how to survive domination as korea?

T

topfoxrider

Chieftain
Joined
Aug 8, 2013
Messages
29
So I usually play against a friend who goes either india or egypt and there are six other AI to fill up a continents map. I lead the tech race for a while but since I hate aggressive playing with a passion my friend pretty much takes over the whole world for himself. With the entire world's science, culture, and production, I start to lose ground until Im finally taken over myself.

Is there any way to stop this? I normally dont do manual specialist control nor do I dictate what plot of land my people should work. I also play with 4-5 cities. My policies are normally all tradition, 3 of the rationalism policies, 1 in commerce and the freedom ideology. I also dont bother with religion because I suck with it. Aggression is not an option because I hate it. I can spam troops to protect myself but I never plan to take over other cities.
 
topfoxrider said:
I normally dont do manual specialist control nor do I dictate what plot of land my people should work.
Click to expand...

This is your entire problem.
You are totally wasting Korea's UA by not working every specialist slot. You have to work all of them, and be very careful to pull merchant and engineer specialists in time to prevent unwanted GM's and GE's.

You will never get enough population to work all specialists unless you manually control your citizens.

Korea should never under any circumstance fall behind. They are far and away the most powerful tech civ
 
Sounds like you're making things too easy on your friend. If he has a whole world full of cities to make units with and you're stuck with your 4 or 5, there's no way you'll have a strong enough military to fight him off. Unfortunately, once he gets to that point it's hard or impossible to turn back time, so you need to take preventative measures.

A few things come to mind:

Make him fight multiple fronts at once. When he declares war on an AI, pay another AI (or two, or three) to declare war on him, preferably ones with some clout or in the opposite direction of his troops (IE if his war front is on the east side of his borders, make an AI attack from the west). Make friends and then denounce him, and turn the world against him.

Then, if or when he takes a civ over, have units ready to liberate those AI cities from him. If he is the virus that takes over the world, you have to be the penicillin.
 
joshua43214 said:
This is your entire problem.
You are totally wasting Korea's UA by not working every specialist slot. You have to work all of them, and be very careful to pull merchant and engineer specialists in time to prevent unwanted GM's and GE's.

You will never get enough population to work all specialists unless you manually control your citizens.

Korea should never under any circumstance fall behind. They are far and away the most powerful tech civ
Click to expand...

idk Korea seems to automatically fill up all its specialist slots and very rarely do I ever see specialist slots not being worked. I dont think thats the problem.
 
Qoma said:
Sounds like you're making things too easy on your friend. If he has a whole world full of cities to make units with and you're stuck with your 4 or 5, there's no way you'll have a strong enough military to fight him off. Unfortunately, once he gets to that point it's hard or impossible to turn back time, so you need to take preventative measures.

A few things come to mind:

Make him fight multiple fronts at once. When he declares war on an AI, pay another AI (or two, or three) to declare war on him, preferably ones with some clout or in the opposite direction of his troops (IE if his war front is on the east side of his borders, make an AI attack from the west). Make friends and then denounce him, and turn the world against him.

Then, if or when he takes a civ over, have units ready to liberate those AI cities from him. If he is the virus that takes over the world, you have to be the penicillin.
Click to expand...

unfortunately the ai that we play against are pants on head stupid so they try to fight off his battleships and missile cruisers literally with embarked crossbowmen. Its almost pretty comedic in a way and Id be suprised if having all the ai declare war on him does anything but make it easier for him to get that domination vict
 
What difficulty you play? What version of civ? What average turn he come to your door?
 
So you're basically sitting in your pile of science and waiting for him to dominate the world?

Your problem is that you're so passive. You know AI:s can't stop him, it's your job, even if you wouldn't want to fight. You have to fight, or at least be more active. Bribing AI:s, destroying his diplomacy, and always be in science lead. You're going to always have better military, use it. When you get nukes, nuke him. He can't do anything with outdated units. And if you aren't leading in science, you're doing it wrong. You have to set specialists manually and grow your cities super-tall.
 
Just as the US ultimately realized is true for real life, in Civ V there is no such thing as an option for isolationism - you have to get involved in those wars one way or the other. If you don't want to conquer yourself, you need to send military units and financial support to those fighting the aggressor. The AI can't stand up to a human player in a fight so I suggest you aid any attacked AIs by declaring war directly on their aggressor yourself.
 
Honestly the Hwach'a and Turtle Ship, Korea's two Unique Units, are fantastic at going on a domination spree. The Hwach'a can clear out waves of units, and the Turtle Ship can assault cities easily without taking much damage itself. Around the late Medieval/early Renaissance, unless you're under heavy assault yourself, you should definitely come out of your shell and conquer some territory for yourself. That way you're less of a pitiful force in danger of being totally conquered and more of a veritable opponent for your enemies.
 
CONTROL YOUR SPECIALISTS. Trust me, don't trust the AI's choice-making. Focus on tech and wonders, as well as well chosen specialists and GP as Korea.

Even so, you still needed more cities, or you should've ultimately chosen to become agressive and wipe a civ or two or three. Hwach'as can mass murder the enemy's units, man, and Turtle ships can travel along the coastline and crush opposition navies. Start a war with him and put your friend down for good in the age where you shine. Be more active and help the AIs which are being massacred. Give gold. Join with them. Denounce your friend.
 
joshua43214 said:
This is your entire problem.
You are totally wasting Korea's UA by not working every specialist slot. You have to work all of them, and be very careful to pull merchant and engineer specialists in time to prevent unwanted GM's and GE's.

You will never get enough population to work all specialists unless you manually control your citizens.

Korea should never under any circumstance fall behind. They are far and away the most powerful tech civ
Click to expand...

Why on earth would you prevent Great Merchants and Engineers from coming? Gold and production are two key elements in strong militaries, and you get science from their improvements as well. Or you could use their one-time abilities: hurrying a wonder in the capital is great with Korea's UA, and a Trade Mission is always welcome!
 
Turn the whole world against him well before he is ready to deal with it, if you are able to. Don't let him fight an isolated war, send every civ after him that you can. If you spot a vulnerable civ, grab it before he can. You may even occasionally want to declare war on civs he's attacking at the same time. If he tries to take a city, put him at risk that you will steal it from under him, forcing him to declare war on you as well and deal with your units.

If you can't win head to head, go scorched earth. Pillage every improvement and run.
 
ilik said:
Why on earth would you prevent Great Merchants and Engineers from coming? Gold and production are two key elements in strong militaries, and you get science from their improvements as well. Or you could use their one-time abilities: hurrying a wonder in the capital is great with Korea's UA, and a Trade Mission is always welcome!
Click to expand...

One or possibly tops 2 GE's are good. GM's are always a waste unless you play Venice. GS's are what you want to hurry those techs to get those "wonderful" wonders. If you take Tradition you can faith buy GE's, so why waste a GS on a GE? Gold and CS influence is very easy to come by, why waste a GS on a merchant? If you are taking Liberty, most folks will build an early wonder that gives GE points anyway.

So, yes, avoid popping anything other than GS's unless you are intentionally trying to get a GE, never try for GM's
 
Matoro said:
So you're basically sitting in your pile of science and waiting for him to dominate the world?

Your problem is that you're so passive. You know AI:s can't stop him, it's your job, even if you wouldn't want to fight. You have to fight, or at least be more active. Bribing AI:s, destroying his diplomacy, and always be in science lead. You're going to always have better military, use it. When you get nukes, nuke him. He can't do anything with outdated units. And if you aren't leading in science, you're doing it wrong. You have to set specialists manually and grow your cities super-tall.
Click to expand...

Strategist83 said:
Just as the US ultimately realized is true for real life, in Civ V there is no such thing as an option for isolationism - you have to get involved in those wars one way or the other. If you don't want to conquer yourself, you need to send military units and financial support to those fighting the aggressor. The AI can't stand up to a human player in a fight so I suggest you aid any attacked AIs by declaring war directly on their aggressor yourself.
Click to expand...

I think I would have to agree with these two posts. In fact, I think this was my own problem back when I used to play Civ4 with my cousin and my brother. I was never aggressive. They were. And, because it's just the way I am, I wouldn't bother them when they started taking over the world and running away with the game, and eventually they'd get me, or at least make me fight a desperate war of survival.

So, OP, you just need to stop him before he gets out of hand.
 
joshua43214 said:
This is your entire problem.
You are totally wasting Korea's UA by not working every specialist slot. You have to work all of them, and be very careful to pull merchant and engineer specialists in time to prevent unwanted GM's and GE's.

You will never get enough population to work all specialists unless you manually control your citizens.

Korea should never under any circumstance fall behind. They are far and away the most powerful tech civ
Click to expand...

I thought all Great People were on different cost progressions: does getting a GM actually make it harder to get another Great Person?

Anyway, this scenario is just another reason I wish the AI was competant at warfare.
 
joshua43214 said:
One or possibly tops 2 GE's are good. GM's are always a waste unless you play Venice. GS's are what you want to hurry those techs to get those "wonderful" wonders. If you take Tradition you can faith buy GE's, so why waste a GS on a GE? Gold and CS influence is very easy to come by, why waste a GS on a merchant? If you are taking Liberty, most folks will build an early wonder that gives GE points anyway.

So, yes, avoid popping anything other than GS's unless you are intentionally trying to get a GE, never try for GM's
Click to expand...

Getting a GM doesn't make it not so you CAN'T get a great scientist. I'll admit sometimes you should intentionally prevent GM, but Great Engineers are too useful. Also, I'll wait 12-13 turns or so any day for the Great Scientist so I can get (350+50xeranumber) gold, and the precious influence points, and the Great Engineer abilities.
 
Being passive and playing again Prince AI you're never going to win. Prince AI just doesn't have the necessary advantages to protect themselves against a human player. You'll need to either be more aggressive or hope you can outpace science enough to win Science before he comes knocking on your door. Just sitting around with your fancy high-tech military won't do you much when he'll eventually get enough science to promote and just out number you.
 
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