I am at my wit's end with this game, and the series

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Some people are going to appear to be frustrated no matter what, because that's their personality. They find negative in most everything. They don't really want good-intentioned help, because that would turn them into happier, more contented people, and that's antithetical to their outlook on life.

Well, you can put me in then, I guess. But one sure thing, if I would have been on the OP's place, I would not appreciate all the comments here. I'm not sure adding frustration to frustration is the way to go. Nasty comments remain nasty comments.

The aforementioned people should not be used as indictment of anything. It does not logically follow that someone who refuses help means help does not exist.

I'm not using the OP in order to make that indicment. I'm speaking by experience.

And I've always been against asking help in forums or watching let's plays. Because if the game is not clear enough to allow people to think by themselves, it should not be the role of a third element to fill any gap. Who can know how important are research agreements if not by lurking exactly what they do in the game files ?
 
Well, you can put me in then, I guess. But one sure thing, if I would have been on the OP's place, I would not appreciate all the comments here. I'm not sure adding frustration to frustration is the way to go. Nasty comments remain nasty comments.
I'm not going to defend or justify comments but you have to admit that they came after the OP refused the help that was offered.

I'm not using the OP in order to make that indicment. I'm speaking by experience.
Ah. Well, your comment was in the same paragraph that you were using OP.

If you have personal experience to share, do tell! That might get this thread on a positive note. (Assuming you won't refuse help or legitimate discussion of the game's failings and areas of possible improvement.)

And I've always been against asking help in forums or watching let's plays. Because if the game is not clear enough to allow people to think by themselves, it should not be the role of a third element to fill any gap.
A fair observation. But still, the role of forums is for the community to share experiences and to individually learn new ways of playing, new strategies, and to see how other people deal with things that may be resulting from the way I play or from the way I view things. Sharing experiences also allow members of the community to heighten their enjoyment of the game. If I'm not going to think for myself (no matter how clear the game is), then sharing and talking about it can sometimes get me past the blinders that I've put on myself.
 
I really can't get it how people struggle at lower difficulties. This leads me to believe you must be doing something seriously wrong as immortal is pretty easy to deal with, let alone the lower difficulties.

I suggest you watch some play-throughs (on deity/immortal) and try to figure out what you're doing wrong.
 
I'm not going to defend or justify comments but you have to admit that they came after the OP refused the help that was offered.

Well he didn't refuse help as he said himself because he said in this thread that he created another where he posted a save file and asked for help.

Ah. Well, your comment was in the same paragraph that you were using OP.

If you have personal experience to share, do tell! That might get this thread on a positive note. (Assuming you won't refuse help or legitimate discussion of the game's failings and areas of possible improvement.)

I've already shared a number of experiences Other than that, I think that I do not differ too much from the common of the mortals, and that others have the same concerns as myself. Limiting G. happiness, AI aggressivity, etc.

A fair observation. But still, the role of forums is for the community to share experiences and to individually learn new ways of playing, new strategies, and to see how other people deal with things that may be resulting from the way I play or from the way I view things. Sharing experiences also allow members of the community to heighten their enjoyment of the game. If I'm not going to think for myself (no matter how clear the game is), then sharing and talking about it can sometimes get me past the blinders that I've put on myself.

I'm not questionning the point of the forum, just that it shouldn't be considered as an element included in the package of the game.
 
:confused:

Are you saying that I can't be a part of your small community because I didn't bought all expansions and all DLCs ? :lol: Hey, I bought a fair number of DLCs.


Yes. That is actually what I'm saying.
 
Yes. That is actually what I'm saying.

I'd also add that embedded in Sonereal's remark is the implication that the mechanics of many things, including diplomacy, changed substantially in BNW, which means that if you are not familiar with BNW then you really have little basis from which to offer the OP any help or consolation. In short... he's right.

In my most recently completed game, an eventual conquest victory on Standard size Emperor Pangaea as Assyria (though I was a lock for eventual Diplomatic or Science victory as well), I ran through one of my textbook playstyles to make conquest completely viable:

- Start off Tradition, make a few early conquests before meeting too many Civs, and unless there are new luxury goods nearby, just stick with taking new cities rather than founding your own. Prioritize capturing cities with luxuries (or in this case, I admit I was helped by conquering a city with Mt. Kaliash nearby... +2 happiness from it).
- Nab at least part of Honor as I usually do in conquest games, at least for an early General and boosted XP. I will also say that by mid-game, it is very useful in my experience to combine Tradition's Oligarchy (no gold maintenance for garrisoned units) with Honor's Military Caste (+1 happiness, +2 culture per garrison). This goes a surprisingly long way to maintaining gold, happiness, and your lack of culture-focused buildings (which are usually all problematic in parts of conquest games), while allowing you to maintain more pointy sticks to discourage invasion from unhappy neighbors.
- Pick up Patronage, some or all of it. Vow to protect every city state, and crank out as many quests as you can manage. You don't have to nonstop conquer; bribe a few wars between the AI while you increase your city-state influence. Scholasticism can keep your science up (though I do take at least the Rationalism opener as well), but the biggest thing is that by mid-game, city-states can really keep things afloat between food from Maritime allowing you to focus production, the occasional free military unit, and best of all significant happiness boosts.
- Assuming you've bribed some AI wars, go on a liberating spree after you have taken a few capitals.

In my most recent game I took out most of China right away and then most of Japan after that, while the other AI finished them off. I eventually brought both of them back to life and had zero warmonger concerns showing from any leader. At one point I conquered three cities in quick succession from the Iroquois (unpleasant, but necessary to take out the capital) and barely even felt the unhappiness - and only got minor warmonger penalties as well, since they were a fairly large Civ at the time. I don't think my happiness was anywhere near red after my second capital capture for the entire remainder of the game. I ended up puppeting about half the cities and annexing the rest... by the end I didn't even need to bother with Courthouses, and I didn't make too many happiness buildings in my owned cities either. And even as I took the last capital, half the Civs remaining in the game still loved me :lol:

(edit: forgot to mention, I also had -15 or so unhappiness from ideology since I did not invest much in culture and another Civ was "Familiar" in influence over me. Even with that, the lowest my happiness dipped by that point was +17 or so )

Anyway, that's just one option to make conquest more viable. It's not always a blood and guts battle with happiness, though if you pursue nonstop conquest all game and ignore city-states, it certainly can be tough.
 
Well he didn't refuse help as he said himself because he said in this thread that he created another where he posted a save file and asked for help.

Well, I don't know about that other thread of his, but he certainly seems to be refusing help in this one, which is what we're talking about in the first place.

He seems to be saying he's not getting any advice, which is simply not what I'm seeing in this thread. There is a lot of advice. When he doesn't get any advice he says no one's helping him, and when he does get advice he ignores it or says it's bad advice. That's what it looks like.
 
Yes. That is actually what I'm saying.

However I don't feel like that... first off I don't even try to help the OP, I'm just saying that reactions, and, congratulation, yours in particular, are not so nice. You should start to think about stopping spamming, and change your title first before trying to give me any lesson, good bo-boy ;)

I'd also add that embedded in Sonereal's remark is the implication that the mechanics of many things, including diplomacy, changed substantially in BNW, which means that if you are not familiar with BNW then you really have little basis from which to offer the OP any help or consolation. In short... he's right.

First off difficulty advantages are probably sensibly the same, and that is the first point of the OP. Second, I'm not trying to help him, again. Did you see me trying to help him ? I wouldn't have this pretention while myself got stuck several times in Prince vanilla due to G. happiness, and now on Immortal due to AI advantages, precisely. (22 civs on Small, Small Continents) I'm just foruming here... hey, it's a forum.

Well, I don't know about that other thread of his, but he certainly seems to be refusing help in this one, which is what we're talking about in the first place.

He seems to be saying he's not getting any advice, which is simply not what I'm seeing in this thread. There is a lot of advice. When he doesn't get any advice he says no one's helping him, and when he does get advice he ignores it or says it's bad advice. That's what it looks like.

Are you asking help from a starving wolf ?
 
However I don't feel like that... first off I don't even try to help the OP, I'm just saying that reactions, and, congratulation, yours in particular, are not so nice. You should start to think about stopping spamming, and change your title first before trying to give me any lesson, good bo-boy

You're trying to join a club that you have admitted you don't have the qualifications to join.

Secondly, I never said I was being nice. At this point, you're just narrating. Does this thread need a narration? I don't think this thread needs a narration, Naokaukodem. I don't think it needs a narration at all.

Finally, you keep saying "spamming", but I don't think you actually know what the word means, which is a remarkable feat considering you joined this board at them time I was still in elementary school. As remarkable as you not understanding why people are telling you your opinion is irrelevant when you don't have Brave New World.

Second, I'm not trying to help him, again.

That's quite clear from your posts. So far, you've admitted you're not here for the OP, to talk about elements related to the OP's post, and that you don't even own the expansion the OP owns.

I am trying my best to find which, if any, of your points so far have been relevant, and I am failing.

But one sure thing, if I would have been on the OP's place, I would not appreciate all the comments here.

And I'm sure half the people here commenting don't appreciate Horizon's constant complaining about a game he clearly doesn't like, which is why most people have decided to ignore the OP entirely to just post helpful hints, tips, and strategies that are helpful to everybody.


First off difficulty advantages are probably sensibly the same, and that is the first point of the OP.

Too bad you can't actually make definitive statements about how difficulty advantages vary in Brave New World, since you don't own it.

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The multiplayer issues really got me at wit's end. I haven't been online for awhile since most of the games are fixed. If you play multiplayer and fix then fix no more because I am not going to be online anymore. Well, at least for awhile.
 
I hate to say this, but one of the things that confirms my negative opinion of OP is that Naokaukodem is acting as support. Thanks, Sonoreal, for your input.

There is talk on this thread of another thread with OP save posted. If someone could point me to that thread, I would change my mind about a lot of things. I would be very interested in what the feedback was based on the save. I wasn't able to find it. The point that people claim there is one without seemingly checking is telling to me.

Thanks to all who have answered with good general advice while lacking a save. Nice reading.
 
There is talk on this thread of another thread with OP save posted. If someone could point me to that thread, I would change my mind about a lot of things. I would be very interested in what the feedback was based on the save. I wasn't able to find it. The point that people claim there is one without seemingly checking is telling to me.

Here's one. The save wasn't posted until the third page.

From 2011. Until then, however, everybody was giving him the best hints and tips they could, despite lacking a save on his end.

Note that even two years later, it seems like he hasn't actually learned to play king. Either he isn't taking any advice on how to play, or has a certain way he wants to play and is upset that he can't play that way.

Really, this thread is almost a repost of that one.

Maybe I've just lost interest in Civ and don't play properly, but I've found that King is nearly impossible to beat ... the AI absolutely swamps you with units if you try to build anything or more than a couple of cities ... it gets there first to almost every wonder, it skyrockets ahead of you in GDP, it lays down a carpet of units in its territory, while your own army drains your treasury so fast that you can't afford to build any more buildings ... you can't keep up with research because the AI has enough money to sign research agreements all the time ...
 
I was going to reply, and then came to my senses. This reply did it for me:

Naokaukodem said:
Wodan said:
If you have personal experience to share, do tell! That might get this thread on a positive note.
I've already shared a number of experiences
Ok, so, nothing positive to contribute to this thread. Other than "see other threads."

I guess I'm done here as well, since there don't appear to be any issues under discussion.

have a good day everyone!
 
I was going to reply, and then came to my senses. This reply did it for me:


Ok, so, nothing positive to contribute to this thread. Other than "see other threads."

I guess I'm done here as well, since there don't appear to be any issues under discussion.

have a good day everyone!

Good day.
 
Quick question, what OP means?
And maybe he is trying to get everything in the game, and be 1 in everything in demographics, but If you have some difficulties in King, maybe you should try to play a game with Poland, which is a balanced civ, and beeline to the things you want, and stuff like that, If you're going for science, get the NC early, If you're going to Diplomatic, be sure you have a good gold income, or that you can complete CS quests, for cultural, try to fill the slots in the guilds ASAP (If that doesn't make your city stagnated/staved), and for Domination, I think that there is a lot of tips in this site somewhere, I never go for domination because I feel bad about the civ's which I have to conquer :lol: And You can't conquer the whole world in a Quick pace in the Classical/Ancient era, and that is what I decorated, thanks production! :lol: Hope I've helped you a little bit. :)
 
I think part of the problem is perceptual. Civ'fan'atics as a community attracts some of the most hard-core players and there's an unstated 'ladder' where you have to claim constantly to beat Diety easily or be bored by it for your opinions to count.

From my plays, the game it not balanced on Diety, its most likely balanced at Emperor/Monarch/King, so if you can play competitively and have fun in that range, you should be happy.

That's not to say you cant kick it up a level and see how well you perform, but not being able to move past Monarch is not something to be ashamed about, and I wish the community would be a little bit less judgement about that.

As for tips, here are some that will work well above Monarch, but should be especially powerful at monarch or below

- Always build 2 scouts at the start and grab as many huts/ruins as possible.
- Even if you find an AI in a particular direction, keep your scout moving and scout around their capital, AI doesn't beeline for huts near them (its not omniscient) so you can sometimes grab huts right under thier noses
- Employ the early DoW on a CS strat to steal an early worker. I consider this a mild exploit, but there are some mild penalties involved *some civs will see your actions as warmongering* but if you don't plan any military action after stealing the worker from the CS the penalty will fade over time and you can even work towards turning the CS into your ally with a few quests. (this early worker will boost your economic development so its very helpful)
- Don't expand too fast, (keep an eye on your gpt) but dont expand too slow. If you hit 500 gold, buy a settler
- Hook up your luxuries and sell them even if its your only source. No point getting an early GA, if you can pace it and get gpt/gold in return by selling your luxury, even your single source ones. The early trading may also help your diplomacy and get you to your first 500 gold and settler quicker as well
- Deal with city states early (scouting helps so you find as many as early as possible) not only will the gold help, but completing quests will get you 1-2 early 'friends' or allies and their bonuses will help. Mercantile CS for example will let you sell even more of your luxuries while remaining happy; Even city states which don't appear to be useful, like military cS will allow you to focus more on infrastructure and grow your core military on just the gifted units for a long time.
- If a Civ looks threatening , bribe their neighbours to attack it. Failing that, bribe the threatening Civs to war/attack someone. You achieve two things 1) They'll spend hammers building units 2) they won't attack you. -- There's a downside of course, if the threatening Civ wins and gets even larger, but that's part of the fun. You have to play the field to stack the deck in your favour, but sometimes, even the best laid plans go wrong.
- Lastly, have confidence. Pangea being 'harder' is partially true because there is no water to protect you from a run-away, but it can also be some of the most fun you'll have in a game.
 
Monarch is still not an actual level of difficulty in Civ V though.

I don't feel that there's a shaming of non-Deity players around these parts. People mention Deitya lot because it's basically a different game from Immortal, which is a different game from everything below that. People should play the game at whatever level is most enjoyable to them.
 
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