Did barbarians get a boost in BNW?

[docbud]

That' because Major AI factions get a HUGE bonus against barbarians in combat. While humans is somewhere in 30% the AIs get something like 100% boost, I dunno the exact amount. And this is why barbarians always beeline for the human's units cuz AI's units is almost impossible for barbarians to kill.

I've often wondered about that. I think it's ridiculous that barb units can repeatedly attack an AI unit, and the next turn the AI unit is totally healed. I've seen barb archers shoot an AI unit for 10 turns or more, and the AI unit never dies.

 

[Uzael36]

I'm not sure that is true, it is more likely many of the AI just has opened up Honor, which gives you a boost against barbarians. You just have to be smart around the barbarian camps. One thing I've learned is if you see a bunch of barbs, moving out of site will cause them to split up, and a couple turns later when you return, you usually only find 1. I also do not heal up with the heal command anymore, and just use defense instead, which will prevent those embarrassing moments you let a unit be whacked for 5 turns and die, and did nothing to stop it.

 

[Socratatus]

I'm not sure that is true, it is more likely many of the AI just has opened up Honor, which gives you a boost against barbarians. You just have to be smart around the barbarian camps. One thing I've learned is if you see a bunch of barbs, moving out of site will cause them to split up, and a couple turns later when you return, you usually only find 1. I also do not heal up with the heal command anymore, and just use defense instead, which will prevent those embarrassing moments you let a unit be whacked for 5 turns and die, and did nothing to stop it.

This is what I assumed. Also can`t the AI use its insta-heal that we get sometimes because there are times I`ve seen it get killed. And be in defense-heal mode too? Also, I`ve seen Barbs pick on an AI Civ`s troop in preference to mine.

 

[Uzael36]

This is what I assumed. Also can`t the AI use its insta-heal that we get sometimes because there are times I`ve seen it get killed. And be in defense-heal mode too? Also, I`ve seen Barbs pick on an AI Civ`s troop in preference to mine.

I know the AI likes to use their unit promotions to heal as well.

 

[number51]

I've been playing England on archipelago. That combo itself is a bit over powered, but with barb ships floating around it makes it too easy to win.

Beeline navy techs
Build Galleass
Find barb camps, kill weak barb ships
Go around the corner wait 3 turns for more barb ships to spawn
kill them
Repeat until you get promotions to Logistics (2 attacks per turn)

At this point I have a bunch of Ships of the Line with logistics, basically floating artillary. On archipelago all cities are pretty much coastal and dead meat when I sail up with promoted SOL's, one or two turns at most to take them down to zero, walk in with any unit you like.

Those Barb kills get you promotions with no war until you want it.

 

[Callonia]

I've been playing England on archipelago. That combo itself is a bit over powered, but with barb ships floating around it makes it too easy to win.

Beeline navy techs
Build Galleass
Find barb camps, kill weak barb ships
Go around the corner wait 3 turns for more barb ships to spawn
kill them
Repeat until you get promotions to Logistics (2 attacks per turn)

At this point I have a bunch of Ships of the Line with logistics, basically floating artillary. On archipelago all cities are pretty much coastal and dead meat when I sail up with promoted SOL's, one or two turns at most to take them down to zero, walk in with any unit you like.

Those Barb kills get you promotions with no war until you want it.

Frankly its very easy to win a war against the AIs anyways any combo will beat them over hard. Doesn't matter what you do as long as you're not actively trying to lose. Even then its unlikely to happen xD

AI don't even know how to use its navy most of the times but once in a blue moon they will actually have a real naval fleet and use it to ram and sink your naval fleet whether you want it to happen or not and turn it into a battle of attrition.

So far, Gods n Kings Iroquois managed to pull off a spectacular stalemate on me after I sunk several hundred of his ships. And it has never happened again.

 

[number51]

Frankly its very easy to win a war against the AIs anyways any combo will beat them over hard. Doesn't matter what you do as long as you're not actively trying to lose. Even then its unlikely to happen xD

AI don't even know how to use its navy most of the times but once in a blue moon they will actually have a real naval fleet and use it to ram and sink your naval fleet whether you want it to happen or not and turn it into a battle of attrition.

So far, Gods n Kings Iroquois managed to pull off a spectacular stalemate on me after I sunk several hundred of his ships. And it has never happened again.

Not really the point. With good tactics barbs can be a great way to get unit promotions without starting a war until your military is ready.

My specific example was not about how to defeat AI navel units (you're right, that's easy) but more about how Frigates, or in my case Brit SOL, can promote enough to become floating artillery without fighting an early war.

 

[Callonia]

Not really the point. With good tactics barbs can be a great way to get unit promotions without starting a war until your military is ready.

My specific example was not about how to defeat AI navel units (you're right, that's easy) but more about how Frigates, or in my case Brit SOL, can promote enough to become floating artillery without fighting an early war.

Well.. that's fair enough xD

 

[Montezuma II]

I've been playing England on archipelago. That combo itself is a bit over powered, but with barb ships floating around it makes it too easy to win.

Beeline navy techs
Build Galleass
Find barb camps, kill weak barb ships
Go around the corner wait 3 turns for more barb ships to spawn
kill them
Repeat until you get promotions to Logistics (2 attacks per turn)

At this point I have a bunch of Ships of the Line with logistics, basically floating artillary. On archipelago all cities are pretty much coastal and dead meat when I sail up with promoted SOL's, one or two turns at most to take them down to zero, walk in with any unit you like.

Those Barb kills get you promotions with no war until you want it.

I thought you can only receive 2 promotions from barbarians, after that you receive no xp?

 

[BeardedLeftie68]

I thought you can only receive 2 promotions from barbarians, after that you receive no xp?

Correct, although there is a mod that allows unlimited xp from barbs

 

[revelation216]

In my experience it also depends on the map you play and its size. Large/huge pangaea maps will have more barbarians roaming around for sure.

This is because barbs spawn in unpopulated areas, and on larger maps, there are more unpopulated areas especially earlier on.

 

[DocRock]

I think in comparison to 4, Barbs are just a small annoyance. Why? Because your city can shoot them. With no raging barbarians, it seems close to impossible that Barbs are doing serious damage to your empire when you have 1 city + 1 archer around. On Emperor at least.

You just need to protect your workers and improvements, but just putting your archer on top of your worker while firing at the Barbs with it + the city is more than enough.

Also I would like to add that it's much better to keep the camps until you get a quest for them. Usually most of the Barbs tend to go for the AI in my games, so I let them handle it... occassionally picking up the stolen worker/settler after that.

 

[danaphanous]

Funny you say that because I was hesitant at first for that exact same reason, until I was content on being a wuss and turning them off.

Now I love it and don't wanna go back. I also start in the classical era which makes worrying about the ancient era technologies a thing of the past (literally ).

The Advanced Setup is for the player preference. Try it, and if you don't like it go back. You don't HAVE to play the default way, play so its fun for you.

For the record, you're not a wuss.

I do some customization too, however, I went the other way and now only play on raging barbs. I like them. I hate losing trade routes to them, but they are fun and give early experience, gold, and CS quests.

One thing to be aware of if you haven't noticed already though: the AI loses their free starter techs over you when you skip the ancient era. So you've effectively removed the main advantage in Deity and Immortal levels other than some starter units. Those free techs are supposed to let the AI snowball for a while, Simply starting classical makes those levels way easier, and allows you to pass them in tech much quicker, so be aware of that change--It's like dropping 2 levels or so just making that choice which I did not fully understand at first until I found myself kicking Shaka's Deity butt early-game with tech-parity and said: "something is wrong here". I could never have done that being behind on tech as impi vs. spearmen and comps is a bit harder than having my own pikemen and XB's. I do like the feel though, you don't have to wait ages to chop and hook up luxuries. Libraries and granaries are ready off the bat. Things just zoom up so much quicker. That's essentially how Diety AI start so that is the feeling I imagine they have plus a few free workers and a settler.

 

[Tachii]

Barbs on higher difficulties help the player. Slows AI from settling, gets more influence from City-states, and the possibility of grabbing a free worker are all good reasons I leave it on. Makes no sense to have no military whatsoever to defend your own borders anyway.

 

[Jensonian]

One thing to be aware of if you haven't noticed already though: the AI loses their free starter techs over you when you skip the ancient era. So you've effectively removed the main advantage in Deity and Immortal levels other than some starter units. Those free techs are supposed to let the AI snowball for a while, Simply starting classical makes those levels way easier, and allows you to pass them in tech much quicker, so be aware of that change--It's like dropping 2 levels or so just making that choice which I did not fully understand at first until I found myself kicking Shaka's Deity butt early-game with tech-parity and said: "something is wrong here". I could never have done that being behind on tech as impi vs. spearmen and comps is a bit harder than having my own pikemen and XB's. I do like the feel though, you don't have to wait ages to chop and hook up luxuries. Libraries and granaries are ready off the bat. Things just zoom up so much quicker. That's essentially how Diety AI start so that is the feeling I imagine they have plus a few free workers and a settler.

Thank you for the lesson. My Diplomatic Victory with Venice started in Ancient Era this time, will continue to work up from there after I get back into King (on Prince right now, took a long break from Civ)