CEP Integration and CBP - Moving Forward

Gazebo

Gazebo

Lord of the Community Patch
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Hey all,

So I'm diving back in today to work on the CEP integration materials. They're in a bit of a mess at present, as they were left half-completed, so I'm doing my best to port over everything that works without custom lua code (as that's what we want to avoid for the sake of performance). This means I'm going to need debugging help to see what works and what doesn't, and for us to compile a cohesive list of all the changes that need to be incorporated.

Also, I could use help writing up a list of all the changes the CP/CBP make as a whole. I can work on the DLL changes, however if you all want to help me write up a list of building, unit, leader, policy etc. changes, that'd be awesome.

There was a small patch to BNW today, however it doesn't seem to have affected the DLL (edit: very much), so I don't think it will conflict. We shall see.
G
 
Interestingly enough, there are some gameplay changes. The policy tree reshuffle probably doesn't affect the CPP too much (since "our" Tradition hasn't much to do with the standard tree anymore), but the scaling warmonger penalty is a nice touch and probably helps a bit with ancient wars.

In a couple of days, I might list some "ideas" I got after playing Civ:BE. Despite the (many) niggles it has, I'm actually mildly impressed how they reduced numerical inflation for a fair bit of the game making non-percentile bonuses quite interesting - it looks a lot like it's pulling off (to some extent) what vanilla Civ5 wanted to do.

It also convinced me that staggered bonuses/penalties for happiness might be the way to go as it creates safe "buffer zones" when your happiness drops.
 
Lord Tirian said:
Interestingly enough, there are some gameplay changes. The policy tree reshuffle probably doesn't affect the CPP too much (since "our" Tradition hasn't much to do with the standard tree anymore), but the scaling warmonger penalty is a nice touch and probably helps a bit with ancient wars.

In a couple of days, I might list some "ideas" I got after playing Civ:BE. Despite the (many) niggles it has, I'm actually mildly impressed how they reduced numerical inflation for a fair bit of the game making non-percentile bonuses quite interesting - it looks a lot like it's pulling off (to some extent) what vanilla Civ5 wanted to do.

It also convinced me that staggered bonuses/penalties for happiness might be the way to go as it creates safe "buffer zones" when your happiness drops.
Click to expand...

I too spent some time playing BE this weekend, and I've enjoyed it thus far. I also agree re: yield inflation, though CiV is simply too far gone to try to reverse that. I hope that the CBP rebalance of buildings will solve some problems.

The trade routes are hilariously problematic, but I do like the 'buildings grant your trade routes' mechanic (as it works better for wide playstyles). It might be interesting to add a few trade routes to buildings here and there to help wide players a bit. We'll see. I don't think the changes are going to harm the CBP much, and the DLL changes were quite minor (mainly LUA hooks).

Looking over the CEP code, I think I'm going to re-do the vast majority of it, as it is very difficult to work with (like untangling a spider web). I'll keep you updated.
G
 
So you need a list of all the changes made? I'd guess the buildings and leader thread aren't enough for that as they do list up everything quite nicely (though not everything was finished...)

As for the other most important changes made by CEP:
1) The map: (I still use the communitas map), but what I really mean are things like: distribution of atolls/fish to balance coast and inland, less clutter of luxuries, more logical movements (tundra/desert = harsh terrain). This changes quite a lot suprisingly.
2) The AI, in detail the "spend surplus gold based on the AI's priorities"-code.
3) Clean-up of clearly useless stuff, like "reveal maps" as a goody hut result, Krakatoa being too far from coast or "trade costs for luxuries being insane" and the reverse 4) boosting some stuff, like "conquering a CS gives you x turns of the alliance bonus they'd provide" or "Open Borders give you %gold interest as well as free movement".

Do you require a detailed list? :)
 
mitsho said:
So you need a list of all the changes made? I'd guess the buildings and leader thread aren't enough for that as they do list up everything quite nicely (though not everything was finished...)

As for the other most important changes made by CEP:
1) The map: (I still use the communitas map), but what I really mean are things like: distribution of atolls/fish to balance coast and inland, less clutter of luxuries, more logical movements (tundra/desert = harsh terrain). This changes quite a lot suprisingly.
2) The AI, in detail the "spend surplus gold based on the AI's priorities"-code.
3) Clean-up of clearly useless stuff, like "reveal maps" as a goody hut result, Krakatoa being too far from coast or "trade costs for luxuries being insane" and the reverse 4) boosting some stuff, like "conquering a CS gives you x turns of the alliance bonus they'd provide" or "Open Borders give you %gold interest as well as free movement".

Do you require a detailed list? :)
Click to expand...

I was referring to a list of CP/CBP stuff we've done thus far, but a to-do list of CEP stuff would also be nice. I spent some time finishing up the v1.3 list of buildings (in the buildings thread) for the CBP last night. Going to work today on leaders, though I may take some liberties with the design as needed for ease of implementation.

G
 
Hey, just wanted to say that I've been gone for a while finishing up my own project, but I should be more active on the project again starting next week!
 
Stalker0 said:
Hey, just wanted to say that I've been gone for a while finishing up my own project, but I should be more active on the project again starting next week!
Click to expand...

No worries. I've finished up the buildings, and I'm about 50% of the way done with Leaders. I'm not going too radical on leader changes at present, as I don't want to radically reinvent all of them. We'll see how smaller, incremental changes do. I am, of course, going to outline all of my changes when I'm done. I hope to finish leaders tomorrow night and push a test version out.
G
 
nice to hear about the cep integration, one thing I miss badly, is the nifty, already builded wonder feature of it.
When someone has build a wonder, you could see in the techtree, that this wonder is no longer available for you, by greying out its symbol.

Ohh and I really loved the way promotions of units are shown(flag-promotions), will it find its way back to cpp ?
 
Barra said:
nice to hear about the cep integration, one thing I miss badly, is the nifty, already builded wonder feature of it.
When someone has build a wonder, you could see in the techtree, that this wonder is no longer available for you, by greying out its symbol.

Ohh and I really loved the way promotions of units are shown(flag-promotions), will it find its way back to cpp ?
Click to expand...

These are lua changes, so yeah, they can be added. I'm leery of adding too much additional lua, however, as mods like EUI will only get harder and harder to integrate.
G
 
Ok, since the 2 features are UI related, maybe it's better, from design-decision and/or code accessibility, to integrate it into bc1's eui mod ?

IMO eui and cpp are the 2 most usefull and needed mods available, it would be nice to see this 2 great projects go (even) more "hand in hand" :high5:
 
Barra said:
Ok, since the 2 features are UI related, maybe it's better, from design-decision and/or code accessibility, to integrate it into bc1's eui mod ?

IMO eui and cpp are the 2 most usefull and needed mods available, it would be nice to see this 2 great projects go (even) more "hand in hand" :high5:
Click to expand...

I agree, but we tend to operate on different sides of the modding world. Interface/UI are not part of CPP's focus, and EUI's focus is not on gameplay. I'd like for them to remain compatible, and will do my best to keep it that way.
G
 
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