Blind leading the blind the sequal,now DG

I'm up?
OK, will play tonight. Await my log and save at about 22:00 pm CET.

Make as many suggestions as you want. I hate to do all the thinking myself ;).

For the experienced players: if you make suggestions, please write something about the reasons (lik whomp did in his trading advice post). The other way we the less experienced players might play the "right" turns but don't know why and the learning effect is minimized.
 
Mayas don't scare me. Warriors...oh well, and they cannot build cheap Archers. And JTs do not attack any better.

Fully agree with Whomps trading analysis - get IW.
Mysticism - well, if there were any interesting brokering opportunities (like somone showing up with Math), maybe.
But, we will be able to get any tech known in the world with Writing anyway.

And yes, proper management of Amsterdam is the most crucial thing here. If the city pulls too many shields, let it work the Fish for a turn, for some extra gold. Or, use a forrest chop (but be careful, you need a mined Plains after that) for Barracks, allowing to alternate between Vet units and Settler. Even more interesting if we happen to have Iron - then, Vet Warriors are a good investment.
 
Daghdha said:
Maybe the priority criteria is "profit"? If I can make a deal profitable then it's always good no matter if I need the stuff right now or not. There always seem to come up situations where you could make use of tech/lux/gold that you thought were "unneccesary". That said, first priority would of course be things you can make use of immediatly.
Just some thoughts :coffee:
Good point Dagh. Like DocT said if there's a "2 fer" then it makes myst valuable. On its own there's no major reason to have it. My guess is the price comes down when we trade it to the Mayans. The Mayans turn around and buy it from Lincoln.

Lullaby it may take a little longer to go through your turns but if you can look at Amsterdam every turn I think it will help to make sure things are properly mm'd. Like Doc T said if you can go fishing do it because Amsterdam doesn't need all those shields but it does need the +5 fpt.

Just a thought for the next round...
I think the game could move even faster if you slot Lullaby between AK and I. Another positive is that when DocT steps in he can give me a hard time instead of you guys. :)
Tatran
Daghdha
BlackJAC
Admiral Kutzov
Lullaby
Whomp
DocT
 
Whomp said:
Just a thought for the next round...
I think the game could move even faster if you slot Lullaby between AK and I. Another positive is that when DocT steps in he can give me a hard time instead of you guys. :)
Tatran
Daghdha
BlackJAC
Admiral Kutzov
Lullaby
Whomp
DocT

As said,I'm flexible with the roster.
Game speed is important,but also each team member should
play his turns within a week (in our case) or less.If a game
takes too long people get less motivated.Ideal would be
2 players play their turns at one day.
 
Then that roster would make sense right? After Lullaby, AK and I play (or DocT if he can) maybe shifting the roster would speed it up a little bit. Not a big deal.
 
20:04 Added noAIpatrol=0 to the civilization3.ini file.

20:05 Got a bit of a flu. Throat hurts. Looking for medicine. High percentage alcohol will do.

20:07 Back at place with a noser and some Dalwhinnie. Load down the save.

20:09 Running some Van der Graaf Generator stuff for quality background music. Run civ3.

20:12 Turn 0, 2150 BC:

Amsterdam has to cycle from 5 to 7 it is to be a 4 turn settler/unit factory.
MM Amsterdam to get +5 food. MMing every two turns will be enough as long as Amsterdam doesn't get a harbor.

On trades: I take Whomp's advice and give Smokey 223 gp for IW. I would have kept the money, trying to trade in all available techs when writing is in. Am I too wrong? :confused:

No iron visible close by. Rome already got iron in their borders. :( Another iron source is east of Rome.

20:24 IBT:
Romans march east.
Rotterdam curragh -> worker
Maya start building the Oracle.
America starts building the Pyramids.

20:27 Turn 1, 2110 BC:

Move a worker to start a road towards the spices in the west.
Curragh scout.
Smokey knows Myst. Whomp may be an idiot, but is prophecy skills are formidable.

20:34 IBT:
Romans marching west. Must be a new barb camp out there.
Amsterdam settler -> settler


20:35 Turn 2, 2070 BC:
Settler to the tile se of the mountain se of Amsterdam.
Workers work, warriors and curraghs scout.
MM Amsterdam for +5 food.

20:39 IBT:
The Hague warrior -> warrior

20:40 Turn 3, 2030 BC:
Warrior to Amsterdam to serve as MP.

20:41 IBT:
Chinese start building the Colossus.

20:42 Turn 4, 1990 BC:
MM Amsterdam for +5 food.
Found Utrecht on the west coast.

20:44 IBT: nothing

20:45 Turn 5, 1950 BC:
Only scouting

20:47 IBT:
Amsterdam settler -> settler
Rotterdam worker -> barracks

20:48 Turn 6, 1910 BC:
Settler on its way to the tile on the west coast between the fish and the spice.
Lux down to 10%

20:52 IBT:
Chinese are building the Pyramids.

20:53 Turn 7, 1870 BC:
The Dalwhinnie is empty. Tasted great, but didn't help my throat. Maybe a Highland Park 18y will help.

There is an iron rule to drinking scotch:
One scotch is good
Two scotches are too many
Three too few

It's gonna be a long evening...

20:56 IBT:
The Hague warrior -> barracks

20:57 Turn 8, 1830 BC:
Lux to 20%.
Amsterdam doesn't need MMing at growth to 5 any more.

21:01 IBT:
Barb warrior moving towards Rotterdam from the south.
Utrecht warrior -> barracks.

21:02 Turn 9, 1790 BC:
scouting, scouting, scouting

21:04 IBT:
Writing in, research set to philo, due in 12 at 80% science
Amsterdam settler -> settler

21:05 Turn 10, 1750 BC:
I don't move the new settler for now.
Curragh spots dark green borders to the north.

Suggestions:

1. Research Philo at max.
2. Let Amsterdam wait for one round to get to pop 5. It will produce 10 shields per round then, enough to build a warrior and a settler every 4 turns.
3. Other cities should concentrate on barracks then archers.
4. New cities: A settler is already at place to get the spices in. Two workers are there to quickly road. One should road the two needed grasslands to get the city connected, the other should move directly to the spice and road it.
5. Made a dotmap. The spacing is a bit wider than cxxc. I usually plan my city placment from the coasts going inward to get the maximum number of tiles worked including sea tiles. Of course this is not the same ranking for city build order. I suggest filling the first ring to get productive core cities producing military, then settling towards rome.

21:29 Throat feels much better. More of that medicine just in case...



THE SAVE
 
Lullaby said:
On trades: I take Whomp's advice and give Smokey 223 gp for IW. I would have kept the money, trying to trade in all available techs when writing is in. Am I too wrong? :confused:
My view was partly based on what Bede said which was he didn't want it extorted out of his hands. Especially on a min run and no military too much cash can be an issue.
Lullaby said:
No iron visible close by. Rome already got iron in their borders. :( Another iron source is east of Rome.
That's a problem.

Lullaby said:
Smokey knows Myst. Whomp may be an idiot, but is prophecy skills are formidable.
The AI discount at this level. I(diot II) am actually a little surprised Smoke and Lincoln know each other so early. Also not good.

Lullaby said:
The Dalwhinnie is empty. Tasted great, but didn't help my throat. Maybe a Highland Park 18y will help.
There is an iron rule to drinking scotch:
One scotch is good
Two scotches are too many
Three too few
:lol: I know it a little different. Martinis are like woman's breasts one's not enough and three's too many.
Lullaby said:
Writing in, research set to philo, due in 12 at 80% science
I would prefer not to trade writing. Can we try the republic sling? We need to discuss this with some consensus and discussion. If no one else has it I think we need to run for it. But I'm a risk taker and I(diot II) think without iron we need a big break.
Lullaby said:
2. Let Amsterdam wait for one round to get to pop 5. It will produce 10 shields per round then, enough to build a warrior and a settler every 4 turns.
Brilliant.
Lullaby said:
3. Other cities should concentrate on barracks then archers.
Doesn't seem to be much choice at this point.
Lullaby said:
21:29 Throat feels much better. More of that medicine just in case...
Ahhh...
 
No Iron, that really does suck. Worse case scenario, we'll have to stack up on the cat's & horses and hit the Romans before they get pikes. Their UU will be a royal pain in the ass too.

I say we build a stack and hit them soon :) Let them burn their GA before they get Monarchy
 
BlackJAC said:
No Iron, that really does suck. Worse case scenario, we'll have to stack up on the cat's & horses and hit the Romans before they get pikes. Their UU will be a royal pain in the ass too.

I say we build a stack and hit them soon :) Let them burn their GA before they get Monarchy
I lean the same way. We may want to get a few sacrificial warriors up that way simply to annoy their workers and pillage their iron.
 
Whomp said:
I would prefer not to trade writing.

Looking at Lullaby's save,the Romans and Mayas have already Writing.
The have also Mysticism + Mathematics.
Lincoln hasn't Writing,only Mysticism + 334 gold.

It looks like the Americans and Romans already have connected
their Iron resources.Mayas are busy connecting an Iron source.
I guess we have to fight for it in the near future.It is too expensive
to trade for and we will need it to build railroads and our UU.
 
Are the the maya's next to Caesar? To stand a chance (taking into account our number of cities) we may have to get a MA with the Maya's and it'll cost us.
 
BJ said:
I say we build a stack and hit them soon
My man!
Even better, we build a stack and then goad them into declaring on us *giggle*. I've got the impression Julius is very trigger happy in this situation. We're prepared, we get war happiness and he, da shmuck, gets a bad GA.
A bunch of 5-10 kamikaze warriors to pillage the roman works would be good. I suspect he will be coming along the coast towards "Hamsterjam" so maybe stacking spears behind that river could give him a well deserved headache?
 
Daghdha said:
My man!
Even better, we build a stack and then goad them into declaring on us *giggle*. I've got the impression Julius is very trigger happy in this situation. We're prepared, we get war happiness and he, da shmuck, gets a bad GA.
A bunch of 5-10 kamikaze warriors to pillage the roman works would be good. I suspect he will be coming along the coast towards "Hamsterjam" so maybe stacking spears behind that river could give him a well deserved headache?

Do you mean draw them into a phoney war?

We send 2 or 3 sacrificial warriors as to let their legions do the business, by time they hit our borders we'll go for peace. That way we won't be running headlong into a Roman GA and it'll give us 20 or so turns to build up a decent stack for the 2nd war .
 
If yo don't mind so AK doesn't get confused...
Doc Tsiolkovski (skipped)
Admiral Kutsov - up with helmet on
Whomp- may see a little action
Tatran
Daghdha
BlackJAC
Lullybuy - Up
 
I don't see any benefits in a phoney war against the Romans,
except they and the Mayas will have had their Golden Age.
It will cost us too many gpt,we are already wasting shields
on warriors we can't upgrade.There is still a lot of room to
expand.The Romans and Mayas will go to war with each other
soon enough.Maybe we can find somewhere else a free Iron
source,after more scouting.
 
Admiral Kutzov said:
I'm not expecting to play for at least 24 hours or more.

Guess it is your turn Whomp.

Next player will be Doc T or AK.
If both can't play we will go for the second round.
 
Tatran said:
I don't see any benefits in a phoney war against the Romans,
except they and the Mayas will have had their Golden Age.
It will cost us too many gpt,we are already wasting shields
on warriors we can't upgrade.There is still a lot of room to
expand.The Romans and Mayas will go to war with each other
soon enough.Maybe we can find somewhere else a free Iron
source,after more scouting.

The lack of iron isn't as bad as it may seem anyhow. We still have mules close by.
 
Tatran said:
I don't see any benefits in a phoney war against the Romans,
except they and the Mayas will have had their Golden Age.
It will cost us too many gpt,we are already wasting shields
on warriors we can't upgrade.There is still a lot of room to
expand.The Romans and Mayas will go to war with each other
soon enough.Maybe we can find somewhere else a free Iron
source,after more scouting.

What he said with a couple of additions.

War with the Romans will not be phony. They will keep coming after you until they have sacked a couple of Dutch towns and then maybe, just maybe, make a peace deal and take cash and anything else they can get out of your hide so that you have the privilege to live on.

Second, when you need it, say just before you learn Feudalism, you can buy iron and build some SwissMercs. That should buy you the opportunity to get to cavalry.

Keep growing the realm, get back in the tech race, make more friends....
 
I got it, I wasn't expecting to play, didn't say I couldn't. ;)

If I can make a deal profitable then it's always good no matter if I need the stuff right now or not.
The trick is knowing when to trade if it's not profitable. I(diotI) have this thing about the unused units and tend to try to force the overall tech pace to keep it going asap. On emperor, I(diotI) usually finish within 80 +/- turns of cavalry.

I'll need to open the save and may be back to get a consensus, but I'd don't think I'll try for the Rep. Slinger.

Keep growing the realm, get back in the tech race, make more friends....
sounds like a plan
 
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