[GS] Canada Discussion Thread

[Navelgazer]

I think she thought that Idaho and possibly Nevada would fit the case, but no. Every U.S. state has seen official battle.

 

[AmazonQueen]

I can’t really fault them there were a lot of VC winners. Just think Sweden might be a more peaceful civ but then again I think practically every nation has been involved in a war.

When I think of Sweden I think of Rurik or Gustav Adolphus so to me they don't seem a peaceful civ.
Canada may have been involved in its share of wars but I can't think of one it started. It was either invaded (usually by the US) or entered because its allies were involved.

 

[Navelgazer]

Kristina's Sweden (I know a lot of people hate the idea of her as leader but I'm excited to see what they do with it) will almost certainly be about science and culture and possibly religion, as that's what Kristina was about. Given what we've seen about Canada it wouldn't shock me if they have no specific terrain bonuses at all.

 

[Rule_of_Law]

I can’t really fault them there were a lot of VC winners. Just think Sweden might be a more peaceful civ but then again I think practically every nation has been involved in a war.

Sweden is a peaceful civ now, but when the Swedish Empire was at it's peak it was a very martial country. Canada, in part due to how young of a country it is, has only gone to war as a part of coalitions.

I would've preferred the ability to relate to emergencies, but I think it will works well within the game mechanics to help Canada to survive until it's bonuses kick in for late game cultural/diplo victories.

 

[scry887]

I'm totally fine with Canada being on the weak side. Some civs have to be bottom tier, that doesn't fuss me at all. Food and production from tile sized hockey rinks, though, is a different story.

It shouldn't necessarily be about weak vs. strong Civs; Civilizations should each have a unique playing style which I think Civ 6 does an amazing job at. Everyone should be gravitating towards Civs that suit their playing style, and other Civs should be enticing because of its unique playing style. Essentially each Civ should have a fair chance at achieving victory by using its advantages that other Civs lack.

It's just that I don't think that Canada's advantages are strong enough to cover its weaknesses (being weaker units and mediocre Tundra bonuses). They absolutely made the Civ brilliantly but it is going to need an update after release. I would either like better advantages for Tundra or I would like a boost (of some kind) to the mounties.

And Laurier better damn well speak French once in a while...

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Maybe America should get a Basketball Court or a Baseball Field as a unique improvement?

I would have been happy with a Baseball Field as a replacement for the Stadium. Baseball is as American as, well, baseball and apple pie. Stadiums are late-game buildings and America is designed to be a late game cultural Civ, so the building is a natural fit for what America is designed to be. The Film Studio fills the same role just as well, but a Baseball Field would have been perfectly acceptable, in my humble opinion.

So why is this different than Canada receiving a Hockey Rink? For one, we now have two postcolonial Civs, both former British colonies who actually border one another, who both fill the late-game Cultural Civ niche. Two, baseball is played by far more people than ice hockey and is more widespread than ice hockey is. Three, America's military history offers plenty of inspiration for unique units. If Canada's best candidate for a UU is a Monty (I don't believe it is, but that's what they went with) then pairing that with a Hockey Rink UU just smacks of stereotyping.

Baseball is horrible and boring and this is coming from an American.
I like films better and doesn't make sense, in my opinion, to replace what appears to be a "football" stadium with a baseball field, which I believe is more popular than baseball. Of course I'm Texan so my view may be biased based on the region where I live.

 

[Cagarustus]

Im thinking that Canada’s abilities are upside down. The Last Best West should be the civilisation ability and four faces of peace should be the leader’s ability (with lester Pearson).

I suppose we can always mod this ability anyway.

 

[tedhebert]

Canadians don't party if their team isn't playing?

Canadians party all the time ! Period ! No if and buts about it

 

[UWHabs]

Im thinking that Canada’s abilities are upside down. The Last Best West should be the civilisation ability and four faces of peace should be the leader’s ability (with lester Pearson).

I suppose we can always mod this ability anyway.

Wouldn't shock me if that's what they originally designed for, but then decided that Laurier would be a better leader choice, and just decided to flip them around and call it a day.

 

[DWilson]

Canadians party all the time ! Period ! No if and buts about it

But what about when someone is accidentally less than totally polite (and it's not related to hockey)?

 

[Cagarustus]

Wouldn't shock me if that's what they originally designed for, but then decided that Laurier would be a better leader choice, and just decided to flip them around and call it a day.

Fireaxis would’ve wanted to appeal to French Canadians who are after all a significant minority in Canada. I don’t know if Pearson was popular among French Canadians. I know that Laurier was and still is.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

Baseball is horrible and boring and this is coming from an American.
I like films better and doesn't make sense, in my opinion, to replace what appears to be a "football" stadium with a baseball field, which I believe is more popular than baseball. Of course I'm Texan so my view may be biased based on the region where I live.

I am a baseball fan, though I can see how people think it is boring (nobody's ever accused me of being exciting). But it is absolutely ingrained in the culture, national unity, even the language so much that we usually don't even notice. It would probably make it difficult for non-speakers though. "Ballpark Figure." "Cover your bases." "You threw me a curveball there." "Rain check." Etc. I'd hate to be an outsider and have someone throw me one of these "out of left field."

Baseball does spread and strengthen culture (or at least did). You can see that in Japan and Korea, or the Caribbean or South America where Americans spent time and brought their game with them. It happens with hockey too. I'm not sure they knocked it out of the park with that choice, but it wasn't the whiff that people are saying it was either.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Baseball does spread and strengthen culture (or at least did). You can see that in Japan and Korea, or the Caribbean or South America where Americans spent time and brought their game with them. It happens with hockey too. I'm not sure they knocked it out of the park with that choice, but it wasn't the whiff that people are saying it was either.

I'm not denying that at all, it just seems to me that American Football is more prevalent and more unique to the States and is fine being represented in game by the stadium, with baseball being the second most popular American sport.
Honestly I thought it would make more sense if the hockey rink replaced the stadium for Canada, for that very reason.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

I'm not denying that at all, it just seems to me that American Football is more prevalent and more unique to the States and is fine being represented in game by the stadium. Honestly I thought it would make more sense if the hockey rink replaced the stadium for Canada, for that very reason.

Yeah it's a little strange as an improvement. Probably a nicer looking graphic this way though

 

[Lord Lakely]

And Laurier better damn well speak French once in a while...

Don't worry, he does. Near the end of the FL, you can hear Wilfred's introduction if you listen closely

"Au nom du peuple du Canada, bienvenue! Je suis Prémier Ministre Laurier!"

Oh and someone on facebook asked whether Laurier was bilingual and whoever's handing the Civ Fbook profile answered that he is

 

[AmazonQueen]

I am a baseball fan, though I can see how people think it is boring (nobody's ever accused me of being exciting). But it is absolutely ingrained in the culture, national unity, even the language so much that we usually don't even notice. It would probably make it difficult for non-speakers though. "Ballpark Figure." "Cover your bases." "You threw me a curveball there." "Rain check." Etc. I'd hate to be an outsider and have someone throw me one of these "out of left field."

Baseball does spread and strengthen culture (or at least did). You can see that in Japan and Korea, or the Caribbean or South America where Americans spent time and brought their game with them. It happens with hockey too. I'm not sure they knocked it out of the park with that choice, but it wasn't the whiff that people are saying it was either.

Compared to cricket its a riveting fast moving game even if it is just rounders with armour

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Yeah it's a little strange as an improvement. Probably a nicer looking graphic this way though

I was envisioning a NHL style arena, but an open air rink does make it look good graphically, even if it is as big as a farm or the golden gate bridge.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Kristina's Sweden (I know a lot of people hate the idea of her as leader but I'm excited to see what they do with it) will almost certainly be about science and culture and possibly religion, as that's what Kristina was about. Given what we've seen about Canada it wouldn't shock me if they have no specific terrain bonuses at all.

Considering that Kristina wanted to collect great people of all sorts and was a massive bookworm I expect her to get a bonus towards earning Great People. Possibly tied with a Nobel Prize gimmick (which I'd normally roll me eyes at but we JUST had Canada released with Ice Hockey Rinks and no Surprise Wars, so )

 

[Wingednosering]

Man, I hadn't been following this XPAC at all until somebody linked me this (found the last XPAC severely underwhelming).

As a Canadian, I'm happy we're in (and not too early either...we aren't that special) but I'm not too happy with the UI or UU.

Firstly, Laurier is the best leader choice they could've made, so well done there. He's highly regarded and is one of our least controversial greats. I will point out that he looks about as boring on a lecture on Canadian history, so again, well done Firaxis!

Second, the extra resources and tundra bonuses are good, but a little misleading. Most of the Canadian population is as far south as the northern reaches of the US. We don't exactly farm in the arctic, but I get it's more of a gameplay and 'take the land nobody else wants' thing.

Third, the surprise war exclusion feels like the opposite of the leader ability. This has great flavor, but seems pretty lame from a gameplay perspective. We've never been attacked as an independent nation and we've never initiated a war in our history. Our only sight of combat is when we support allies' war efforts. But on the flip side, if you start next to Laurier and he forward settles you, there's nothing you can do about it. The opposite is also true. Would not surprise me if you can just irritate the AIs to no end and push your own agenda and never feel the consequences.

The UI and the UU...this is where my issues come in.

The Mounties are lame. They're a stereotypical joke, even up here in Canada. It's especially galling when we do actually have other UU options. Our aces and ground soldiers in WWI were both respected for their contributions. Our WWI successes are part of what gained us our independence!

The ice hockey rink is weird and again, seems like we're the butt of a joke, but at least there aren't immediately obvious better options. I was hoping for some sort of railroad Ui if we ever got in, but that would probably be more suited to John A, not Laurier.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Considering that Kristina wanted to collect great people of all sorts and was a massive bookworm I expect her to get a bonus towards earning Great People. Possibly tied with a Nobel Prize gimmick (which I'd normally roll me eyes at but we JUST had Canada released with Ice Hockey Rinks and no Surprise Wars, so )

I was thinking her agenda might be tied to accumulating great works from Great People, or other means, to differentiate her from Pedro, however that would be what I wanted for Ashurbanipal for Assyria.
As for accumulating science Seondeok already has that so, maybe a mixture of earning a lot of both culture and science would be a good agenda for her instead.