CDZ - signals of their intentions

I just had a semi-unofficial chat with King Reno, CDZ, and I got to know that they are keen on ending this war. I also presented the unstoppable might of the new Fanatica, where our combined agro-industrial advantage as well as our geopolitical location, compact nation shape, defensible border, Wonder of Seuz as well as the obsoletion of Immortal would collectively spell its doom for Brazuca. More so, I told them the Brazucans only had three real alternatives, stack of doom to be sent south to us, a Western naval group or to dig in, and that they could not match up to our numerous Ancient Cavalry with their slow Immortals. I also said it was likely we would pillage their Western shores in case Brazuca attacked us (very obvious alternative, not a leak, since all these guys think "all" eventualities), and that their sprawled nation could not handle a Western Guerrilla War of mobile units pillaging their land improvements and taking out stray units. I also pointed out that the Brazucan topography would count against them, both offensively and defensively. I also restated several times that the Western Ocean

It is now evident that CDZ wants this game to end as soon as possible, and they look forward to war to end this game. This impatience can be used to help them accelerate this. I also pointed out that their galleys could serve under a Letter of Marquee, where we would pay them gold for each Brazucan vessel they managed to sink, since they paid upkeep on these ships anyways, and would be better off using them to end the game. Indirectly, I hinted we would win sooner or later, and by aiding Brazuca, they would just subsidize the length of their death throes. I also pointed out that we would let them attack first, but at the same time do not let them get Golden Age.

So, noting classified was told, only that we will win sooner or later, and they are better off helping us conclude the business.

Sweet... if we can get CDZ's support, there's nothing stopping us from taking out C3B. Try to play CDZ's wanting of the game to end against them. "Well, we'd like to take out C3B, but would appreciate an ally. Otherwise, we don't see any reason for war."

And what about this; C3B-er SilverWolf privately sending things on the CDZ forum ???

A few minutes after CDZ finished their turn ... That could indicate a trade or a deal between CDZ and C3B...

Im guessing they might be sending a FAs deal or planning an alliance and exchanging plans. Thats just my $0.02

Rik Meleet said:

And what about this; C3B-er SilverWolf privately sending things on the CDZ forum ???

A few minutes after CDZ finished their turn ... That could indicate a trade or a deal between CDZ and C3B...

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Nice catch Rik
Maybe we ought to take a look over there more often.

We'll simply ask them what techs they have and offer to share something for Feudalism. If they're already doing Feud we say "Good, we are actually doing Monotheism already."

If they don't wanna share techs we have reason to be suspicious.

This time, we should try it differently, not putting our toes into the water, but proposing a comprehensive strategy treaty, without disclosing COG. A pure Western Ocean Agreement with some DMZ intel. If they like the big picture, they will sure go for a tech deal without hesitation. I thin they see tech deals as part of the overall strategy, not as a separate small deal.

Rik, I have called for a chat conference with CDZ, talking to King Reno.
I think he actually agrees with me that the war profiteering may extend the game innecessarily, and that it is time to revise the CDZ stance based on geopolitical assessments of military force balances, geography and so on.

The topics would be the following:

Breaking the Deadlock
This time we do not start with some silly neo-classicist trade proposal, but the grand strategic picture. They may be neutral or subsidize C3B, but that will only going to extend the inevitable, the fall of Brazuca. So this time we call this chat-conference to break the deadlock, almost what America did in 1917 in WWI. The vulnerable topography of Brazucan lands, with excellent guerrilla terrain for mobile pillage units and ambushers, their long vulnerable coast, our sheltered lands with DMZ, Isthmus Fortress and superior navy, our defined cavalry advantage with Ancient Cavalry and Horsemen, our combined might of our Military Agro-Industrial Complex, the soon obsoletion of Immortals, the ideological unification of our nation and finally our massive rearmament program have collectively provided CDZ with a gameshifting incentive to turn the tables and end this procrastinated game. It has been our lack of direction previously, lack of faith in long term planning, confusion on where to go, the immortal advantage they held, our military unpreparedness and several other factors that prevented an alliance with CDZ. However, now we negotiate with force and firm power, not any cry-baby tales from the Joker scandal, and CDZ knows that they want to end this game rather sooner than later. By instilling this vision into the CDZ team, and still relating this to the Western shores and DMZ, we have NOT jeopardized our classified information, but rather updated and organized the information for them in an orderly fashion. They can make this go on forever, but I think they want this to end.
I also called an end to their war profiteering to make this game end.

Letter of Marquee
We want to employ their two displaced galleys on our West Coast as Privateers in the best Dutch tradition. These will be given a bounty for each Brazucan vessel they sink in any war here. I think Dutch players would like this solution, appealing to their proud maritime history, and allowing them to see some piece of the action.As part of this agreement, we will also reimburse
CDZ for their losses with some kickback CIA slush fund.
This could include

pay 2 gold per turn on a turn basis for their upkeep.
Pay out reward for sunk Brazucan ships
Reimburse losses of CDZ galleys
refer to Intelligence Treaty of Brazucan lands plus Warzone West to compensate lack of intelligence access with even more intel.

Non-Aggression Treaty
A bilateral treaty calling for non-aggression of either 25 turns or 50 turns, depending on other treaties. This should not come up front, but as part of a major strategic vision in which they play a central role.

Intelligence Treaty
Unilateral Intelligence Reports from the Brazucan War (precondition , Letter of Marquee
signed, non-aggression treaty and tech agreement signed). This intelligence will cover the DMZ and the Western Coast, nothing else, with sent screenies every second turn.
(They may negotiate this down to every turn, but that is a bargaining chip).

City Renaming Honoring CDZ with Five (5) CDZ nominated city names from Brazucan Conquests

This is more psychological and identity-building, and will be a small motivation to join our cause, as it appeals to their pride and honor. This could add to their postgame reputation.

Provolution,

You are a great ambassador. Can we afford the 2 extra gold per turn though? I think the bounty and the reimbursment should be enough.

Provolution said:

I thin they see tech deals as part of the overall strategy, not as a separate small deal.

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In case this was directed to me: this is exactly why a tech deal will confirm their intentions being good.

One question I like to ask them: if they didn't want to sell Monotheism because they were in no need of money, then why do they ask for money as reimbursement?

I actually offered them the symbolic 2 gold per turn (not 20 turns deal).
When the ships sink, the upkeep disappears. however, we only offer them the upkeep if we see they conduct Combat Duty, which is defined as activity serving the war effort, not just cowardly moving around. So we will follow them with at least a galley to watch them through and assist them.

Kingreno is a rather influential CDZ team member but still opinions of Markstar, Kemal, and Anarres are more important IMHO. I'm still inclined to believe that CDZ will support us if they will be more or less sure that the war will lead to C3B elimination. They certainly don't want to face a space race since in this case, only the winning team surely goes to the finals whereas under other circumstances score or some other criteria will be used and they can never be sure.

Let's not push on them the naming of cities though. Maybe they do not want to be that involved. But Brasilia will be renamed for us, something cool.

Do you know anything about date yet, Provolution?

I think Rik should edit the comprehensive, five above posts into our official format, and send it to CDZ, asking for a chat conference this very weekend. I have been delaying this due to MSN problems and due to the fact we were not 100 % sure of the expedition launch. However, the turns 136-142-143-145-147-150 springs to mind for our schedule.

This means, we want them to agree to move around 139, so the CDZ moves match the Horsemen Maneuver. So we want these galleys to serve our joint PsyOps efforts.

Rik, can you please edit and send the official proposal farther up on this page, emphasizing this is a comprehensive deal.

Adding:

"In order to avoid the Brazucan double war happiness, we only want C3B vessels to maneuver with our directions and no attacks for a gold compensation of 2 gold per turn plus insurance. This non-militaristic activity will serve to confuse central Brazucan military planning, and allow Fanatican Operation Westwind to run its course and end the game in line with the collective interest of Fanatica and CDZ. We will also add in a special bonus when the first Brazucan city has fallen to Fanatica. Fundamentally, this would be a extremely low risk venture for CDZ, with galley upkeep paid for by the continental hosts of Fanatica, insurance guaranteed upon Brazucan attacks and finally add the benefit of CDZ war happiness if C3B should strike. This option also gives CDZ a neutral face to C3B, which also allows a diplomatic shift if events should call for that. Fanatica is considerate enough to allow CDZ to cover all eventualities, yet be ale to reach a comprehensive agreement which can be built upon"

Why Rik? You're the ambassador.

Anyway, I'm not sure where else to post this, so I'll port it right here.

This is from the forum of CDZ:

Originally posted by cmota
Hi ppl!! I'm the new ambassador of C3B here... as I've inscribed myself at the forum, I'll try to participate here!

(...)

With no more empty words... Cmota! =)

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Source

@Matrix: thanks for the input on cmota; but it was already known.

@Provo: you are the ambassador to CDZ, not me.

Rcoutme discussed with me a new carrot for CDZ; pay them some gold (let's say 30) for each C3B galley (or other boat) they sink and 15 for each ship CDZ looses, as a bonus for boat-hunting. Perhaps even on top of the 2 gpt for each (alive) CDZ galley participating in the privateering.

can someone please PM me the CDZ official mailing address?

Provolution said:

can someone please PM me the CDZ official mailing address?

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