Civs founding cities...

[Prozac1964]

I've just started playing on King a month ago and there is a trend that is ticking me off.
It's when another civ comes along and plops down a city touching my borders.
And sometimes more than one city.

An example: I'm on one continent with Sweden and Indonesia. Sweden is at the top of the map
spread out in a good strategic pattern (3 cities) and I settled England at the bottom of the map.
Then along came Indonesia and they dropped 2 cities touching my borders. That takes tiles away from me.
Then it gets all cramped up and threats start to fly.

Is there a reason why the AI does this. Lets another civ found cities in an aggressive manner?

I'm still a noob, so I'm asking the experienced players here. Thanks for any help.

 

[phillipwyllie]

If you look at the CiV interactive AI Bias chart at http://civdata.com/ you'll see Gajah has a boldness of 6 which is +/- 2 iirc so in your game be 8. I suspect that your diplomacy towards him wasn't too hot and that he want's to invade you. Classic sign. Another one is he is on another continent and needs those cities for his UA. Another one is he wants to send a trade caravan or 2 to you.

 

[MariusMagnus]

Usually the AI will also try to forward settle you if there's valuable resources just outside of your borders they want, which certainly makes it all the more annoying when they do it. My suggestion would be to have scouts situated outside of your borders to keep watch for intruders. When you see another civ's settler getting too close for comfort, ask that leader to not settle near you, or declare on them and try and take the settler if it has no unit protecting it. You can also try to trap the settler / stop it from passing with your own units if you have enough to spare, and culture bombing is always an option if all else fails.

 

[Prozac1964]

If you look at the CiV interactive AI Bias chart at http://civdata.com/ you'll see Gajah has a boldness of 6 which is +/- 2 iirc so in your game be 8. I suspect that your diplomacy towards him wasn't too hot and that he want's to invade you. Classic sign. Another one is he is on another continent and needs those cities for his UA. Another one is he wants to send a trade caravan or 2 to you.

That was an amazing chart...so many stats but I'll refer to it next time.

Usually the AI will also try to forward settle you if there's valuable resources just outside of your borders they want, which certainly makes it all the more annoying when they do it. My suggestion would be to have scouts situated outside of your borders to keep watch for intruders. When you see another civ's settler getting too close for comfort, ask that leader to not settle near you, or declare on them and try and take the settler if it has no unit protecting it. You can also try to trap the settler / stop it from passing with your own units if you have enough to spare, and culture bombing is always an option if all else fails.

Great tip on posting scouts. I never knew "not to settle near my borders" I didn't know it's use but I'm going to use that now, and I surely didn't think of blocking a settler. Wow, thanks for the help!

 

[pdxmm]

If Indonesia is coming from a different continent then that is the best civ to have forward settle you. I always figured it was one of the devs way to encourage warfare. Best part of all is how the civ will now get mad at you for touching borders. Hey it could have been worse and been Shaka.

 

[Prozac1964]

Best part of all is how the civ will now get mad at you for touching borders. Hey it could have been worse and been Shaka.

LOL yep that's exactly what they do! Get mad at me for settling near them, and yes Shaka would be even worse

 

[MariusMagnus]

Randomly denouncing you for no foreseeable reason literally the turn after you first meet him is Shaka's way of saying he loves you

Honestly, being forward settled by Attila is worse than Shaka IMO.

 

[beetle]

The way the AIs like to forward settle on you is definitely one of the more annoying aspects of the game. With practice, you will be able to work out effective counter measures. Mostly it is getting your expos up asap and blocking the one or two tiles 3 hexes from your cities that are attractive to the AI.

Pro Tip: If your starting territory has a bunch of one particular lux, and you leave even a single copy available, an AI will cross the map to take it. If you can not get all the copies within your borders, then use a GG to claim it.

 

[Cicerosaurus]

All the AI's will do it- and they will bypass vacant islands just to get under your skin. It is a part of the game, as is you will get technology stolen.

You can try refusing to exchange embassies (that works at times although I have no idea why) but be very careful of making a Declaration of Friendship early as it is normally a signal they are going to settle your territory and if you take their settler it is a big red mark against you.

 

[Barhoumi]

Randomly denouncing you for no foreseeable reason literally the turn after you first meet him is Shaka's way of saying he loves you

Honestly, being forward settled by Attila is worse than Shaka IMO.

Who is Atilla?

 

[MariusMagnus]

Who is Atilla?

He's the leader of the Huns, a group of nomads from the Asian steppes most well known for their role in the fall of Rome. Ingame, Attila has access to battering rams and horse archers, so if he forward settles you early on and you're not ready to deal with him, he can just absolutely devastate your cities.

 

[sixty4half]

You can try refusing to exchange embassies (that works at times although I have no idea why)

The reason it sometimes works and sometimes doesn't depends on how you met that civ. If your unit ran into their unit out in the middle of the wilderness, or found their city while exploring, then that AI doesn't know where your cities are. If he doesn't know where you are, he can't forward settle you. He may accidentally forward settle you simply because he saw a lux in the direction your cities are, without knowing they were there.

If you give an Embassy to that civ, he now knows where your Capital is, even if he didn't find it through exploration.

Embassy won't matter if this civ found your city with his unit during exploration. He'll forward settle the city that he found.

 

[beetle]

I don’t exchange embassies until I am confident that I can get the decent expo locations that I want. It is definitively a beacon that attracts settlers.

There is a setting in one of the xml files that increasing minimum settling distance from 3 to 4. I was running that for a long time, and it certainly let me be less stressed out. @Prozac1964, you might try that.

It turns out that the setting was changing the effects of shared games and not just my own, so I reverted. But I have gotten better at blocking and claiming expo locations, so now it is hardly an issue for me.

 

[Scribls]

To be honest, it isn't random but it is somewhat rng based in that the AI starts with a settler on deity and will move in a direction to settle a city. If it happens to be toward you (because of resources, luxuries, whatever) than there really isn't much you can do short of killing it when you get a chance.

I don't think it is heavily influenced by AI interactions early game because I have had it happen to me before the AI has even met me so they are settling "blind" so to speak. I feel like 1 in 5 games maybe I will lose tiles in my capital to expanding AI.

Now on king difficulty (no starting settler) if you are getting beat to expands you may want to prioritize expanding to contested areas more quickly or positioning units to block AI settlements in your direction.

 

[odpadnik]

To be honest, it isn't random but it is somewhat rng based in that the AI starts with a settler on deity and will move in a direction to settle a city. If it happens to be toward you (because of resources, luxuries, whatever) than there really isn't much you can do short of killing it when you get a chance.

I don't think it is heavily influenced by AI interactions early game because I have had it happen to me before the AI has even met me so they are settling "blind" so to speak. I feel like 1 in 5 games maybe I will lose tiles in my capital to expanding AI.

Now on king difficulty (no starting settler) if you are getting beat to expands you may want to prioritize expanding to contested areas more quickly or positioning units to block AI settlements in your direction.

That's what I do usually, block AI settlements and just work my way forward from there... Works Most of the time...

 

[beetle]

It also seems to me that, regardless of not sharing embassy, if I move my initial settler more than one hex that I am much more likely to be forward-settled. That might be confirmation bias, as no one has turned up code to support this clear impression of mine. OTOH the game seeds initial settlers in what it considers to be mathematically the best spots, and the AIs “cheat” in other ways. But like I said with my initial reply to OP, my habits are such now that this particular aspect of the game is no longer much of an annoyance.

 

[Scribls]

It also seems to me that, regardless of not sharing embassy, if I move my initial settler more than one hex that I am much more likely to be forward-settled. That might be confirmation bias, as no one has turned up code to support this clear impression of mine. OTOH the game seeds initial settlers in what it considers to be mathematically the best spots, and the AIs “cheat” in other ways. But like I said with my initial reply to OP, my habits are such now that this particular aspect of the game is no longer much of an annoyance.

Well - you are almost always moving towards another AI meaning that their capital is probably closer to you. Seems like it might be confirmation bias along with a direct effect of their being less space between you. Would be interesting to see the AI code if it prioritizes "contested" settlements in any way.

 

[odpadnik]

Well - you are almost always moving towards another AI meaning that their capital is probably closer to you. Seems like it might be confirmation bias along with a direct effect of their being less space between you. Would be interesting to see the AI code if it prioritizes "contested" settlements in any way.

Can you actually do that - check the code I mean? Would be interesting to find out...

 

[MariusMagnus]

Can you actually do that - check the code I mean? Would be interesting to find out...

Yes, you can. It's how mods like Artificial Unintelligence are able to so effectively improve the AI. As for whether or not the AI is more likely to forward settle you if you move from your starting plot, I don't know.

 

[plus]

I've just started playing on King a month ago and there is a trend that is ticking me off.
It's when another civ comes along and plops down a city touching my borders.
And sometimes more than one city.

An example: I'm on one continent with Sweden and Indonesia. Sweden is at the top of the map
spread out in a good strategic pattern (3 cities) and I settled England at the bottom of the map.
Then along came Indonesia and they dropped 2 cities touching my borders. That takes tiles away from me.
Then it gets all cramped up and threats start to fly.

Is there a reason why the AI does this. Lets another civ found cities in an aggressive manner?

I'm still a noob, so I'm asking the experienced players here. Thanks for any help.

dont give embassy at least till turn 100.also i set distane between cities to 5 tiles so even when u trade embassy and they come settle near u it will not damage your tiles.