D-Nut Embassy: Those Darn Foreigners!

Let's keep this moving along also - it looks like it has been 5 days since we received their offer, and I don't think we have responded yet. We know they are not all that quick at getting back to us either, and we really want to know what post-writing tech(s) we can get (or find out that they won't trade any) so we can give KISS guidance on what to research when they complete writing in 3-4 turns.

Let's get Feaurius' letter off to them so they have time to respond with information (hopefully), and we still have time to close a deal before KISS completes writing.
 
Received in our Gmail account:

To our friends and MIA,

I thank you for your directness and openness of your letter now I
shall return the favour. It is true we are in a difficult position,
but not an impossible one. For us it was obvious from the start that
the greater difficultly would be dealing with TNT and KISS as the
celts and persians would have an advantage early in the game with
their traits and uu's.

However we believe if we if MIA and Doughnut co operate we can
overcome these short term disadvantages. While writing may no longer
be an option we have two other techs that we can trade with you, they
are philosophy and code of laws.

We are both eager and willing to trade these technologies with you in
a FAIR AND EQUITABLE TRADE. Our position may be difficult but
understand that we will not give these techs away without something of
equal value in return.

Now it is your turn to tell us what techs you have so we can begin
negotiations as soon as possible. I'm sure if both sides come in to
the negotiations willing to trade fairly they will be successful, just
as im sure that if we continue to cooperate both of our nations can
have a long and successful future.

Thank you for your time and we look forward to hear from you shortly

Robi D

Foreign Affair Consul for Doughnutia
Click to expand...

Emp. Napoleon said:
Sorry for my absence, got busy.

Dnuts
I think WC and BW and 1GPT for CoL and Philo
This way we will find out how much they need stuff. If they are smart, they will take it since it will give them quite a upper hand in the war. If they don't like it, we could also promise them we wont trade with TNT. That would be a killer deal for Dnuts.

What do you think?
Click to expand...

I assume you mean the Wheel instead of Bronze Working – they already have Bronze.

My opinion is that is insulting to them. We are asking for techs that cost 480 beakers and returning 210 beakers + 20g. I think even suggesting that is a good way to make sure we have poor relations in the future.

I think a more reasonable deal would be to offer them their choice of the following:

1. The Wheel for Philosophy.
2. The Wheel and Warrior Code for Code of Laws.

Either way, the beaker cost is significantly in our favor, but not insultingly so. We are justified in asking for more beakers than we give up because the Wheel and Warrior Code both have immediate uses whereas neither Philosophy nor Code of Laws does. We can also remind them that we gave up Bronze Working for Pottery earlier (a more expensive tech for a more immediately useful one).

Also, we should tell them exactly what we have (Iron Working, Warrior Code, the Wheel, and Ceremonial Burial). The Wheel should be their top priority with Warrior Code #2, but anything is on the table for the right price.
 
I really don't understand ... how can they be so full of false brivado ... They are in no position to request an even trade ...

The point is not beaker cost it is the turns it will take for the Immorals that TNT have been churning out to reach them ...

We should say somethig like ... they have held up their turn ... lets send something (if not this) soon !!!!

EDITED a little bit with Ken and Emp input ... and sent

Title - Final Deal
Dear Doughnuts

If you feel secure that TNT is not this very moment sending hordes and hordes of their deadly Immortals racing down to your cities ... and are comfortable to research your UU technology path in a more relaxed and leisurely fashion, then we should stop wasting our respective diplomats valuable time.

Else Our proposal is this ...
MIA next turn ... we send with accept
>Wheel
>Warrior Code

Nuts next turn ... you to send with accept
>Philosophy
>Code of Laws

Also just to repeat, but you should already know, we have in addition Iron Working and Ceremonial Burial


Yours sincerely and hopefully friends


MIA Foreign Department

Emperor.Napoleon - Foreign Minister
Kentharu - Doughnut Ambassador
Feaurius III - Aide and Scribe to the Department
Click to expand...
 
yes, make it an ultimatum, either accept the trade or to bad kind of thing
we can also dangle IW with wheel for both of those techs though that would be a bit to much (swords and a path for their UU)
i also think our next research should be horseback riding, so we can squeeze everything else that they have out of them
perhaps we should send them this letter as soon as possible
also what does WC give archers or spearmen?
 
Damn you are correct ...

I will edit and resend ... we could get them to send it as soon as we get Writing

Title - Final Deal with Errata

Dear Doughnuts

If you feel secure that TNT is not this very moment sending hordes and hordes of their deadly Immortals racing down to your cities ... and are comfortable to research your UU technology path in a more relaxed and leisurely fashion, then we should stop wasting our respective diplomats valuable time.

Else Our proposal is this ...
MIA next turn ... we send with accept
>Wheel
>Warrior Code

Nuts next turn ... you to send with accept
>Philosophy

Later (when we have Writing) when instructed ... you will send with accept
>Code of Laws

Also just to repeat, but you should already know, we have in addition Iron Working and Ceremonial Burial


Yours sincerely and hopefully friends


MIA Foreign Department

Emperor.Napoleon - Foreign Minister
Kentharu - Doughnut Ambassador
Feaurius III - Aide and Scribe to the Department
Click to expand...
 
In our mailbox:

To the MIA government,

You have put forward an interesting trade offer however there are a
couple of things I would like to point out.

Firstly, how are we suppose to give you philosophy this turn when you
do not have writing, are you expecting to complete your research of
writing this turn?

Secondly, I refer you to a very hand tech values chart you sent us a
little while back, since I believe with the trade you are proposing
you must have lost your copy.


Ancient Ages
Pottery - 2, Ceremonial Burial - 2, Bronze Working - 3, WarriorCode - 3,
Masonry - 4, Mysticism - 4, The Wheel - 4, Alphabet - 5, Horseback Riding - 5
Iron Working - 6, Philosophy - 6, Mathematics - 8 Writing - 8, Code of Laws -
10, Literature - 10*, Map Making - 12, Polytheism - 12, Currency - 16,
Construction - 20, Monarchy - 24*, Republic - 28*.


Warrior Code + wheel FOR Philosophy + Code of Laws is 7 to 16, and is
out of the question.

Our trade offer is this;
Warrior Code + wheel + Iron Working FOR Philosophy + Code of Laws.
You will send us WC + wheel this turn, then when you have writing you
send us IW and we send you philosophy and CoL. This trade still
balances out 13 to 16 in your favor.

And If you are correct and hoards of immorals are at our doorstep, and
you don't except this deal, they you wont be getting either of these
technologies and have two very aggressive neighbours at your doorstep.

If you are willing to except this deal, then we can take our trade one
step further and enter a full technological partnership. In which
case after this trade is conclude you would research masonry, while we
do Horseback riding, which we would then swap, then you could research
mysticism while we do mathematics and swap maths for ceremonial burial
and mysticism and continue so forth until we have covered all the
ancient age techs.

We need a reply by the end of this turn for this trade to take place.
Thank you

Robi D

Foreign Affairs Consul, Team Doughnut
Click to expand...

First thing I noticed was that we forgot to mention we had Mysticism, but fortunately we can get away with that since they are not asking for Ceremonial Burial, and we can always lead them to believe we popped it if necessary.

As far as their trade offer goes, my first reaction is that it seems reasonable to me - we will be in a dominant tech position if we make it.
 
Gut reaction: This sounds ok. Tough but fair enough.

Ideal situation – coordinate with KISS to send the D'nuts and TNT up the same research path to prevent them from working together.

Don't have time to offer more commentary – but wanted to get my 2 cents in so the foreign department can respond quickly!
 
Is someone responding to the D'nut proposal?

Although - really - they can't send us their tech till we get writing anyway.

But that's no reason to drag our feet - I suspect they'll get annoyed if we take too long.

Emperor Napoleon?
 
Well, I thought I’d write some more while we were waiting for Donuts to take their turn (again) since I had more time to consider their offer. I think it is very important to make some deal with Donuts for Philosophy and Code of Laws. It will give us a short-term dominant tech position which I hope we can parlay into a long-term advantage (more on that in the Foreign Ministry thread). If we don’t make any deal, then I am afraid there is a good possibility that KISS will trade for Code of Laws and Philosophy (it can’t be long before the Donuts curragh reaches KISS territory – KISS doesn’t have the Wheel, but they do have Iron Working, Ceremonial Burial, Mysticism, and Warrior Code to offer), and we will be at a severe tech disadvantage.

I am convinced we must make a deal, so the only question to me is – is this the best deal we can get. I think it is close. We are getting all their available techs, so there is nothing more available on their side. They need Warrior Code and The Wheel, so I don’t think we can take either of them off the table. Warrior Code and The Wheel for Philosophy and Code of Laws is way too one-sided, so we have to give them more. Ceremonial Burial is not enough. Iron Working borders on too much, but we don’t have any other intermediate techs. We could ask for gold, but we wouldn’t get much (if any), and to me that is just getting greedy.

Bottom line – I think we should take the deal of Warrior Code, The Wheel, and Iron Working for Philosophy and Code of Laws. Send them Warrior Code and The Wheel now with Iron Working to be sent in exchange for Philosophy and Code of Laws once we have Writing.

Emp. Napoleon has been around, but Feaurius seems to have taken matters into his own hands a bit. I’m not sure who is running the asylum nowadays…
 
Bottom line – I think we should take the deal of Warrior Code, The Wheel, and Iron Working for Philosophy and Code of Laws. Send them Warrior Code and The Wheel now with Iron Working to be sent in exchange for Philosophy and Code of Laws once we have Writing.
Click to expand...

I agree with this - especially considering Chamnix's proposal to get us ahead in tech. (Foreign Ministry thread)
I'll place more of my comments there.
 
here is a letter i drafted (horay i did something!) look over it, don't yell at me to much lol

Dear Doughnuts

We accept your deal and will send you Warrior Code, The Wheel, and Iron Working for Philosophy and Codes of Law

We will send Warrior Code and The Wheel to you when we recieve our turn and after we acquire Writting you will send Philosophy and Codes of Law and we will send Iron Working.

By accepting this deal we are trusting that you will send Philosophy and Codes of Law, once we have Writting. In the unfortunate and unlikely event that you will not send Philosophy and Codes of Law, all trade will be suspended between us until you pay double the value of both techs combined. We also agree to the same conditions.
Click to expand...
 
Nice letter Ken! :goodjob:

But please hold off on sending until the team has had a chance to really consider this deal.
(see the poll I just put up on the issue).

Personally - I hope we get to use your letter!
 
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