Early GOTM 6 Discussion. (Warning: Spoiler!!)

Well I downloaded it and started playing.

What kind of crappy land did we get??? Forest and Swamy EVERYWHERE!!! And the Silk is coming out the wazzo!!!

I haven't started too well. I've got 4 settlers raping the land to make it more hospitiple, but alas I'm in second last position. I am holding off the 1st place Vikings in a VERY important choke point. (We had an alliance and traded a lot of tech. Then they backstabbed me!!! BASTARDS!!!)

I've killed almost 10 units with just a warrior, phalanx, and an archer. And they're attacking with catapults, archers, and horsemen!

If I can hold them off....I think I'm set. It's 200AD now. I got no wonders and 4 cities. Got 2 more coming very soon though.

Anyway...enough chit-chat.

------------------
<IMG SRC="http://images.honesty.com/imagedata/h/207/85/32078598.gif" border=0> I AM CANADIAN! <IMG SRC="http://images.honesty.com/imagedata/h/207/85/32078598.gif" border=0>
CivFanatics Moderator and Tech Support
CornEmpire Owner/Operator
My Civ 2 Scenario Page.

AN EVEN WORSE SPOILER! DO NOT READ UNTIL FINISHED:

I'm much later than the game than you are. However, I'm apparently a less experienced player; never quite made the transition from Civ I to the sequel. Anyhow, I captured the main continent of the Vikings, who were at one time the greatest power, with only two casualties (that is, with out any save/reload), and now the residuals have fled to this island I've mapped with a caravel. I plan to launch an invasion soon.

Here's how it started:

1 AD: After building the Pyramids, I landed a settler across the inlet to the east, thinking that I was settling a new continent. Well, the two lands are connected by an isthmus, and I had unwittingly built a city two spaces from Viborg. Indeed, I had found the domain of the omnipotent Vikings. They demanded tribute; I deferred to their wishes. And then they backstabbed ...

With just two elephants and a handful of catapults, Viborg and Hladir fell into Indian hands. Hladir, incidentally, had the Great Wall. I won't ruin the game any further

The usual spoiler alert applies… I'll be mentioning general geographic info and AI dispositions.

Yeah, I didn't get off to a quick start either. Things did not go as I had envisioned in 4000 BC, LOL! I founded my city almost immediately, in spite of the poor immediate production potential, and never even got a "NON" unit... bummer!

Later, a rare hut gave me a supported chariot, which eventually found Trondheim in the north. I thought I was in good shape after attacking it, leaving a size 2 Trondheim empty. When I took it, however, it because obvious that they resourceful Vikings had already expanded... and the tone was set. Military force, and long years of Monarchy. Three times, the Viking begged for mercy and gave me all their gold for a cease fire, which admittedly slowed conquest somewhat.

After hundreds of years of keeping after the Vikings, taking their cities one by one (usually bribes, as they had no capital), I finally eradicated them sometime after about 1000 AD.

On the home front, though I got Colossus, that was about it in the early going. My 'normal' top priority of Pyramids was taken by London, making growth long and expensive, plus delaying expansion and wonder construction. Because of losing Pyramids, I've lost over 1,200 shields and an estimated 1,000 gold in directs costs... plus the indirect loss of production by not having larger cities faster. All in all, this game is a rather difficult start because of geography, if you your usual game is fast expansion and rapid growth.

The construction that had been started for Pyramids was eventually converted into the Great Library, which did prove useful because of the dreadfully slow science and growth of Monarchy. Had it not been for Colossus in Delhi, I would have moved my empire capital to Trondheim or Kaupang, since city locations were so unbalanced... for over 5,000 years, every city was to the east of Delhi. In several faraway cities, courthouses actually paid for themselves under the long Monarchy rule.

Even barbarians aren't helping much. I have a great big sign in front of all my cities that says "Barbs please attack here..." but they don't read. When the rare barb does show up to be bribed or killed, their leader is only 50g. And I'm only seeing a single raider jump out of their ship... so barbs are not much help in this game . Wherefore art thou raging hordes?!

In my game, the English and Persians are huge , strong, and doing well in science; the English hare the largest Civ. The Celts are big and strong, but not as advanced. I've taken 3 of their smaller fringe cities the expensive way, and trapped a lot of their military on a long peninsula that curls up just south of my capital.

On the domestic front, Communism plus my SSC gets an advance every 4rd day, and sometimes on the 2nd when I get a couple 250g caravans to London. For a while, science was coming in every 3rd day (every 2nd during 2 advances after Democracy-SoL-Communism), but it's getting expensive now (1000+ beakers).

The AI civs are all excited about researching Steam Engine and RR, but I've just reached Electricity (killing my GL) and Conscription. I've also got Explosives, and they don't yet have gunpowder... I'll be cranking up an overseas offense soon, and taking the wonders that should have been mine from the start, like Pyramids and Magellan's Expedition.

Well, I am finished. However, I was so caried away with the game that I forgot to save at 1000AD (I realised that when I was in 13th century :mad. So, I'll start again.
It was a second emperor game I ever had, and I did lose the first one, so according to my standards this one didn't go too badly (and my standards are not very high - my highest score EVER is 45%). Of course I didn't conquer the world or launch my spaceship, but I resigned in 2020 with the score of 20%. I was really behind in science all the time (though I started to catch up at the end). Mostly this was due to the war with Vikings. Sometime around 1200AD I have made alliance with them, so everything was peaceful afterwards. Even as I was behind everyone (except Persians) the AI sort of respected me, and I had Peace with everyone and had three alliances (Vikings, Celts and Babylon). The strongest civ was Celts and they had nukes by the time I retired. They were pretty friendly though and did declare war as some AI tried to invade me. So, as I said, I'll start over. I'm still pretty much a newbie, so I have learned a lot during this game.

------------------
My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre and that I am therefore excused from saving universes

I played till 500AD in several spurts and can report pretty much the same thing.
SLOW GOING.Poor land and a twisty arch is not condusive to developing a civ fast.

The Vikings were freindly at first but soon returned to their barbaric ways and demanded much danegeld.A simple "NO" resulted in war and the extermination of the Vikings.I let them build up abit and captured a half dozen or cities before their demise.

I finally contacted several civs after my beloved Marco's was built by some foreign infidels.The Babs had a long list of tech that I didn't.And vice versa.Trading brought things up to par and now I am leading the tech race once again.

I have 22 cities and still in Monarchy.Extra unhappys onboard but very managable so far.I had to settle for the Great Library and Sun Tzu's.Thats it.Buliding almost exclusively military units.

I am currently researching Philosophy(still undiscovered) and will most likely go for Democracy and the SoL.I still need Engineering and Invention first..everything else(Banking) is done.

In the mean time I am almost ready to lunch an attack on Babylon and the Pyramids within.

The path is clear.Destiny awaits.

Just got home; played a few more turns. Discovered that the Babylonians and English, the latter a perpetual nuisance, share a continent. The Babylonians, in my game, have only three cities; the English, perhaps six, not including unknown overseas colonies. The Persians were destroyed long ago by the neighboring Aztecs, both of whom I've never contacted. The Celts, who solely control a continent I'm colonizing, are by far the largest power on the map.

Currently, I've finished building the Sistine Chapel in Karachi and am working on Bach's Cathedral in Madras. I'm at war with the Babylonians, whose phalanx must face my crusaders and musketeers.

I took a stab at The Colossus as well, but when it was built in Babylon, I "switched" to Pyramids.

by moksliukas:

So, as I said, I'll start over. I'm still pretty much a newbie, so I have learned a lot during this game.

Click to expand...

Wow, you're fast... I've totaled about 4 hours of play time, in little chunks since yesterday, and I'm only in the early 1700's. But I'm a slow thinker I suppose.

A general comment: try to discover any enemy that share your landmass, and locate the chokepoints. Expand early towards the enemy, even skipping some useful terrain to be back-settled later on. Build up sing whatever tech is available, and take the capital, and bribe/take other cities of the competing civ(s) on your landmass (Vikings, in GOTM 6).

Do not be tentative, do not hesitate, and do not let them build up... and do not be afraid to expend your cash (e.g., spend 167 of 172) to bribe a AI city. In fact, conquest speed can often be a function of cash buildup. But you just can't let the AI survive on your own landmass on a "small" map like GOTM 6 (but yeah, I know it's actually called size Normal). You just gotta have the Lebensraum (living space!)...

BTW, use those frontline cities to conquer subsequent cities and develop them later.

I am currently researching Philosophy(still undiscovered) and will most likely go for Democracy and the SoL.I still need Engineering and Invention first..

Click to expand...

Those English absolutely stunned me when an announcement was made that they got Philosophy in the BC years. Since the cursed English beat me to the Pyramids (which are my #1 prize if I can build them in BC years), I turned my wonder production to the GL and then Marco Polo. Without Marco Polo, I would have been aced out of King Richard, since I had to do a 3 way finesse trade to accumulate the techs to get Engineering. But since I was never able to get to republic due to the viking situation, KR was not the usual bargain... My capital is still not size 12 (it is 11), and the bastard English are about to get RR and doubtless Industrialization. Since I killed my own GL with Electricity, its time to gear up the Diplomat corp to steal the advances in the Corp tree, while I go back for Chivalry/Leadership/Tactics (all the AI civs ignored these for some reason ). ASAP, I need the Holy Grail of Refrigeration... since I am really no closer to a good Democracy than I was 1,000 years ago. My capital is cranking out 248 to 272 science per turn, though (Communism, with Colossus/Cop/Newt & 3 trade routes to London, 8 arrows each).

Biggest error is my lack of cities... only 23 in 1700, and only 3 are above size 8... and a lot of those are "weak" because of the general lack of shield-producing terrain in so many places. Should have really pushed a bit harder on growth when as the Viking wars were winding down.

One thing's for sure... no SS in the 1700's for me in this game . Projected finish date is probably about 1890, possibly extending into the early 1900's depending on what the rest of the planet looks like when I eradicate the AI civs and take control of the territory they are doubeltss mis-managing, LOL...

Excuse me but this game is crap!

Everyone had agreed that Raging Hordes is better, and we had also agreed on a premade map!

What we get is a random archipelago with roving bands and a stinking terrain!

------------------
<IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/fra.gif" border=0> Az <IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/gre.gif" border=0>

posted July 02, 2001 03:20 PM
Excuse me but this game is crap!

Everyone had agreed that Raging Hordes is better, and we had also agreed on a premade map!

What we get is a random archipelago with roving bands and a stinking terrain!

Click to expand...

Well, its not bad, just a little different. Me, I found that a boilerplate, cookbook recipe did not work out, and really, that's great because it forces thinking along different lines.

However, I must admit I'm personally still in denial about how low-scoring my game is in about 1760... often, I've got over 300,000,000 pop and I'm debating the optimum launch time at this point, and the biggest issue is how much science for FT research should weigh against taxes to finish Recycling Plants, and engineers number over 500. It's shocking to see a mere 19 active! What hath this game wrought…

On a gloomy note, the world is still half under the influence of the infidels, I've yet to celebrate a WLT_ day, I've been making Cavalry not freight, and it seems like a even a 1000 score is decades away, LOL .

On the bright side, the English swine have just learned a lesson at the hands of Vet Indian Cavalry that they soon won't forget... and cowardly English walls only served to inspire my vets to new fury. London is mine, let the year be written as 1764, the same year the traitorous Celt capital fell. Now it's a race to crank out the dips and raise the gold before the English and Celts can rebuild a capital somewhere.

The Babylonians were discovered isolated at the end of a peninsula, throttled by the then-powerful English, and the lone Bab city only grew to size 2 after 5,700 years... It took two shot from a destroyer and one rifleman to end its miserable existence.

Unscathed by the mighty Indian communists are the stagnant Aztecs and sprawling Persians. The Persians have yet to feel the swords of Indian cavalry, a situation what will be rectified as the relatively unscathed after an orderly regroup from the glorious English campaigns.

Economically, good news is that much of the rest of the world has terrain that is much easier to tame than that of the Indian homeland... RRs and irrigation will be easy, once the enemy is subdued and attention can be focused on domestic matters. The lightning speed of the Celt campaign outstripped the ability of the Engineer corps to keep pace. And it's still going to take vast new quantities of Engineers to control the swamps and chop down the forests infesting the Indian homeland, though.

All in all… it is not the beginning of the end, but it is the end of the beginning...

I read the first part of corns post, and well corn the GOTM isn't suppose to be to everyone's liking all the time, it test our civing skills on every option.

------------------
Civilization God of War &amp; Economic Prosperity
http://www.civfanatics.com Staff and forum moderator
Elevators always smell different to midgets

Yes but what is the point of discussing of the possibilities for a game if they don't take our opinion into consideration!



------------------
<IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/fra.gif" border=0> Az <IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/gre.gif" border=0>

Originally posted by SunTzu:
I read the first part of corns post, and well corn the GOTM isn't suppose to be to everyone's liking all the time, it test our civing skills on every option.

Click to expand...

Oh SunTzu......you miss-understand. I wasn't complaining or *****ing, I was stating how crappy I think the land was. I have every intention of playing, and finishing the game. Like I said....I already have a hord of settlers raping the land for me.

I also intend to conquer the world....but the AI might stand in my way on that one!!! Plus I like the random maps, it really makes the game more like Civ. Unlinke pre-made map when you have a general idea of where you are and where others are.....that isn't as fun, in my opinion anyway.

------------------
<IMG SRC="http://images.honesty.com/imagedata/h/207/85/32078598.gif" border=0> I AM CANADIAN! <IMG SRC="http://images.honesty.com/imagedata/h/207/85/32078598.gif" border=0>
CivFanatics Moderator and Tech Support
CornEmpire Owner/Operator
My Civ 2 Scenario Page.

OK, before I start let's lay out one ground rule: no laughing at the newbie (well a little laughing is OK).

I've been playing king level (SP) with moderate success and decided to have a go at GOTM6. My results were, well... less than stellar (AKA I got hammered!)

I started my empire (Hah!) by dropping my first settler where he started, not daring to waste time looking for a better spot. I tried for quick expansion, but had to slow down cuz of happiness issues. I had a couple of warriors off scouting and I was aiming towards Monarchy.

I met the Vikings at a choke point and made peace, I was solicitous cuz I was weak. I prepared to expand to fill the choke point with a city and sent more warriors (only units I had at the time) to block the choke point.

It was just about this time the Vikings sucker punched me. I was weak, disorganized, had low production, few attack/defend units, not much money, dry mouth, and other symptoms similar to that of sugar pills.

The short version is that the Vikings rolled over my warriors with horsemen, took one of my cities and sued for peace. I only had four other cities and when they started in with their demands I'm afraid I was somewhat rude to them (you really should be able to type messages to the rulers of other civs because I had some very choice words for the Vikings). The Vikings surrounded each of my cities in turn and pummeled them into the dirt. I built stronger units during a respite and even tried to reestablish a city to be a defensive bullwark, but the writing was on the wall (although I hadn't discovered it so I don't know what it said). The Vikings rolled over me even before Jesus was born and all evidence of my empire disappeared into the swamps of this inimical landscape. (Sniff, sniff.)

Things are looking up

<IMG SRC="http://home.accglobal.net/~sroy/images/gom6pg.gif" border=0>

Haven't done any "we love days" at all.Went from Monarchy>Commie.Too many units out and about for a representative government.

The so called Great Library hasn't given me 1 lousy tech.Notta.

by Smash:

Haven't done any "we love days" at all.Went from Monarchy>Commie. Too many units out and about for a representative government.

Click to expand...

Same government pattern for me. In 1824, Democracy finally swept the Indian empire, and the people breath free. In 1828, the population swelled by 5 million, from 30 to 35 million, in the very first WLTP day celebration. Only one last vestiage of the English and one of the Persians remain for posterity's sake. The world is poised to discover the Automobile and begin to learn the meaning of pollution, with growing cities and churning factories. The long years of war have yielded 57 new cities cince the conclusion of the Viking Campaign. Several cities will be disbanded, however, as they block the proper progress of the empire.

My GL did yield about 8 advances, I think. But my opponents were quite cantankerous at times, yet in the end, fell under the onslaught of Indian Vet Cavalry.

<IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/image_uploads/GOTM6_1828.JPG" border=0>

Hey, this is my first image upload. Cool if it works...

Early going was greatly impacted by the Viking Campaign, and at times saw the Glorious Indians in 4th place. Not much vertical in the Indian trace, and the old addage, "Slow and Steady Wins the Race" comes to mind in GOTM 6, LOL.

EDIT: Add Image

[This message has been edited by starlifter (edited July 03, 2001).]

My first image upload in the prior post went so well that I'll try uploading a shot of my capital in 1000 AD. I'm not sure how it will look because of the necessary JPEG compression to fit 20K, Delhi circa 1000 AD.

<IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/image_uploads/GOTM6_1000_Delhi.JPG" border=0>


You might note a glaring omission... there are no trade routes yet! That's because of several related issues. First, I have only just begun overseas travel, due to the Viking war and (only partially successful) wonder efforts. Second, trade with my own cities is almost worthless because of Monarchy and high production emphasis. Eventually, Delhi would build a caravel (until Leos could later upgrade the triremes) to take caravans to London, and the 3 trade routes would be 7 and 8 in value, and the SSC would pump out 250-300 science per turn, even under Monarch/Communism.

"Normally", I would expect a capital such as this to be size 19-24, producing 29-34 shileds per turn, and around 300 science. So Delhi really is quite pitiful, but sometimes you just gotta make do and play the hand you're delt.

EDIT: More Info.

[This message has been edited by starlifter (edited July 03, 2001).]

Highly compressed JPEGSs don't look all that great, but I'll try a map of the main Indian homeland, circa 1000 AD.

[Sorry, need to remove the map images. Please only post images like city production, powergraph, that don't reveal the map. ~TF]

A great deal of settler effort is being used to hack a road through the middle of the map, to join the Viking area. This is mainly to allow fast deliveries of caravans to Delhi, so the science wonders can be constructed in Delhi (Astromomy is about 5 turns from discovery in 1000 AD).

The entire exploration of the bottom part of the map was made possible by bribing a white (Celt) trireme for about 140 gold. The little island just southeast of Delhi yielded an "Advanced Tribe" (no temple though), but the city was in a bad spot. So I converted it to a settler before it grew to size 2, and became a "NONE". Now that "NONE" is clearing the land until I can deliver a regular settler to found a city on the spot where the swamp is.

On the right side of the map, Madras and Calcutta are a huge source of shields (peat and forests), which provide caravans for wonders. Lahore (center right) was in misery for a long time because I built it on a swamp. Though slow growing, that swamp was the long-term best location.

Just south of Delhi, the Indians are on the (unknown as yet) main landmass. The Trireme and Diplomat south of Delhi will find the Celt city of Rhondda, and sell off the Hladir barracks to fund a 6 gold shortfall to bribe Rhondda for 375.

------------------

The next map is mainly the newly conquered Viking territory, and this map joins the first map (maps go side-by-side, with a bit of overlap).

[Sorry, need to remove the map images. Please only post images like city production, powergraph, that don't reveal the map. ~TF]

Hladir and Uppsala will be deliberately disbanded when they produce settlers. Other cities have been placed around them in more optimum locations than what the demented Vikings chose. Forests near the rivers on the far right make a great area very slow going for hundreds of years.

Well, that's a tour of the Indian world in 1000 AD <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif" border=0>.


EDIT: Add details.

[This message has been edited by starlifter (edited July 03, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Thunderfall (edited July 06, 2001).]

Like everyone (?) else I had a big war against the Vikings in the early years. I wouldn't be surprised if many Indian civilizations got wiped out by the Vikings in this GOTM. Luckily the AI twice demanded tribute which I happily paid to get time to organize my defences (most of my cities were defended by warriors) and prepare a counterattack - had the Vikings instead continued to attack they'd have crushed my empire in a few turns and I wouldn't be posting this

It soon became obvious that I had to mount an all-out war against the Vikings - they were a big nuisance and I also needed far more 'Lebensraum'. So I set taxes to maximum (in a monarchy) and started building barracks and lots of chariots, diplomats and triremes. The war took a *lot* of time but I was never in danger once I had organized my defenses and gained control of an important 'choke point' in a forest. The war was a mixture of bribes and chariot attacks.

Following the war my empire was mess. I had fallen behind in tech, not met any other civ and there was unhappines everywhere (I missed HG because of the war) but I had lots of cities (about 20) and this was around 600 AD. Fortunately I managed to get MP and instantly became #1 in science (got about 8 techs). This made it possible for me to become the first civ to get monotheism (crusaders rule !!) and then Mike. This was followed by a republic, heading straight for democracy/SOL/fundy - this looked more sensible than democracy since my infrastructure sucked (I built no improvements except for temples and barracks until the late 1700s but 'inherited' some from conquered cities).

I then conquered the world using dozens of crusaders, ships (triremes which became caravels which became galleons thanks to Leo) and diplomats - most of the AI civs where rather primitive so I bribed lots of cities.

I started with the hopelessly primitive Persians. Then I found the Aztecs on the same continent and bought their entire empire since they had the GW. Almost simultaneously the Babylonian empire fell victim to the mighty Indian crusaders and diplomats, except for one city in a strange place that took me a lot of time to discover (turned out it was actually in my 'backyard' !).

By this time the Indian army had become big enough to crush the English and then the Celts without resistance - the Celts were by far the biggest/most advanced AI civ. Strangely though, the Celts managed to bribe one of their cities back from me even though they only had about 500 gold and I had about 3000 . Needless to say I immediately bribed it back and punished them too.

It's the early 1800s now and only a single Celt city remains. Now I need to decide whether to aim for a big score or be lazy and destroy this city on the next turn. A SS is still far in the future - I'm still in fundy and researching Theory of Gravity and, assuming I go for a SS win will stay in fundy while building up infrastructure (temples, marketplaces, aqueducts etc.) and then switch to demo.

TheViking