and faster #2 GG
3. Instructor for Military city
good option as Heroic Epic is approaching, but you might not have HE long enough for it to matter until Intercontinental wars go.
4. Military Academy...probably the Worst
aelf
Ashen One
[continued from the previous post]
It was peace until financial and strategic needs drove us into war again. Remember the Spanish city that had copper? After it was destroyed, Madrid controlled the copper and I sent a worker there to mine it. Unfortunately, a new city the Spanish built there took over the copper again just as the mine was completed. I moved a Flanking II WC to Madrid from Huamanga and prepared to invade:
I lost the Flanking II WC in the attack (these units are beginning to lose their power), but we captured the city and razed it. Again, plunder money gave a boost to our research. And in the aftermath of the battle, our first Great General, Lysander, was born:
Nothing like a good old Spartan
Razing the new Spanish city also served a strategic purpose: it allowed us to regain our copper (which the Spanish had farmed over). Take a look at Huayna's visible cities and you'll see the beginnings of a metal army being assembled. We need to start pumping out some axes soon.
This is where the round ended. We've finished researching Monotheism. What next? I'm thinking of Monarchy, since that is relatively cheap and is needed for DR. Should we use our next GP to pop Theology or build a shrine to help our economy? Christianity had been founded in 175BC on the other continent so we might be facing some serious religious competition to get to DR.
And there's the yet concluded debate on how to use our first GG. Now that we actually have him, how should we employ him?
Lastly, there's the question of the Incas. They've grown powerful now, despite their initial setback. When can we/should we attack them? I think we need to plan because the sophistication of their arms means we can no longer rely on WCs to do the job. We have iron near Toledo that we can hook up soon. Should we build an army of axes and swords and attack Huayna again? Or should we wait for catapults? Construction is not located along our research path. Maybe we should be defensive for now and attack again when we've gotten round to building trebs and maces?
The graphs:
Our financial situation has not been good for a while, but it's not too bad and is recovering. We are trailing far behind in terms of power, however. I think it's time we 'modernise' our army.
A map of our continent:
We are coming to the part of the game that is the most difficult. What decisions we make from here will determine if our game is a success or not. Your thoughts and opinions are even more valuable now.
It was peace until financial and strategic needs drove us into war again. Remember the Spanish city that had copper? After it was destroyed, Madrid controlled the copper and I sent a worker there to mine it. Unfortunately, a new city the Spanish built there took over the copper again just as the mine was completed. I moved a Flanking II WC to Madrid from Huamanga and prepared to invade:
I lost the Flanking II WC in the attack (these units are beginning to lose their power), but we captured the city and razed it. Again, plunder money gave a boost to our research. And in the aftermath of the battle, our first Great General, Lysander, was born:
Nothing like a good old Spartan
Razing the new Spanish city also served a strategic purpose: it allowed us to regain our copper (which the Spanish had farmed over
). Take a look at Huayna's visible cities and you'll see the beginnings of a metal army being assembled. We need to start pumping out some axes soon.This is where the round ended. We've finished researching Monotheism. What next? I'm thinking of Monarchy, since that is relatively cheap and is needed for DR. Should we use our next GP to pop Theology or build a shrine to help our economy? Christianity had been founded in 175BC on the other continent so we might be facing some serious religious competition to get to DR.
And there's the yet concluded debate on how to use our first GG. Now that we actually have him, how should we employ him?
Lastly, there's the question of the Incas. They've grown powerful now, despite their initial setback. When can we/should we attack them? I think we need to plan because the sophistication of their arms means we can no longer rely on WCs to do the job. We have iron near Toledo that we can hook up soon. Should we build an army of axes and swords and attack Huayna again? Or should we wait for catapults? Construction is not located along our research path. Maybe we should be defensive for now and attack again when we've gotten round to building trebs and maces?
The graphs:
Our financial situation has not been good for a while, but it's not too bad and is recovering. We are trailing far behind in terms of power, however. I think it's time we 'modernise' our army.
A map of our continent:
We are coming to the part of the game that is the most difficult. What decisions we make from here will determine if our game is a success or not. Your thoughts and opinions are even more valuable now.
Phrederick
Warlord
My instincts say it's time for a shortish round of infrastructure building, to get the economy back on track. Get a shrine, and start whipping granaries/courthouses everywhere. How many cottages do you have?
I don't think getting Theology/DR immediately is that necessary. You don't really need Islam since you already have Bud/Conf, so you just need to get it in time for Spiral Minaret.
I don't think getting Theology/DR immediately is that necessary. You don't really need Islam since you already have Bud/Conf, so you just need to get it in time for Spiral Minaret.
Eqqman
Walrus
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2006
- Messages
- 342
I would agree. Use the WCs to pillage everything in sight if their city-taking prowess is now too diminished. Keep his Workers bottled up in their cities, and as his road network goes down you won't have too much to worry about regarding Spear counterattacks. Find his metals and you may not have to worry about Spears at all.dutchfire said:
In the future, if you're not going to get any meaningful loot from ending a war I'd start taking Cease Fires over Peace Treaties. This way you can collect on sudden opportunities to relaunch the war without being locked into peace.
carl corey
Deity
Two conflicting advice in just two posts. Oh man, how do you manage to stay sane? Oh, wait...
As for me, I totally suggest varying your troops a little. I've played with Cyrus a number of times and at one point I started losing too many Immortals for my taste while I had to also build infrastructure. You're going to run into huge cultural defenses as far as I can see, so a WC attack will have to use huge numbers to succeed.
Another observation: you have a lot of food tiles. Could whipping libraries and using some Scientist specialists benefit you in any way? Yes, I know you were going for the religious path, but I'm a little worried about your current state. Monarchy looks like a good addition to unlock Hereditary Rule, but it seems to take way too long to research it like this.
As for me, I totally suggest varying your troops a little. I've played with Cyrus a number of times and at one point I started losing too many Immortals for my taste while I had to also build infrastructure. You're going to run into huge cultural defenses as far as I can see, so a WC attack will have to use huge numbers to succeed.
Another observation: you have a lot of food tiles. Could whipping libraries and using some Scientist specialists benefit you in any way? Yes, I know you were going for the religious path, but I'm a little worried about your current state. Monarchy looks like a good addition to unlock Hereditary Rule, but it seems to take way too long to research it like this.
RobertTheBruce
King
I agree with Phrederick that it is time for some consolidation and thought about victory conditions.
H.C. has more power than you but he doesn't have any good expansion possibilities. Isabella is toast. Build some infrastructure and maybe take the barb cities and settle the SE. H.C. will soon fall behind you as the ex-Spanish cities become productive. He may even switch to Confucianism if you build the shrine and it spreads to more of his cities.
If you are going to fight a war, I would finish the Spanish to remove any "want to rejoin homeland" unhappiness. I think it makes sense to get catapults and develop the gems, silk, sugar, and spice in Bactra before starting another major war. This continent is a bit short in happiness resources so Monarchy for HR might be a good choice as well.
I doubt that H.C. would attack and a civ with a lot of spears will give war chariots grief. The cultural defences of the cities you really want to take are getting high now so it may be time to lose some chariots taking barb cities and switch to swords and cats.
There continent is pretty small for three civs so at least one overseas invasion is going to be required.
H.C. has more power than you but he doesn't have any good expansion possibilities. Isabella is toast. Build some infrastructure and maybe take the barb cities and settle the SE. H.C. will soon fall behind you as the ex-Spanish cities become productive. He may even switch to Confucianism if you build the shrine and it spreads to more of his cities.
If you are going to fight a war, I would finish the Spanish to remove any "want to rejoin homeland" unhappiness. I think it makes sense to get catapults and develop the gems, silk, sugar, and spice in Bactra
before starting another major war. This continent is a bit short in happiness resources so Monarchy for HR might be a good choice as well.I doubt that H.C. would attack and a civ with a lot of spears will give war chariots grief. The cultural defences of the cities you really want to take are getting high now so it may be time to lose some chariots taking barb cities and switch to swords and cats.
There continent is pretty small for three civs so at least one overseas invasion is going to be required.
Wow this is an awesome thread! I'm off to read you other one now 
Just something to keep in mind, but I'm guessing by your geographical position, you won't see any oil. I'm betting its near HC if anywhere.
I don't think you can sustain a war any longer. Time to build and defend. You need to trade with Spanish, and get prepared to attack HC soon. Possibly pillaging the hell out of him when you get decent enough defenses.
Sell techs like mad to the spanish.
Just something to keep in mind, but I'm guessing by your geographical position, you won't see any oil. I'm betting its near HC if anywhere.
I don't think you can sustain a war any longer. Time to build and defend. You need to trade with Spanish, and get prepared to attack HC soon. Possibly pillaging the hell out of him when you get decent enough defenses.
Sell techs like mad to the spanish.
since your guy hit level 5 you've unlocked heroic epic even if he's dead. go ahead and build that now or later when you get literature.
use the general in whichever city will be military production to produce the specialist then.. best use given circumstances. the exp will help deal with spears in the immediate future.
agreed on the idea of pillaging the incans to death even if you cant take their cities while you tech towards cats and trebs. then lay waste to them.
meanwhile spam units out of whichever city is destined to be the military city (with the settled general) mix a couple of axes into your next attack stack to defend from those stupid spears. hook up that iron when you can to get some swords into the stack if you feel the need.
once you feel stable fall back and work on building up infrastructure including temples and monastaries in every single city. will help happiness and research, and pave the way for the science and gold benefits from the wonders we've been planning to get from the very beginning. so that once you build them ideally you'll get 20+ beakers and 20 gold. next priest needs to build the shrine to help recover economically. you should hit financial balance at 70% research at that point.
NaZ
use the general in whichever city will be military production to produce the specialist then.. best use given circumstances. the exp will help deal with spears in the immediate future.
agreed on the idea of pillaging the incans to death even if you cant take their cities while you tech towards cats and trebs. then lay waste to them.
meanwhile spam units out of whichever city is destined to be the military city (with the settled general) mix a couple of axes into your next attack stack to defend from those stupid spears. hook up that iron when you can to get some swords into the stack if you feel the need.
once you feel stable fall back and work on building up infrastructure including temples and monastaries in every single city. will help happiness and research, and pave the way for the science and gold benefits from the wonders we've been planning to get from the very beginning. so that once you build them ideally you'll get 20+ beakers and 20 gold. next priest needs to build the shrine to help recover economically. you should hit financial balance at 70% research at that point.
NaZ
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Messages
- 12,418
I'd say its time for Peace
To stabilize finances
Priest->Buddhist Shrine
Spread Buddhism
Cottage up Capital
DiploCivically
Make Peace
Convert to Buddhism (to hold the Peace while you are at low power)
Convert to OR? allows faster spread of Buddhism
Trade as many techs as you can, especially to H.C. He might have some worth while ones (Monarchy, Metal Casting... Really useful for you, Math/Currency would also be good.)
Military/Units
Take the Barb city
Expand into some other good city spots
Right now you can have Axes, Spear, Chariots, and Archers available
Swords should come soon, so I'd focus on Axes and Swords when you get them.
Since you aren't really at war anymore, settle the GG as an Instructor in the Future HE city in preparation for the next one. Have it be the Only city building units for a while, the rest need to focus on courthouses, temples, and missionaries.
Then
Research Monarchy for Happiness, then Literature, use Next Prophet on Theology, Research Paper, and get get DR.
Option two:
If you plan on returning with war to the Incas... then go to Cats, while Pillaging and Stick with Confucianism (and a Confucian Shrine) and don't worry about spreading the religion... most of your domestic ones have it, and the rest will be razed.
Still cottage the Capital, use it for Commerce Rather than Hammers
Build only War Chariots, Axes, Courthouses, Barracks [and Pillage and raze the Inca out of existence]
To stabilize finances
Priest->Buddhist Shrine
Spread Buddhism
Cottage up Capital
DiploCivically
Make Peace
Convert to Buddhism (to hold the Peace while you are at low power)
Convert to OR? allows faster spread of Buddhism
Trade as many techs as you can, especially to H.C. He might have some worth while ones (Monarchy, Metal Casting... Really useful for you, Math/Currency would also be good.)
Military/Units
Take the Barb city
Expand into some other good city spots
Right now you can have Axes, Spear, Chariots, and Archers available
Swords should come soon, so I'd focus on Axes and Swords when you get them.
Since you aren't really at war anymore, settle the GG as an Instructor in the Future HE city in preparation for the next one. Have it be the Only city building units for a while, the rest need to focus on courthouses, temples, and missionaries.
Then
Research Monarchy for Happiness, then Literature, use Next Prophet on Theology, Research Paper, and get get DR.
Option two:
If you plan on returning with war to the Incas... then go to Cats, while Pillaging and Stick with Confucianism (and a Confucian Shrine) and don't worry about spreading the religion... most of your domestic ones have it, and the rest will be razed.
Still cottage the Capital, use it for Commerce Rather than Hammers
Build only War Chariots, Axes, Courthouses, Barracks [and Pillage and raze the Inca out of existence]
All in all, my feeling is to go for some sort of consolidation (hapiness, money, our capital!) before continuing warfare. I am short of advice though, so I will pose some questions that hopefully do help too in some sort, while I can learn from your answers...
You have 6 cities now at 170AD, four of them near a long river, and access to all strategic resources. That sounds good, doesn't it? None of them however is a coastal city, which does not seem to matter much immediately.
Hapiness seems to be a problem for the moment, because of lack of luxury resources (getting the gems mined near Toledo?) and because some cities are Spanish -- "yearning to be with their motherland". There's good food resources in most cities, so growth could be fast, and so how about temples as a very good investment right now, both for Buddhism and Confucianis -- certainly when you head for Sankore University later ? Edit: Monarchy helps too, as Krikkitone suggests!
1) Would it be wise to build some cottages one the tiles near the river tiles for quick economic support? In your previous Emperor challenge, you also waged war for a long time, and had very few cottages. What did you think of that game?
2) Your capital is commerce-poor. It's not a coastal city, and is not near a river. Would changing capital at some point be an option?
3) What do we think to win by continuing the war right now? Both Isabella and Huyana seem locked up, as you have a firm grip on the center of the continent, and our infrastructure and land seems underdeveloped, even in some of our core cities. Why are we so sure they won't tech trade anyways?
4) Besides, could it be an option to make Isabella and/or Huyana as a Vassal after Feudalism, or do you regard making them a Vassal as a drawback? You could have a better chance in getting open borders again, trading techs, convert them to your religion -- maybe increasing the income from the Shrine as they further spread your religion?
5) Since war is what most are after at some point, and with all the War Chariots, could it be an option to go for the bottom techs in the tree, like Guilds, in order, at some point to update to Knights? The land seems flat, not much cities on hills...
6) With only two neighbors, and poor economy, how critical is getting the Great Library?
Jaca
You have 6 cities now at 170AD, four of them near a long river, and access to all strategic resources. That sounds good, doesn't it? None of them however is a coastal city, which does not seem to matter much immediately.
Hapiness seems to be a problem for the moment, because of lack of luxury resources (getting the gems mined near Toledo?) and because some cities are Spanish -- "yearning to be with their motherland". There's good food resources in most cities, so growth could be fast, and so how about temples as a very good investment right now, both for Buddhism and Confucianis -- certainly when you head for Sankore University later ? Edit: Monarchy helps too, as Krikkitone suggests!
1) Would it be wise to build some cottages one the tiles near the river tiles for quick economic support? In your previous Emperor challenge, you also waged war for a long time, and had very few cottages. What did you think of that game?
2) Your capital is commerce-poor. It's not a coastal city, and is not near a river. Would changing capital at some point be an option?
3) What do we think to win by continuing the war right now? Both Isabella and Huyana seem locked up, as you have a firm grip on the center of the continent, and our infrastructure and land seems underdeveloped, even in some of our core cities. Why are we so sure they won't tech trade anyways?
4) Besides, could it be an option to make Isabella and/or Huyana as a Vassal after Feudalism, or do you regard making them a Vassal as a drawback? You could have a better chance in getting open borders again, trading techs, convert them to your religion -- maybe increasing the income from the Shrine as they further spread your religion?
5) Since war is what most are after at some point, and with all the War Chariots, could it be an option to go for the bottom techs in the tree, like Guilds, in order, at some point to update to Knights? The land seems flat, not much cities on hills...
6) With only two neighbors, and poor economy, how critical is getting the Great Library?
Jaca
Phrederick
Warlord
If you do wage war, I think a limited pillaging war is the best option. Your economy simply doesn't seem able to support adding more cities. The barb city should probably wait a bit, but that's the only city I'd consider capturing in the next round.
Choosing a state religion; if they're about equal, Buddhism gives diplomatic benefits, although increased war weariness (attacking brothers of faith). Spread that one ASAP, and prioritize buildings of that religion over the other. I'm almost positive that only religious buildings of your state religion get the Spiral and Sankore bonus.
Have your workers prioritize cottages and happiness resources. Try to time it so that you have a modern military already built when you break even at 70% research. Swords/Cats need what, Math and Construction? Perhaps take those two followed by Monarchy, keep a prophet going in the Oracle city, and burn the first on a shrine, the second on Theology. Pick up Paper for Sankore, followed by DR either via prophet or just fully researched. Currency needs to be fit in there somewhere, too.
Choosing a state religion; if they're about equal, Buddhism gives diplomatic benefits, although increased war weariness (attacking brothers of faith). Spread that one ASAP, and prioritize buildings of that religion over the other. I'm almost positive that only religious buildings of your state religion get the Spiral and Sankore bonus.
Have your workers prioritize cottages and happiness resources. Try to time it so that you have a modern military already built when you break even at 70% research. Swords/Cats need what, Math and Construction? Perhaps take those two followed by Monarchy, keep a prophet going in the Oracle city, and burn the first on a shrine, the second on Theology. Pick up Paper for Sankore, followed by DR either via prophet or just fully researched. Currency needs to be fit in there somewhere, too.
