(6-09a) Remove Maintenance and Per-Guild Gold Bonuses from Amphitheater/Opera House/Gallery

[Stalker0]

Counterproposal to: https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...r-gallery-opera-house-bonus-to-guilds.685826/

Current:

• Amphitheater: 1 maintenance. All writer's guilds produce 1 gold.
• Opera House: 4 maintenance. All artist's guilds produce 1 gold.
• Gallery: 4 maintenances. All musician's guilds produce 1 gold.

Proposal: Remove all gold bonus "per guild" that exist on the Amphitheatre, Opera House, and Gallery and reduce their maintenance to 0.

Rationale: I don't build these buildings for gold, the gold bonus is basically just offsetting the maintenance cost of these buildings to begin with. Any gold you make is simply yield bloat, and has no bearing on when I build the building. Its simpler and cleaner to just remove both the maintenance and the gold bonuses. Let them be maintenance free buildings that do their job: simple, clean, easy.

EDIT: I had original wrote to remove the maintenance from the guild itself. this was in error, I had intended it (in my head at least) to reduce it on the main buildings.


Database Changes

 

[Enginseer]

This does slightly nerf Wide.

 

[Rekk]

The point of the gold bonus is specifically to help wide.

 

[Anarcomu]

It also help fighting poverty in the city it is build

 

[ma_kuh]

Poverty works on gross or net yields? I would have assumed increasing maintenance would be bad for poverty.

I feel like this high maint + high scaler just makes you focus on actually finishing the guilds. Which might be a worthy goal. It's net-negative on maintenance whether you're tall or wide so I don't think it's helping wide at all (but also not really hurting, when compared to tall).

If we replaced the +1 yields with something like 25g when a Writer/Artist/Musician is born, scaling with number of buildings and era, but kept the high cost, that would at least be more interesting. Not sure if it would be better though.

 

[Stalker0]

It also help fighting poverty in the city it is build

ultimately though this change would help more than it hurts happiness wise. It means that every city beyond your 3 guild cities will always have poverty they cannot fight through yields. A Tall civ does absorb this penalty better than a wide one, but unless your tall civ is literally 3 cities they will encounter the issue as well.

For context btw, this is what the change would mean goldwise.

Amphitheater: -2 gold
Opera House: +1 gold
Gallery: +1 gold

Gold modifiers will magnify these slightly, though gold multipliers aren't generally very large in the game (10-15% in a lot of games).

 

[Stalker0]

Poverty works on gross or net yields? I would have assumed increasing maintenance would be bad for poverty.

Its gross, maintenance has no effect on poverty.

What this change would mean happiness wise is....your guild cities would get a little more poverty, and your non-guild cities would get a little less.

 

[Anarcomu]

You gain +1 gold to guild per building, so a better comparison would to reduce/remove maintenance from amphitheater etc. rather than guilds. If you have 10 amphitheater, you get +10 golds in Writer's guild, not 3.
Plus, for happiness purpose, only per-turn gross yields are taken into account. Which means buildings maintenance, pop food consumption, and instant yields, are not factored in.

 

[Stalker0]

You gain +1 gold to guild per building, so a better comparison would to reduce/remove maintenance from amphitheater etc. rather than guilds. If you have 10 amphitheater, you get +10 golds in Writer's guild, not 3.
Plus, for happiness purpose, only per-turn gross yields are taken into account. Which means buildings maintenance, pop food consumption, and instant yields, are not factored in.

oh! hehe that is actually completely my intention, but yeah I just wrote it completely wrong. My apologies! let me get that fixed up

 

[Jozrael]

oh! hehe that is actually completely my intention, but yeah I just wrote it completely wrong. My apologies! let me get that fixed up

Let the guilds just be a maintenance free building that does its job, simple, clean, easy.

Think still one more edit needed then?

 

[rkkn]

The point of the gold bonus is specifically to help wide.

then it should definitely be removed, because its existence is *bad* for wide, doing nothing but giving wide empires a little more poverty unhappiness

 

[Stalker0]

Think still one more edit needed then?

thank you, hopefully I got it all this time.

 

[azum4roll]

I'll assume this also applies to the Acropolis.

 

[azum4roll]

I sponsor this.

 

[Stalker0]

I'll assume this also applies to the Acropolis.

agreed

 

[Stalker0]

MAGI: Locked, as this is merged into the master voting thread.