The Community Deity Game #13 - THE Inca

Shark Diver · May 2, 2016

beetle said:
FWIW, breaking the promise is a much worse diplo penalty than refusing the demand.

Yes, it is. I'm kind of hoping that particular AI does DoW me. I'd like to finish off my current seemingly unbeatable adversary first, but then I'd love to fight a defensive war in my chokepoints.

If I'm not mistaken, I don't get any negative diplo if the AI declares on me compared to if I declare on them, correct? I've got a good friend nearby to force a 2-front war.

beetle · May 2, 2016

Shark Diver said:
I'm kind of hoping that particular AI does DoW me.

That is all well and good then, but I thought all the break-a-promise penalties applied to every civ? Or is it just move-through-or-DOW demand that does that?

If I'm not mistaken, I don't get any negative diplo if the AI declares on me compared to if I declare on them, correct?

DOW is a minor warmonger penalty, same as taking a city from a civ with several cities. So, avoiding the DOW is good. But can you cripple him without taking cities yourself?

Maybe it is not in your write up, but did you also tell him not to forward settle you, and not to spy on you?

I am worried about him in my game too. He was the only AI who did not like me proposing Arts Funding. I will have more units than I normally field, but I really don't want to have problems North and South at the same time. And he hates warmongers...

Wild_Woojsha said:
I stole 4 workers from two city states...

Is that not enough to spoil CS relations for the whole game? (P.S. Thanks for the acronym help.)

Wild_Woojsha · May 2, 2016

beetle said:
Is that not enough to spoil CS relations for the whole game? (P.S. Thanks for the acronym help.)

I was worried about that, and figured I'd be a cheat and just reload if it did. I don't know why, but I was able to DOW them both and just stayed at war with them until I stole 2 workers from each. I prefer to steal from the AI, but I didn't scout right and found no opportunities from the few AI's I found. Actually, I got 3 workers from the CS, one I built myself and the other was from an AI found in a barb camp.

I agree on those drawbacks to not founding from earlier, I was referring only to letting the AI missionary spam convert a few cities temporarily so that you can swipe their buildings. The benefits outweigh the costs as far as I am concerned, with the costs only being losing whatever benefits your religion provides temporarily while waiting to take it back. Of course, there is a risk they AI's religion will spread like a plague this way, but its a risk worth taking for pagodas!

beetle · May 2, 2016

consentient said:
This is an awesome map. Maybe the best of the Deity shared games so far

+1

Shark Diver said:
I'd like to finish off my current seemingly unbeatable adversary first...

FWIW, based on the changes to warmonger penalty and from what little experimenting I have done, you can kill off a single CS early and there are zero diplomatic consequences. Your first kill is a freebie!

Nigel_Tufnel2 said:
...is doing something I don't recall seeing before - Tradition and only 2 city start, got the GW and HG and had basically no units for a long time (?).

He has three cities in my game, but yeah, this map seems to have him a little stymied. In my game, the two faraway AIs each forward settled each other, so tensions are hopefully high.

Shark Diver · May 2, 2016

beetle said:
That is all well and good then, but I thought all the break-a-promise penalties applied to every civ? Or is it just move-through-or-DOW demand that does that?

DOW is a minor warmonger penalty, same as taking a city from a civ with several cities. So, avoiding the DOW is good. But can you cripple him without taking cities yourself?

Maybe it is not in your write up, but did you also tell him not to forward settle you, and not to spy on you?

I don't usually tell AI's not to settle near me. I can't recall it working more than once or twice and I had thought that the negative consequences were worth avoiding. If anyone wants to elaborate on this, I'd be grateful.

I haven't asked anyone not to spy on me yet, mostly because they don't think an innocent little mountain dweller like me has any technology worth borrowing (that'll change soon as I just got 3 early Observatories up and I may be close to a personal record for reaching Public Schools....but they'll have to wait for after the upcoming WF....which I'm about as well prepared for as could be with 4 cities besides the fact that a couple of AI's won't accept bribes to war anyone).

Spoiler :

Babinski · May 2, 2016

Very fun map :goodjob:

I played to t115, not really sure of what to do in a CV game (I am somewhat a one trick pony SV guy) but tried and managed to get 10 slingers, building petra and purchasing hills for TF as soon as money is available

.

Have defensive terrain to the east so not worried much about the indian guy. Spain could be more troublesome in the future.

consentient · May 2, 2016

T246 Violent Culture

For those that don't know what this strategy is, it involves taking out the big culture producers and then spamming Archaeologists.

Spoiler :

I had a great start. Probably the best game Ive ever had for barb quests. Went right side Honor first, then took the left side before the upgrades, as Alliances with two cultural CS assured me I would still complete the tree before I wanted to upgrade. Also gave me a nice early Military Caste to push CPT even higher.

Stole 2 workers from Izzy, and 3 from Antwerp (decided to do a late steal when another CS wanted me to demand tribute, so I demanded tribute, then DoW'ed). Also used the GG to take their Dyes.

Paid Izzy to DoW Maria, to create a distraction while I moved in for the kill. Upgraded in Machu, then went on to take Lisbon in 2 turns. Decided to take Porto and raze it so I could get to Madrid PDQ and connect it with roads (though later I had to build a road S out of Madrid cuz Monty came and filled in the gap). Cleared a barb quest for Wittenberg just as they decided they wanted a trade route. Sent a caravan there so they would be allies as I was moving past. Everything was coming together.

Izzy was harder going cuz she spammed Catapults which needed worker baiting. I then sent the troops due South and bribed Pocatello to attack Hiawatha. OK, he was past Hiawatha in the sweep order, but I had a good friendship and reputation with H, so I thought Id keep him onside for a bit longer, plus there was less urgency about his units (Pocatello from late Renaissance onwards is horrid). Plus, H had the GW, so best left until after Machinery at least.

H had done some hard work for me in repelling whatever P had thrown at him, so I darted in and took his cities, and had Knights online by the time I moved back west to launch a complete backstab on H. He actually asked me about my troops, so I lied. Workers had built fortresses on edge of his land, which always helps. A few turns of Logistics XB killed his swarm of Mohawks, then I swooped in to take his cities.

At this point I knew that Frigates were going to be enough to take Palenque, but I wanted CI and Tikal as well, so I sent my land troops around past Buenos Aires for a pincer attack. By this time, 2nd army was pushing through the thin peninsula towards Pedro. Both armies converged on Rio, which conveniently had some hills in its 3 ring for my Range Logistics XBs.

Never intended to go after Monty militarily (wanted Violent Culture rather than Dom, and by this time he was a runaway in terms of units and economy, so didn't want the 100+ turn war besides). All that remained was to get Tourism high enough, save up enough faith for 3 Musicians, and then DoW him for the Concert Tour. Happiness was very difficult to manage after I noticed that I had to go back and take Uxmal as well, finishing off poor Pacal.

I guess many people will see this as an aborted DomV, but at least it proves that you can get competitive (I think) CV times without playing Tall and Peaceful.

Thanks for the fantastic map. I'd definitely like to see more maps from Sharky in the future.

Achievements (since I'm sure I will be asked):

Spoiler :

yung.carl.jung · May 2, 2016

beetle said:
I love these stories-in-progress.

I agree. I don't even participate, I just enjoy reading Shark Diver's and Consentient's write ups..

Though I gotta admit I am curious. Has the shark diver ever done any actual shark diving?

It's been one of my dreams all my life, but sadly Germany doesn't have all that many sharks :s

Shark Diver · May 2, 2016

consentient said:
I guess many people will see this as an aborted DomV, but at least it proves that you can get competitive (I think) CV times without playing Tall and Peaceful.

Thanks for the fantastic map. I'd definitely like to see more maps from Sharky in the future.

Nice win, and cultural conquest was definitely one of the flavors I had in mind for this map. I think you'd be a pain to play against in multi-player (something I may start playing when I next have a bunch of free time).

And now you want me to roll more maps? Do you know how long that takes? (That's rhetorical, as I know darn well you know how long it takes) Thanks for nothing, bro :cool:

Actually, I'm more than happy to do another one if there's a civ I have a good idea for and there's a gap in the posting schedule. Last I checked, the next two are spoken for, but I'll take a look at the list.

Shark Diver · May 2, 2016

yung.carl.jung said:
I agree. I don't even participate, I just enjoy reading Shark Diver's and Consentient's write ups..

Though I gotta admit I am curious. Has the shark diver ever done any actual shark diving?

It's been one of my dreams all my life, but sadly Germany doesn't have all that many sharks :s

Thanks. Feedback like that inspires continued effort.

As to diving with sharks, yes, quite often and NOT in a cage. I'm not a fan of chumming or anything else that entices those wonderful creatures to act unnaturally. I actually chose the Shark Diver name for this site right after I had my first great white shark encounter off of Catalina Island. It was a chance encounter and yes, it scared the #$%& out of me the first time. Since then, I started studying them and I really do enjoy most species, but will say I avoid bull sharks and tiger sharks when I can (one is too unpredictable and the other is too predictable if that makes sense?). Being in a school of 10' hammerheads is pretty awesome and nothing on the surface really scares you much after that.

As for sharks in Germany, I wish you did have them. One of my first technical dive instructors is German and he was so mean that a good shark encounter might adjust his attitude (I'm kidding, he's a great guy and instructor). That crazy guy dives in frozen lakes near the Alps.....now that's crazier than being in the water with a large fish.

One of my big goals for next year is to dive in Iceland and hopefully see a Greenland Shark.

Edit: YCJ, if you do want to try it, I recommend going to Belize. There's a couple of reefs where nurse sharks are attracted to bubbles (likely because other people have fed or chummed them). Nurse sharks are pretty big and "relatively" harmless (some say they are totally harmless but this isn't quite true). It's a good first experience. If you want to try something more daunting, there's a reef off of Roatan, Honduras called Cara a Cara Reef (it means face-to-face) where you can dive with about 15-20 full grown female caribbean reef sharks (considered the world's 6th "deadliest" shark if you believe the hyped cable shows). Why females only? Because the males are about 200 feet away in the shadows making sure you behave.

beetle · May 2, 2016

Nice game consentient!

@anyone, am I guaranteed to spawn the named general in OP? Or is it all random? I am on my ~~3rd~~ 4th one so far.

yung.carl.jung · May 2, 2016

Shark Diver said:
Thanks. Feedback like that inspires continued effort.

As to diving with sharks, yes, quite often and NOT in a cage. I'm not a fan of chumming or anything else that entices those wonderful creatures to act unnaturally. I actually chose the Shark Diver name for this site right after I had my first great white shark encounter off of Catalina Island. It was a chance encounter and yes, it scared the #$%& out of me the first time. Since then, I started studying them and I really do enjoy most species, but will say I avoid bull sharks and tiger sharks when I can (one is too unpredictable and the other is too predictable if that makes sense?). Being in a school of 10' hammerheads is pretty awesome and nothing on the surface really scares you much after that.

As for sharks in Germany, I wish you did have them. One of my first technical dive instructors is German and he was so mean that a good shark encounter might adjust his attitude (I'm kidding, he's a great guy and instructor). That crazy guy dives in frozen lakes near the Alps.....now that's crazier than being in the water with a large fish.

One of my big goals for next year is to dive in Iceland and hopefully see a Greenland Shark.

View attachment 407416

Edit: YCJ, if you do want to try it, I recommend going to Belize. There's a couple of reefs where nurse sharks are attracted to bubbles (likely because other people have fed or chummed them). Nurse sharks are pretty big and "relatively" harmless (some say they are totally harmless but this isn't quite true). It's a good first experience. If you want to try something more daunting, there's a reef off of Roatan, Honduras called Cara a Cara Reef (it means face-to-face) where you can dive with about 15-20 full grown female caribbean reef sharks (considered the world's 6th "deadliest" shark if you believe the hyped cable shows). Why females only? Because the males are about 200 feet away in the shadows making sure you behave.

Thank you so much for the elaborate reply! I was already set on doing shark diving when I was in Thailand with my family, but just a few days before it was going down they got terrified of the idea and asked me not to do it. I suppose this is something I'll do on my own :lol:

As for the cage - I've read that a moving human being in a metal cage can actually really f#!*ck (sorry mods, no better way to put this) with a sharks sense of picking up electrical fields and therefore propel aggressive behaviour. As odd as that sounds it might just be saver without one :crazyeye:

I must admit reef sharks and bull sharks are sort of scary to me, the same definitely goes for tiger sharks :lol:

What I would like to see most would either be hammerhead or goblin sharks, but since that's close to impossible I think going for a nursing shark sounds awesome

To be frank, there's just so many utterly beautiful species like the common blue shark, the thresher, the leopard shark..

I have relatives in Florida, maybe when I finally visit them I'll get the chance to do it. A man can dream :king:

donkeyfish · May 2, 2016

It seems like my proposed ban on talking about caribbean adventures didn't gain much traction huh. How do I become a moderator on this place

We should replace Shark Diver with someone who can share his cold and windy experiences from Cod fishing in the North Sea...

ONE USE ONLY - Fishing vessel "Harvester" crashing into wave on the North Sea, Europe, Octo.jpeg

Edit: I do second the Belize-recommendation though. Lovely place. Dont even need to dive to see some of these Nurse Sharks. Snorkel is sufficient

Wild_Woojsha · May 2, 2016

donkeyfish said:
It seems like my proposed ban on talking about caribbean adventures didn't gain much traction huh. How do I become a moderator on this place

We should replace Shark Diver with someone who can share his cold and windy experiences from Cod fishing in the North Sea...

View attachment 407422

Edit: I do second the Belize-recommendation though. Lovely place. Dont even need to dive to see some of these Nurse Sharks. Snorkel is sufficient

I welcome that, but personally I'd rather go to a nice tall mountain range than the beach any day. The higher the better. And the idea of diving scares the crap out of me, same with the sharks. Not happening, no way... :shake:

adcarrymaokai · May 3, 2016

Shark Diver said:
Catalina Island

Cali?

stormtrooper412 · May 3, 2016

beetle said:
Nice game consentient!

@anyone, am I guaranteed to spawn the named general in OP? Or is it all random? I am on my ~~3rd~~ 4th one so far.

no, I think it's pretty much all random. In the Immortal Carthage game that was posted a while ago, you got points if you get Hannibal as a great general :lol:

Shark Diver · May 3, 2016

adcarrymaokai said:
Cali?

Indeed.

Shark Diver · May 3, 2016

stormtrooper412 said:
no, I think it's pretty much all random. In the Immortal Carthage game that was posted a while ago, you got points if you get Hannibal as a great general

Is there some bias in there for a civ to get its own historical GG? Example: I have thought that as China I seem to get Sun Tzu more often than not.

beetle · May 3, 2016

I think my first GG in this game was Tecumseh. That must have just been luck though, since I now also have Rommel and Patton. Is spawning era a factor? I think the fourth was Egyptian.

I played some more turns last night, but it is slow going now. Three civs have gone Order. I did the Oxford Radio sling and opened Autocracy. Happiness went from +18 to -4, so not as bad as I was expecting. With a 2nd level tenet, I was up to +9 and then WI passed (as I knew it would, even voted for it myself) ... and my happiness stayed at +9!

That was a nice surprise. I guess once an AIs is influential over you, WI passing makes no difference? I built the Musicians Guild early for Futurism. Plus I want to theme Broadway once I take it. This game will go long, but my plan is that I will not need GMu tours...

I still have not taken any major cities yet. XBs are starting to get nicely leveled, just in time for obsolesce. When they get march (after logistics and range), I pull them back to be upgraded to Gats. Once I have a half dozen of them, I will start putting the Gats in range of cities. The NE European has no more tech for me to steal (just took Rifling) so I might not have to wait on Arty, which would be a nice change of pace for me. Speaking of gifts, I have another planted GPr and ten workers now (built just one).

I should be unlocking Dynamite and Flight very soon. I have been staffing Universities and Public Schools for ten turns now, so I think I will pull the trigger on my two GS.

The other European gave up her only spare city for peace, so that is two that I can liberate now. I won't be able to recall her to life though, probably. But my spy in the faraway runaway says an army in on the way, and he also just DOW’d the NE European. I am now a little more optimistic on managing my diplomacy!

Nigel_Tufnel2 said:
Only had 6 Slingers before CB (wanted TF ASAP, and built Walls in expos early).

The achievement for requiring 10 Slingers definitely had me working the tech tree differently and delaying Terrace Farms rather badly. I made up some time by having more workers than I initially planned, but it also resulted in me taking a more skeptical look at the best terrain improvement available in the game. I am a little underwhelmed actually.

Do Terrace Farms really get OP only after Fertilizer? What is the rule for stacking the effects? Do you ever build a mine instead of a Terrace farm?

Still, it is terrible design for the tech that unlocks the UI to make the UU obsolete. Some UU can be built after the upgraded unit. (For some reason, Berserkers and Dromons come immediately to my mind as examples.)

BlackWizard · May 3, 2016

5 other native American Tribes....I wonder what the 5th one is cos there is only 4 other than Inca in civ5. At least in my books because i dont consider polynesia,brazil or america as"native americans". or maybe its typo?

The Community Deity Game #13 - THE Inca

King

Deity

Scourge_Of_G0d

Deity

King

Chieftain

Attachments

Domination!

Attachments

Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious

King

King

Deity

Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious

Warlord

Scourge_Of_G0d

Emperor

Peacemongering Turtlesaur

King

King

Deity

King

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