Do you tend to denounce other civs? The AI always will denounce me at some point, or points depending on ideology, throughout the game. I bite my tongue and usually do not do it back due to the diplomacy score but not sure if I should in retaliation.
Denouncing
- Thread starter rover6695
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miaasma
King
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it's a strategic decision. if one civ is warmongering and getting denounced by the rest of the world, denouncing them yourself will make everyone else like you more. alternatively, if many civs are already friends with you and you denounce someone, you may make whoever you denounce a target for your friends to denounce as well. it's a method of controlling diplomacy
sometimes it will make no difference (except for the civ you are denouncing) and other times it can be a poor decision if the civ you are denouncing is friends with many others
sometimes it will make no difference (except for the civ you are denouncing) and other times it can be a poor decision if the civ you are denouncing is friends with many others
sixty4half
Prince
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Pretty much that.
Also, sometimes your ally will ask you to denounce someone. That can be a trap or a good thing. Denouncing a world wide pariah will often have good consequences while denouncing someone in the superpower clique could have bad consequences. If you accept, your friends will like you more. But if you refuse I don't think it causes them to dislike you.
And sometimes CSs will give you a denounce quest where all they want you to do is denounce the civ that's been extorting money from them. This is pretty rare and I've only seen it a few times in all the games I've played.
Also, sometimes your ally will ask you to denounce someone. That can be a trap or a good thing. Denouncing a world wide pariah will often have good consequences while denouncing someone in the superpower clique could have bad consequences. If you accept, your friends will like you more. But if you refuse I don't think it causes them to dislike you.
And sometimes CSs will give you a denounce quest where all they want you to do is denounce the civ that's been extorting money from them. This is pretty rare and I've only seen it a few times in all the games I've played.
sixty4half
Prince
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Nope.
Do not denounce unless it actually benefits you. For example, when most of the world has denounced that AI, it's beneficial to denounce for additional boost. Denouncing adds a negative modifier and there are additional negative modifier if there are friends to whoever you denounced.
Absolutely
denouncing a civ that everyone hates is a great way of making friends or calming other AIs that you're on the fence with.
Also if you want to declare war on a someone you have a declaration of friendship with and you don't want to get the real nasty "you've declared war on your friends" diplomatic penalty then denounce them first. Next turn you can declare war. Just remember to trade as much resources for their lump sum of gold. You'll get to keep their gold and you'll your resources back.
You'll still get a backstab diplomatic penalty but its not as severe iirc. The AI seems to work in this way to. If a friend intends to attack you they'll denounce you first.
denouncing a civ that everyone hates is a great way of making friends or calming other AIs that you're on the fence with.
Also if you want to declare war on a someone you have a declaration of friendship with and you don't want to get the real nasty "you've declared war on your friends" diplomatic penalty then denounce them first. Next turn you can declare war. Just remember to trade as much resources for their lump sum of gold. You'll get to keep their gold and you'll your resources back.
You'll still get a backstab diplomatic penalty but its not as severe iirc. The AI seems to work in this way to. If a friend intends to attack you they'll denounce you first.
phillipwyllie
Wannabe Deity
Denouncing a civ will make civs that like you more than them like you even more, and civs that like them more than you hate you even more. Also it will most likely make the civ you denounced hate you for the entire game.
I denounce when I want to go to war and want to test the ground. If after the denouncement I get several requests to DOw then it worked.
I denounce when I want to go to war and want to test the ground. If after the denouncement I get several requests to DOw then it worked.
sixty4half
Prince
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Denouncing civs that a warmonger has denounced will get you closer with that warmonger and reduce the possibility of them DoWing you (sometimes).
adsin15
Warlord
The message where another civ asks you to denounce somebody else ALWAYS tricks me.
It's looks exactly like another message, I forget which one, but every time I get asked to denounce somebody by the AI I end up agreeing to do it and then I have to go back and restore the game.
It's looks exactly like another message, I forget which one, but every time I get asked to denounce somebody by the AI I end up agreeing to do it and then I have to go back and restore the game.
danaphanous
religious fanatic
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I'm pretty sure if you denounce a friend you get a global diplo hit with everyone just like attacking a friend. The best move is to wait for the friendship to expire, then denounce (if you care too) and gather war support, then DOW. It is the only way to avoid diplo penalties with people other then the friend target.
I think the denouncing a friend is still considering "backstabbing" by everyone you know but it is less then DOWing the friend.
I think the denouncing a friend is still considering "backstabbing" by everyone you know but it is less then DOWing the friend.
Sharples
Prince
I've had all nations on a huge map denounce and declare war on me for taking two cities.
adsin15
Warlord
When somebody denounces me I like to GG bomb them. I find that makes them super duper angry.
I actually had a game where a friend asked me to denounce someone and I said no, then they said okay and didn't backstab.
I used to ignore the denouncing portion of the game but have found it to be super useful in my recent games.
Whenever a civ tries to ban your chief luxury in the world congress try denouncing them. In a couple of games all the other AI civs jumped on board and starting denouncing the civ too. Even though the civ was my 'friend' I'm pretty sure they were maneuvering to back stab me, and the denouncement steered their attention to another civ instead. The AI is a bastard, they'll do things like get you to declare friendship right before trying to settle a city beside your capital so there are 'friends' and there are 'friends'.
Just make sure that the other civ isn't peaceful. If the other civ is someone like Siam then don't bother, all the AI civs will defend them and you'll antagonize all the AI civs.
If you pay attention you can also see what another civ really thinks of you by the face of their leader during diplomacy. Harold will wear his helmet when he's about to declare war, if a civ is negative towards you their leader's face will darken, etc... so pay attention to these things.
I used to ignore the denouncing portion of the game but have found it to be super useful in my recent games.
Whenever a civ tries to ban your chief luxury in the world congress try denouncing them. In a couple of games all the other AI civs jumped on board and starting denouncing the civ too. Even though the civ was my 'friend' I'm pretty sure they were maneuvering to back stab me, and the denouncement steered their attention to another civ instead. The AI is a bastard, they'll do things like get you to declare friendship right before trying to settle a city beside your capital so there are 'friends' and there are 'friends'.
Just make sure that the other civ isn't peaceful. If the other civ is someone like Siam then don't bother, all the AI civs will defend them and you'll antagonize all the AI civs.
If you pay attention you can also see what another civ really thinks of you by the face of their leader during diplomacy. Harold will wear his helmet when he's about to declare war, if a civ is negative towards you their leader's face will darken, etc... so pay attention to these things.
blitzkrieg1980
Octobrist
Is that really a thing? I mean I thought their appearances corresponded to their attitude towards you. In other words, if a leader is hostile towards you then they will have the angry dark face and helmet on etc. Does it really clue you in so that if they're friendly but actually don't like you they will have those facial expressions? I've got to look for that in my next game.
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HughFran
Prince
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- Jul 24, 2015
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I don't respond when I am denounced but if another Civ is warmongering all over the place I will denounce them. It is a tactic I use on in-game bullies. I WANT them to hate me because I WANT them to declare war on me so that I can liberate city-states (loads of bonuses) and bring them down to size. Of course I'll only do this if I think I can take them. Otherwise, I'll stay silent and prepare my defences if they are bigger than me and I am a potential next target!
I think the leader's face and how they say thing is related to how they feel, except when they're being deceptive. You can get that information easily if you test how much they pay for you luxury anyway. If they are willing to pay 7 gpt, then they're still friendly. If they pay 5 gpt or less, then you have a serious problem and will get denounced or invaded. 6gpt usually means they hate you for some reason, but still not that bad.
blitzkrieg1980
Octobrist
That's how I generally gauge their actual "friendliness" (using trade deal fairness). But I'm curious as to if their facial expressions represent their hidden feelings or just follow the displayed attitude.
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miaasma
King
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if someone asks you to denounce someone, refusing will (in my experience) always result in you getting denounced
usually if i get denounced i'll respond if i am friends with any other leaders, in order to make whoever denounced me a target. it makes it easier to form diplomatic coalitions and can put me in a better situation if the civ that denounced me is a threat (makes people more inclined to declare war on them)
usually if i get denounced i'll respond if i am friends with any other leaders, in order to make whoever denounced me a target. it makes it easier to form diplomatic coalitions and can put me in a better situation if the civ that denounced me is a threat (makes people more inclined to declare war on them)
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