First game on emperor

[Corwin of Amber]

It is about 700AD and I'll soon have my contient cleared of rivals. But on the other contient lurks America. I'm Hiawatha of the Iroquois. Playing C3C. They are two or three techs ahead of me and have been building wonders like they were little fountains. Tons of 'em. The other civs on their continent aren't really ahead of me. I have four luxuries in abundance: 3 ivory, 4 incense, 2 gems and a couple of one other, I think.

I got a pretty bad starting position in plains/desert. Should I do a palace jump?

I am trade-savvy so should I try to research a different tech path than America and try to leverage my luxuries and future resources to get ahead of them? I don't mind going to war with them and they are only a few squares away. I researched navigation to start with and so did they, so getting at them is not a problem. I traded the Incas for gunpowder but it cost a lot.... I can post a save later if this is too vague. I'm running a mac, don't know if that matters as far as that goes.

 

[vmxa]

I am not sure about the Mac aspect. I know the old vanilla civ3 saves were able to be used back and forth, so I would think it should be fine.

Anyway with no look see, I can only speculate. I would expect that the human on one continet, could fall back a bit as you get no help from your neighbors.

I would first want to see how the other contient is split. If the USA has most of the land, then it could be too late to get any help form those over there in terms of warring with the Americans to slow them down.

No need for them to take land away, but if they could get them fighting some and hold the land they already have, that helps. So I may want to trade at a discount with them or even gift some techs that the US already has.

The trick is not to get them into wars, if all they are going to do is lose land the the US.

I would not like to trade anything to the US, unless it was some tech that could not move them forward much. No lux or resources. I would probably want to get them to declare on me and let them send over units to be killed.

No happy bump for me declaring on them, if I could avoid that, even if I am in Monarchy or Communism.

The idea of getting a tech to trade them, is probably not going to help much, unless the other civs have techs or cash as well, so you can get from many. I would expect this is not the case and that most are near broke all the time now.

I would rather either self research and or steal from the Americans. This way they gain nothing from it.

Given that you are already at Navigation, then no wonders are of interest till the ToE. Plan for it now, if you have not already done so.

Invasions of an industrial age contient at emperor will be a handful. If you can land a few armies to pillage, that is a good plan, before they get bombers. If you have enough armies and units that can be shipped over to make proress, do that.

You have to be carefull about it though. On the one hand, going for a weak civ on their contient could be easier, but going for the big dog first will likely get them to toss a lot of units at you right away.

This can be benificial in that it will be easier to kill them at the beachhead, than to dig them out town by town. Worse yet to take down another civ and then have to defend a longer border against the US.

These are tricky choices for anyone playing the game all along, let alone someone from the outside.

 

[Whomp]

Corwin a save and/or screenshots are always helpful.

A few things that pop to mind right away. If the Americans are building wonders then they're not building military.

Consider dogpiling the Americans with the other civs on their landmass. A few things will come of this. You will gas all of them, militarily, which means their research rate will grind to a halt. This helps you in trading and if you're going for a spaceshot catch up in techs. I especially like dogpiling when fascism is researched. Many times they'll switch to this government during wars. A very good thing for you since fascism is a war government that kills off their population.

Be careful sending luxs to the AI except the weakest one that that you want to strengthen. The AI will use clowns, in lieu of the lux slider, which makes them less economically efficient. More clowns less commerce, growth and shields. I tend to hoard luxs for this reason.

Do send their enemies war techs/horses/salt and iron. Helping them wage war is a good thing. Sometimes it's even worthwhile sending them, through a MA, your only source of iron/horses/salt if you are comfortable with your current military situation.

Bring some war settlers and your most effective offensive units to the party. There will be open spaces created to put a toehold on the other continent. Be opportunistic in this regard. Luxs, chokepoints and resources.

 

[Corwin of Amber]

Thanks for the tips, there are some things that I can really sink my teeth into. Great advice about who to trade with and how, I was fuzzy about that stuff.

I got a GML awhile ago but I didn't use it. I figured I'd wait until I really needed it.

Right now I don't have a very good map of the world. Nobody but America can trade maps with me at this point, and they won't really do it for less than a king's ransom. So I will do some sailing and see what I can see. If I build an explorer and drop them off on the other continent will the AI get upset? Or is it viewed as a non-threat?

I could bulid a musketman army, land some troops and let them hack away at it...is that a good idea? Bring some knights along to crush weak units. Rush a barracks.

I know where the Incas have silks, but I don't know about America... I have saltpeter, horses and iron, so that is good.

I'll post a save when I get home, thanks for all the great help.

 

[sanabas]

I got a GML awhile ago but I didn't use it. I figured I'd wait until I really needed it.

Good plan, provided you're not at war.

Right now I don't have a very good map of the world. Nobody but America can trade maps with me at this point, and they won't really do it for less than a king's ransom. So I will do some sailing and see what I can see. If I build an explorer and drop them off on the other continent will the AI get upset? Or is it viewed as a non-threat?

When you have Navigation, you can trade maps with everyone. Explorers are non-military, same as scouts, so they'll be fine.

I could bulid a musketman army, land some troops and let them hack away at it...is that a good idea? Bring some knights along to crush weak units. Rush a barracks.

Armies with defensive units are generally not a good idea. The AI won't normally attack full strength armies anyway, so an army full of attacking units is almost as good a defender, and a much better attacking tool, personally I'd rush for cavalry, and load up a cav army. Knights v muskets isn't great for the attacker, Cav v Muskets/rifles works better.

I know where the Incas have silks, but I don't know about America... I have saltpeter, horses and iron, so that is good.

Kill them and find out. Ally in the rest of the continent, it will weaken the other AIs for you, and it will divide America's attacks, which should limit your losses.

 

[Whomp]

Oh boy, MGL's!
The first thing is what version are you playing? C3C?
On the MGL...
Alway load armies with offensive units. A knight army can do more damage than a musket army. Faster and with more offensive damage.

How close are you to Military Tradition? I would prefer a cav army over a knight army.

Don't load all the units into the army until it's on the other continent. The MGL converted to an army counts as one so by adding the other 3 units makes for a transport of 4. Caravels will carry 3 so it's better to add the last unit on the other continent.

Do you have embassies with the other civs? If not buy them. They will pay back in the long run. If you want an explorer to scope out the other continent then sign a ROP (I'll bet they'll pay you or MA with you for a ROP as well).

 

[Corwin of Amber]

Oh boy, MGL's!
The first thing is what version are you playing? C3C?
On the MGL...
Alway load armies with offensive units. A knight army can do more damage than a musket army. Faster and with more offensive damage.

Yeah, C3C. Good point you the the previous poster made. I noticed last time I played conquests that the AI won't attack armies, so it might as well be an offensive army.

How close are you to Military Tradition? I would prefer a cav army over a knight army.

I'm a few turns off from Navigation. I have gunpowder, so MT is about 3 1/2 techs away.

Don't load all the units into the army until it's on the other continent. The MGL converted to an army counts as one so by adding the other 3 units makes for a transport of 4. Caravels will carry 3 so it's better to add the last unit on the other continent.

I was thinking about this so yes, thanks for elucidating that.

Do you have embassies with the other civs? If not buy them. They will pay back in the long run. If you want an explorer to scope out the other continent then sign a ROP (I'll bet they'll pay you or MA with you for a ROP as well).

I don't. I'll do that and send out (my version of) Lewis and Clark.

 

[Corwin of Amber]

Kill them and find out. Ally in the rest of the continent, it will weaken the other AIs for you, and it will divide America's attacks, which should limit your losses.

Don't I need printing press or something to make MAs and ROPs?

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Don't I need printing press or something to make MAs and ROPs?

If it has not changed in C3C you only need an embassy.

 

[Corwin of Amber]

If it has not changed in C3C you only need an embassy.

I was ignorant of that. Thanks!

 

[vmxa]

Corwin of Amber
"Yeah, C3C. Good point you the the previous poster made. I noticed last time I played conquests that the AI won't attack armies, so it might as well be an offensive army."

The will attack weak armies. That is to say if they have MDI or better and you have MW army or Horses, they do attack them. If the army is in the yelllow, it could be attack. If it is the red, it will be attacked.

If you have the NoPatrol set, they sometimes blunder into your army and attack it. I have had three straight units attack my full helath army, by stumbling into it. It was almost killed.

In C3C, writing is needed to make alliances. Printing Press is needed to trade communications. Map Making for RoP.

MGL can be held as long as you do not use any other elites to fight. You cannot get another MGL if you have any type of leader.

As to the type of armies, it depends on what you are going to be doing with them and what you will face. If I am going on a pillaging run, then the faster the army can move the better.

If it is going out to fight, them the stronger the attackers the better. So calvs are the best all the way around. If I am going to make a beachead town, then I would not go with Knights, but rather with muskets.

Here is where I was going when I said not playing the game makes it hard to say. I would have an idea of what I would face, so I would know if I must have a strong defensive army to hold the town or not.

If I need the musket army, then that is where I go. If not then Knights or calvs if I have them. The big thing in C3C and armies is the full heal in a barracks, if no movement was used. That is what lets me beat down those Sid piles. The armies stay forted and even if they get redlined, they are full strength for the next turn.

So if you do not antcipate getting hit by lots of units, skip the defensive army. I would expect that they will send plenty on Emperor at this stage of the game and you want to cut roads coming into the town, if you can.

Remember you will get lots of leaders during the counter attack. If you have Knights or calvs to kill any retreating units, you get elites and leaders. The indiviual muskets will go elite as well.

So don't think you have to sweat not having an attacking army. You likely will have one by the time you can break out.

 

[vmxa]

Don't I need printing press or something to make MAs and ROPs?

I was afraid this would be lost in the longer post, so:

In C3C, writing is needed to make alliances as that allows an embassy. Printing Press is needed to trade communications. Map Making for RoP.

 

[Whomp]

Armies can also heal in enemy territory. Slower than with barracks but they will heal. If you can get another MGL this can be exceptionally powerful because the armies can play leapfrog as you move from enemy town to enemy town.

 

[adog]

originally posted by vxma
MGL can be held as long as you do not use any other elites to fight. You cannot get another MGL if you have any type of leader.

Are you sure about this? I've gotten 2 MGL's in the same turn before and I don't think I made an army before getting the 2nd one.

 

[vmxa]

Not possible. There is a check for any elite combat and if any leader (SGL or MGL) is around, then no leader. That check is not made for SGL, so you can have more than one of them.

 

[adog]

Well maybe I did create an army before getting the 2nd one than, bad memory.

 

[Whomp]

adog you can also rush a small wonders (IE forbidden palace) and other builds.

 

[Corwin of Amber]

Here is the link: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/Hiawatha_of_the_Iroquois,_860_AD.SAV

I don't know if I did that right...never done an upload before

 

[vmxa]

What is this some autosave or a huge map? It is ovre 2megs? If it is an autosave, use the manual one next time as they are much smaller.

It is too late here to get a peek at it, do it in the AM.

 

[Tomoyo]

I would not advise a palace jump - your terrain may be plain-y and desert-y, but you are agricultural, so deserts are basically the same as plains. There are a lot of bonus resources around your core, and some very pretty flood plains. Not worth jumping.

I see you have mass regicide on. I'm not familiar with mass regicide, but in regular regicide, the AI keeps its king in the capital. Assuming the AI keeps all its kings in its capital, you can go on a conquest route just by taking all the capitals (and you can destroy America just by taking Washington). The Americans do not look too imposing, but more information (send a galley around the other continent) would reveal the other continent's layout and what a possible dogpile on America would bring.

What I would do is build a SOD of kanons (trebuchets), cavalry (mounties/knights), and riflemen (muskets) that would eventually be used to seige Washington. Kanons and other artillery only target units, so that should help.

If you don't want to destroy the Americans by taking out Washington, you can pretty much just wait until you get infantry and artillery in the industrial age using your economy and then build up a ton of artillery and conquer the world.

If you want a peaceful victory, conquer the world, then build your spaceship/make people like you.