NC CXXVI Hannibal

Noble Zarkon

Noble Zarkon

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The Nobles' Club series started out as a way for Noble-level (and below) players to improve their game. Most of the original participants now play at much higher levels, so this has become a way for advanced players to help others learn to play better. You can play your own game at any level and with any mod, but it would be nice to comment on the games of other players and give them advice.

Our next leader is Hannibal of Carthage, whom we last played in NC LXXXVII. The Carthaginians start with Fishing and Mining.
  • Traits: Hannibal is Charismatic and Financial. CHA gives +1:) and another +1 for monuments and broadcast towers, which can mean larger cities sooner. It is also a warmongering trait, since promotions take fewer XP. FIN gives +1:commerce: on every tile with 2 or more :commerce:, thus helping build a strong economy that can support expansion or research.
  • The UB: The Cothon, a Harbour that costs an extra 25%:hammers: (100 versus 80 on Normal speed) but gives +1 trade routes. Great for a Trade Route Economy (TRE), especially with the Great Lighthouse and perhaps the Colossus (although as it's obsolete with Astronomy it's window may be very small depending on the map).

  • The UU: The Numidian Cavalry, a Horse Archer with +50% versus melee units; unfortunately its base strength is 5 instead of 6.
And the start:
Spoiler map details :
Hemispheres, Snaky Continents, Medium sea level, Tropical climate. A map type with coastal tiles if you want them, but not completely "watery" like Archipelago.
Spoiler edits :
Made sure we had horses within a reasonable distance (for our UU). Changed a couple of plains to plains hills.
Finally, a cut and paste of our standard doctrine:The WB-saves are attached (zipped; they are bigger than standard saves). To play, simply download and unzip it into your BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Start the game, and load your favorite MOD (if you use one, if not, check out the BUG MOD), select "Play Scenario", and look for "NC 126 Hannibal Noble" (or Monarch, etc., for higher levels)You can play with your favorite MOD at the Level and Speed of your choice. From Quick-Warlord to Marathon-Deity, all are welcome! We stuck with the name "Nobles Club" because it has a cool ring to it.
Spoiler what's up with specific difficulties :
In each scenario file you can select your level of difficulty, but that doesn't give the AI the right bonus techs by itself. Use the Noble save for all levels at and below Noble. The Monarch save gives all the AI Archery. Emperor adds Hunting; Immortal adds Agriculture; Deity adds The Wheel.

For players on Monarch or above, you should add archery as a tech for the barbarians (if you don't, the AI will capture their cities very early). This cannot be done in the WB save file and must be done in Worldbuilder as follows:
Spoiler how to add techs to the barbarians :

  1. Zoom in all the way so you can't see the rest of the map.
  2. Use the CTRL-W key (or the menu) to enter the worldbuilder. Avoid looking at the mini-map in the lower right corner.
  3. By default you're in "player" mode (look in the box in the upper right; the icon that looks like a person should be selected). You'll get a drop down menu labeled with your leader's name. Barbarians are at the bottom, so cover the rest of the list with your hand if you don't want to see who else is on the map. Select "Barbarians".
  4. Select the "Technologies" tab in the box on the left.
  5. Find Archery (the arrow head icon; 8th row, 3rd column from the right) and click it.
  6. Exit the worldbuilder.
  7. Zoom out again after the map fades, and start playing.
Spoiler huts and events :
Note: The standard saves have no huts and have events turned off. If you want tribal villages and random events, choose the saves with "Huts" in their names. If you want huts but no events, select the Huts saves and use Custom Scenario to turn on the option that suppresses events.
 

Attachments

  • NC 126 Hannibal.zip
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Hmmm where to move the warrior..

Seriously though Hannibal has perfect starting techs for this one.
 
Settling 1E for much faster workboat deserves a little consideration. I'd move the warrior first and see if there's anything on the unrevealed E-SE tile.
 
I SIP, because i don't wanne lose those 3 forests on the other island.
Beeline BW, build WB, work the Pigs, switch to worker at size 2, adopt slavery whip worker, chop boat, the usual stuff.
 
This map type with Hannerbibble and this start calls for a trade route economy. SIP, go Sailing quickly (the capital will want it anyway), build the Great Abusehouse. I'd be tempted to shoot for an early Great Merchant to bulb Currency, but with just TGL it'll come pretty slowly. Is it worth building the ToA if possible to speed that along? Probably not.

In any case, this map is basically an invitation for Nobles to try out the Great Lighthouse (it may even be good for the Colossus given that Hannerbibble is Financial). Until we can find a good river inland, commerce is probably going to come from trade routes. And the gold, of course.
 
Strickl3r said:
I SIP, because i don't wanne lose those 3 forests on the other island.
Beeline BW, build WB, work the Pigs, switch to worker at size 2, adopt slavery whip worker, chop boat, the usual stuff.
Click to expand...

Do you think that's better than a 6T WB just working the FPH for 5HPT? It's going to take 8 turns to grow working a 3F unimproved pig. If there was more for the worker to do i would like that approach better, but all that's there is 1 forest to chop and some stuff to mine that you won't be able to use until you grow the capitol a bit.

The Oz-Man said:
This map type with Hannerbibble and this start calls for a trade route economy. SIP, go Sailing quickly (the capital will want it anyway), build the Great Abusehouse.
Click to expand...

BW is probably better to get before Sailing. You really won't be able to use Sailing for awhile since you will need to get out 2-3 WBs and a worker before worrying with a LH or a settler.
 
I'm going to work the inimproved Pigs while building a Worker and researching Sailing, then mine the Gold and switch to work the mined Gold while building a WB and researching the Wheel, then build a Lighthouse while research AH.

Unconventional?
 
Izuul said:
BW is probably better to get before Sailing. You really won't be able to use Sailing for awhile since you will need to get out 2-3 WBs and a worker before worrying with a LH or a settler.
Click to expand...
Actually I think 1 WB is enough at the beginning if you don't wait too long to go AH.
 
Well AH requires 2 techs here (probably Ag > AH) so it's pretty far out of the way. However we will have the research power here to stray a bit with the tech path and it's a NC game so there's probably horses nearby for Numidian's, so maybe it's worth it? Also, why tech TW? I think you may have meant that to open up AH, but it only opens Pottery.

I was considering building two WBs and whipping a worker at size 2. I think you can get the worker on T21 with 2 WBs already completed using that method. Or you could put a put a few more turns into the worker and get him on T24 but with enough overflow to build nearly half of your LH.
 
Tech'ing TW allows to hook-up the Gold and not lose worker turns (since my opening starts with a Worker). Roads will also help for settler movement.

Starting with WB is good obviously, but mined Gold has such a nice yield that I prefer starting with the Worker.

And yeah I forgot about the whole Agri before AH lol...
 
Izuul said:
Do you think that's better than a 6T WB just working the FPH for 5HPT? It's going to take 8 turns to grow working a 3F unimproved pig. If there was more for the worker to do i would like that approach better, but all that's there is 1 forest to chop and some stuff to mine that you won't be able to use until you grow the capitol a bit.



BW is probably better to get before Sailing. You really won't be able to use Sailing for awhile since you will need to get out 2-3 WBs and a worker before worrying with a LH or a settler.
Click to expand...


On the 2nd glance I'm not sure. Did look like more than one forest in which case i defenetly prefer BW->whip worker. Maybe i try out both and learn some micro^^
Goldmine still helps while building the 2nd WB at size 2. Teching TW helps the worker not becoming idle at least.
 
The Oz-Man said:
This map type with Hannerbibble and this start calls for a trade route economy. SIP, go Sailing quickly (the capital will want it anyway), build the Great Abusehouse. I'd be tempted to shoot for an early Great Merchant to bulb Currency, but with just TGL it'll come pretty slowly. Is it worth building the ToA if possible to speed that along? Probably not.

In any case, this map is basically an invitation for Nobles to try out the Great Lighthouse (it may even be good for the Colossus given that Hannerbibble is Financial). Until we can find a good river inland, commerce is probably going to come from trade routes. And the gold, of course.
Click to expand...

100% Agreed, buddy. TGL seems to be a great option here. I could try to do the same thing as I did in Willy game, TGL+Colossus=Great Seafaring Civilization! However I'm not able to get this file cause only Internet source for next week is my phone with 3G. And I cannot play Civ anyways, its XML-files are broken. Gonna reinstall. Read more in Tech Support forum.
 
I took emperor save, just to master this level :] Turn 100
comments are welcome
Savegame - BAT mod
Spoiler :

At 100T - 7 cities, tech lead, GLH in play, currency also. Now researching calendar and then probably metal casting, the map screams for collosus.

I need to build some military and take khmer ASAP = double holy city, but no shrine :(

Wonders went preety late. Confusianism was founded by research and probably the same civ oracled Philosophy (!).
I got TGLH very late, 450BC, I didnt want to build it without stone :p I built it by whipping 2 settlers in the meantime.

I encounter some kind of immortal archer - it defetead my 2 full strenght chariots and a woodsman2 warrior in the jungle. Baaad luck

This map screams for caste system early and pyramids. I will take a shot for pyramids by overflow from military.


I made a very little exploring - only 2 civs are known to me and noone wants to give me iron working :(
Spoiler :




 

Attachments

  • NC 126 Hannibal BC-0375.CivBeyondSwordSave
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Gold happiness isn't needed until size 7 which will take some time. 2nd city can be connected via Sailing. There's about 20 turns of mining, moving, and chopping to do around the capitol. TW won't be necessary until 1) you run out of stuff to do with the worker (depends on what turn you finish your worker), or 2) you want to hook up horses and build a chariot or two (will also require AH obviously).

Tech rate with 3C clams and gold is going to be very good at the start of the game here, so there should be a good bit of freedom in the tech order.
 
TW is needed for Pottery. Pottery is needed for insane Charismatic whipping.(Overflow into GLH, Maoui,...)

€: But I'm just guessing here. Early Granary could be huge.
 
Not sure if or how much that speeds up GLH. Will definitely be needed for the crazy post-GLH expansion phase though for sure. I need to get home and get the game before i can decide on some of this stuff.
 
It is, and tech really shouldn't be the issue if you grow the capitol a bit. 3x 3C clams + gold is something silly like 27bpt. Picking up BW, Sailing, Masonry, TW, Pottery, and AH can be done quickly with that kind of tech rate.
 
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