Civics Improvements Suggestions

The capitals comment is on the +250% lines for the 1st 2. Each Word Begins With A Capital.

Afforess said:

Moving it to an earlier era does not make it a better civic, in fact, it makes it worse. In the early game, there is little to connectedness income, so Imperium makes no sense. Only at the Medieval times does there start to be enough infrastructure to make seizing connectedness profitable.

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OK. I guess the name just feels a little "off", but not something that can't be lived with. What about Interventionism? Your design document said it was going to Political Philosophy, but you have it at Mercantilism along with Protectionism. I just want to know if that is intended.

Vokarya said:

OK. I guess the name just feels a little "off", but not something that can't be lived with. What about Interventionism? Your design document said it was going to Political Philosophy, but you have it at Mercantilism along with Protectionism. I just want to know if that is intended.

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I think it was off, timeline-wise, but I would need to check to be certain.

Vokarya said:

I finally updated my SVN to the latest version (I was still on 789 where I uploaded Asatru and Shinto) and I started looking at the foreign policy civics. I really like the ideas, but I have a question about Imperium. I get what it's trying to do (seize tribute from weaker civilizations), but the placement at Feudalism seems a bit late. Wouldn't Vassalage or Aristocracy be better? This definitely feels to me like something that should be available in the Classical Era, not the Medieval.

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Afforess said:

Moving it to an earlier era does not make it a better civic, in fact, it makes it worse. In the early game, there is little to connectedness income, so Imperium makes no sense. Only at the Medieval times does there start to be enough infrastructure to make seizing connectedness profitable.

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Strangely "Imperium" as a name comes from the Roman Empire, isn't it?
How about moving Imperium earlier and make some synergy bonus with the Via Appia wonder?

Impero is the Latin for "I command", I believe, so, yes.

What if we give -2 (or at least -1) relation points with everyone for Interventionism (it's 0 currently) and -1 for Protectionism (it's -2 currently)? It looks to me that other nations should be more worried about your interventionism than your protectionism. Since Interventionism has -50% war weariness, I think it should be ok giving -2 relation points to balance good/bad modifiers.

45°38'N-13°47'E;13429422 said:

What if we give -2 (or at least -1) relation points with everyone for Interventionism (it's 0 currently) and -1 for Protectionism (it's -2 currently)? It looks to me that other nations should be more worried about your interventionism than your protectionism. Since Interventionism has -50% war weariness, I think it should be ok giving -2 relation points to balance good/bad modifiers.

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I don't really agree that Interventionism should get negative relations (except with protectionist/isolationists). Interventionism is modern foreign policy tactics for most first world countries, where foreign aid to countries results in trade benefits for themselves.

Lowering the -2 relations on Protectionism to -1 would make that civic too good. +33% Domestic Connectedness and no downsides?

I'm happy with the civics as they are, currently.

Well, damn. Playing with Imperium for prolonged period of times means everyone hates you. Had to beeline to Mercantilism if I wanted to avoid an endless series of wars.

Tolni said:

Well, damn. Playing with Imperium for prolonged period of times means everyone hates you. Had to beeline to Mercantilism if I wanted to avoid an endless series of wars.

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Shocking, I know.

It only gets worse when most of the major players have founded their own religion, and aren't very excited about the idea of changing it.

However, there should be some sort of a middle-ground civic between Appeasement and Imperium, as the first forces you to pay tribute (unless you're the strongest, but then you gain no benefits from it) and the second forces you to fight on multiple fronts.

Tolni said:

It only gets worse when most of the major players have founded their own religion, and aren't very excited about the idea of changing it.

However, there should be some sort of a middle-ground civic between Appeasement and Imperium, as the first forces you to pay tribute (unless you're the strongest, but then you gain no benefits from it) and the second forces you to fight on multiple fronts.

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Isolationism is that middle ground.

Is there a civic bonus if two nations have Imperium as a civic?

What is the point in building units with food ? I could accept this for building infantry but is it realistic for building ships,aircrafts or tanks?

Well, the idea is that you'll get a greater quantity of units as opposed to quality, due to the fact that the civic that uses food for making units gives no xp bonuses.

nionios said:

What is the point in building units with food ? I could accept this for building infantry but is it realistic for building ships,aircrafts or tanks?

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I've always tried to avoid those civic choices if I could. Even if it meant other hardships. I can live with it on the 1st Mil Civic, but after that .

JosEPh

I like the Standing army civic because i consider it as more balanced compared to the others but the production of units with food sounds a bit ridiculous to me.

So I've given immigration more thought. I think Immigration civics could give Espionage a much needed new dynamic. Here are my ideas:

Immigration Policy

Restricted Travel
No Upkeep
Description: Citizens are born, live, and die in the same town.
-50% from Foreign Connectedness

Controlled Borders
Medium Upkeep
Description: Entry to cities and towns are exclusively limited to those of means and wealth.
Cities require 33% more to grow
+15% in all cities
+150% Espionage missions cost inside borders
+1 from walls, high walls


Free Migration
Low Upkeep
Description: Citizens are free to move and settle anywhere in the realm.
+1 in all cities
+1 in all cities
+10% in all cities
Cities require 10% less to grow

Open Immigration
Low Upkeep
Description: Foreigners and Citizens alike are encouraged to move and settle anywhere in the realm.
+2 in all cities
+1 in largest cities
+25% in all cities
+10% in all cities
+50% Rate
Our culture may spread into any connected foreign cities
-50% Espionage mission cost inside borders
Cities require 33% less to grow
-1 diplomatic relations with any civilization without open borders

Visa Program
Medium Upkeep
Description: The best and brightest of the world are invited to apply for citizenship to your nation.
+10% in all cities
+25% Rate

Closed Borders
High Upkeep
Description: Outside travel is closed to all. Violators will be killed.
Cities require 50% more to grow
+300% Espionage missions cost inside borders
+1 from walls, high walls
Enemy Units lose 4% health each turn in our territory
Foreign culture decreases in all territory decreases by 1% every 10 turns
+25% defense in all cities
No Foreign Connectedness

Closed Borders sounds a bit... Extreme... To me, but then again I'd have to see it in action before I can give any accurate judgements. I suppose people will be using Medic II and Medic III a lot more often if the AI tends to roll with Closed Borders frequently

@Afforess

Simply Perfect! That would be a new column right? I've lost track of this thread

Restricted Travel
Early game, people simply don't travel because it's dangerous and not at all promising.

Controlled Borders
It first appeared in organized nations from the classical and early medieval. It is present till today mostly in small countries in state of war, interior turmoil or rebellion.

Free Migration
I'm not pretty sure of examples of this, but it seems very realistic in some periods of the history of many nations of the past and the present.

Open Immigration
Here Brazil and many South American nations join as examples in the late XIXth and early XXth century, and I'm pretty sure many other examples do exist.

Visa Program
I would guess current USA? That seems reasonable to me.

Closed Borders
North Korea is an easy shot to this.

I couldn't think of any other option, this seems really good.