Warmongering modifier

Can someone explain the Warmongering modifier, I can't seem to get past the industrial era without everyone on the planet have the modifier to me.

If you declare war once (be it city state or civilisation) you are labeled warmonger. Forever.

I'd like to expand on that a bit:

Some civs will hide the modifiers in their displayed approach toward you, so you won't see the "They consider you a warmongering threat tp the world" line when you hover your mouse aver their attitude description. Still, it is there and it's going nowhere and they might remember that if you annoy them later.
I believe the penalty stacks when you declare war multiple times, and also you are labeled warmonger if you kill any player from the game, even if they were the first to start war.

You get a freebie war declaration. But outright kill a civ or city state OR declare war twice, and you get the diplomatic demerit.

Its pretty simple :

1 each civ has a warmonger hate percentage

The higher the perecentage the more likly they will hate you for warmongering. Montezuma ghenghis and the other agressive leaders obiously doens't really care about the warmonger while ghandi and siam are extremely sensetive about it and other leaders are average on it.
You can read this on the leader spread sheat where you can exactly find the warmonger hate of ech civ.
can someone please give me the link so he can find it?


2 you get a light penalty for declaring war on a civ
This isn't that big but still influence the status of a civ usally they will pay less gold for luxuries However it stacks so if you keep declaring war constantly a lot of people will hate you

3 ANd a penalty for whiping out a civ
This penalty is verry huge mostly every civ will hate you for it and will be guarded towards you.

4 Reducing warmongering decay over time :
As i tested in this topic : http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=486755 ( read it for more information)
It seems it takes +/- 50 turns for a average to Ai to forget that you declared war on someone so if you are smart you wait 50 turns or more before you declare war a second time. Keep in mind that whiping out a civ takes at least 100 turns or more I would say 150 turns

I've never seen them forget the warmonger modifier, I think they just hide it when it's convenient.
I had Lizzy suddenly "remember" that I had wiped out a civ or CS early in the game after I'd been friends with her for some 150 turns and turn hostile when I signed a DoF with the guy she disliked.

You can declare multiple wars without being labeled a warmonger by everyone. I've done this many times. You can wipe out a Civ without being declared a warmonger by everyone. I've also done this many times. See this post for screenshots.

As apocalypse105 points out, civ flavors matter. Your standing and the other Civs standing with the rest of the Civs is also critical. If you wipe out a hated Civ your friends will likely overlook this if they have a high warmonger tolerance.

As to whether or not its a hidden modifier, I don't know. Haven't seen the hidden bit. It would not suprise me as I too have seen instances where the warmonger label will show up even though I have not declared any new wars.

Do AIs have this "warmongering modifer" towards each other? I assume they have something like it since AI civs tend to denounce other AI civs who've been going to war a lot more often (even if they've been warmongering a lot themselves).

However their reactions don't seem as strong as they should be. In my current game, I'm Persia, trying to peacefully win a culture victory, and Russia has declared war on me five or six times at last count. (I simply destroy all the troops they send at me until they ask for peace, knowing that Catherine's going to do it again in a few turns.)

IIRC, this did bring some desultory denouncements against Russia from Greece and Japan. And then Greece and Japan both declared war on Russia, but apparently nothing at all happened, and they went back to peace a few turns later.

For some reason, it doesn't seem like a strong enough reaction to a civ that's declared war five or six times, considering that you only get one free DoW.

And then of course there's the way denouncements sometimes don't seem to mean much between AIs. In the same game, I was astonished to see this:

Germany denounces China.
*next turn*
Germany and China have signed a Research Agreement.

whyidie said:

You can declare multiple wars without being labeled a warmonger by everyone. I've done this many times. You can wipe out a Civ without being declared a warmonger by everyone. I've also done this many times. See this post for screenshots.

As apocalypse105 points out, civ flavors matter. Your standing and the other Civs standing with the rest of the Civs is also critical. If you wipe out a hated Civ your friends will likely overlook this if they have a high warmonger tolerance.

As to whether or not its a hidden modifier, I don't know. Haven't seen the hidden bit. It would not suprise me as I too have seen instances where the warmonger label will show up even though I have not declared any new wars.

Click to expand...

Spain only likes you because you have a DOF as son it declines she denounces or hate you for warmonger i've had the same situation doesn't really prove a thing

LoneRebel said:

Do AIs have this "warmongering modifer" towards each other? I assume they have something like it since AI civs tend to denounce other AI civs who've been going to war a lot more often (even if they've been warmongering a lot themselves).

However their reactions don't seem as strong as they should be. In my current game, I'm Persia, trying to peacefully win a culture victory, and Russia has declared war on me five or six times at last count. (I simply destroy all the troops they send at me until they ask for peace, knowing that Catherine's going to do it again in a few turns.)

IIRC, this did bring some desultory denouncements against Russia from Greece and Japan. And then Greece and Japan both declared war on Russia, but apparently nothing at all happened, and they went back to peace a few turns later.

For some reason, it doesn't seem like a strong enough reaction to a civ that's declared war five or six times, considering that you only get one free DoW.

And then of course there's the way denouncements sometimes don't seem to mean much between AIs. In the same game, I was astonished to see this:

Germany denounces China.
*next turn*
Germany and China have signed a Research Agreement.

Click to expand...

Yep diplomacy is a mess. it seems the AI can't choose a side
Warmonger penalty breaks diplomacy appart because every single civ hate eachother for beeing a warmonger

But in you're example they all declared war on catherine because she is weak (look at you're military advisor i'm pretty sure you are even stronger then catherine)
The Ai spend all its production at units and not at economic universities and so on as a result those warmongers have lower technological units so they are weaker or have fewer units because they need to rebuilt them.