General Question - You would love to answer these..
- Thread starter GreatD
- Start date
Bucephalus
Shooting from the lip....
Nergal
Prince
Preferred or shunned goverments only have an effect on Diplomacy, its in the editor. If the Germans like Republic and shun Communism then it means if the Germans are dealing with a Republic AI they will be more amenable to trade etc and if dealing with a Communist AI they will be less amenable. In practical terms it is minor and diplomacy and trades are affected more by Reputation. In CIV the factors are given as + and -, I assume the same figures are used in CIII and variants in the background.
splunge the 2nd
King
- Joined
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You guys are very patient. I remeber being a complete newbie...
GreatD, in your first post I notice you are making wonders a priority. They certainly are fun and powerful, but may I reccommend limiting your wonderbuilding to no more than 1 an age. It is helpful as a player to learn basic skills of maintianing happiness, balancing the economy, researching etc. at the lower level withput the use of wonders. There's a nice article in the War Academy on this site about "wonder addiction" that's worth a read.
I would also make sure you understnad what the city improvements you are building do and how much the cost to build and maintain before building them. For example, a library increases the effective gold that goes into research from the city that built it by50%. It produces culture and costs 1 gold a tunr to maintain. If the city that built it is only producing 2 gold per turn for research, you spend a gold a turn to add a gold a turn to research. It may be worth it to have the culture or if the city will grow and later produce more gold, but you need to decide in each city whether a given imprvement is worth the investment in building it or maintaining it.
Another example is the courthouse. It is pretty expensive at 80 shields, costs a gold per turn to maintain and works to reduce corruption in the city in which it's built. If you have a city near the capital (or IS the capital) it will have very little corruption generally and the courthouse will not benefit you much. Alternatively, a tine village far away from the center of your nation will be extremely corrupt and the courthouse will take forever to build and not accomplish much.
GreatD, in your first post I notice you are making wonders a priority. They certainly are fun and powerful, but may I reccommend limiting your wonderbuilding to no more than 1 an age. It is helpful as a player to learn basic skills of maintianing happiness, balancing the economy, researching etc. at the lower level withput the use of wonders. There's a nice article in the War Academy on this site about "wonder addiction" that's worth a read.
I would also make sure you understnad what the city improvements you are building do and how much the cost to build and maintain before building them. For example, a library increases the effective gold that goes into research from the city that built it by50%. It produces culture and costs 1 gold a tunr to maintain. If the city that built it is only producing 2 gold per turn for research, you spend a gold a turn to add a gold a turn to research. It may be worth it to have the culture or if the city will grow and later produce more gold, but you need to decide in each city whether a given imprvement is worth the investment in building it or maintaining it.
Another example is the courthouse. It is pretty expensive at 80 shields, costs a gold per turn to maintain and works to reduce corruption in the city in which it's built. If you have a city near the capital (or IS the capital) it will have very little corruption generally and the courthouse will not benefit you much. Alternatively, a tine village far away from the center of your nation will be extremely corrupt and the courthouse will take forever to build and not accomplish much.
I do not see why one should not learn to deal with wonders. You build as many as you can, so long as you do not do damage to your victory.
That may be zero in a really tough game or making all of them on Chief. New players should learn how to go about making a wonder that they feel it important. They should also learn to not jeapardize their progress trying to make a wonder. Especially, if they are not even going to get it.
That may be zero in a really tough game or making all of them on Chief. New players should learn how to go about making a wonder that they feel it important. They should also learn to not jeapardize their progress trying to make a wonder. Especially, if they are not even going to get it.
Nergal
Prince
I recently played a Monarch game where I was so far ahead I pretty much built all the wonders after Leonardo. The Maya conveneiently built Sun Tzu just across my border and Babylon very nicely built the Sistine as my panzers were rolling down its main street. At that time my iron works was just churning out Hoover Dam. There isnt a problem with building wonders, its simply that you need to be aware of when you should be churning out settlers and troops and when you have the luxury of knockoing out the odd wonder.
@splunge "the city improvements you are building do and how much the cost to build and maintain before building them. For example, a library increases the effective gold that goes into research from the city that built it by50%. It produces culture and costs 1 gold a tunr to maintain. If the city that built it is only producing 2 gold per turn for research, you spend a gold a turn to add a gold a turn to research. It may be worth it to have the culture or if the city will grow and later produce more gold, but you need to decide in each city whether a given imprvement is worth the investment in building it or maintaining it.
Another example is the courthouse. It is pretty expensive at 80 shields, costs a gold per turn to maintain and works to reduce corruption in the city in which it's built. If you have a city near the capital (or IS the capital) it will have very little corruption generally and the courthouse will not benefit you much."
um thanks! My basic structure improvements are barracks, wall, library, courthouse for miles away from capital. i dont build courthouse nearby the capital. i do checking my Income/Expense inventory at Domestic adviser (F1). building improvements for corruption remedy depends on the current situation of the structure(metro,city,town) which is corruption is most likely the case. i consider temple as well as a remedy.
building structure improvements unwisely will end up to otherwise outcome. maintenance will going to eat your income.
and what makes the game interesting is for considering those wonders which shows the beauty of its complexity. i think you dont really have to live with "mano a mano" fight. its a strategy game so deal with how will you gonna use those resource.
Another example is the courthouse. It is pretty expensive at 80 shields, costs a gold per turn to maintain and works to reduce corruption in the city in which it's built. If you have a city near the capital (or IS the capital) it will have very little corruption generally and the courthouse will not benefit you much."
um thanks! My basic structure improvements are barracks, wall, library, courthouse for miles away from capital. i dont build courthouse nearby the capital. i do checking my Income/Expense inventory at Domestic adviser (F1). building improvements for corruption remedy depends on the current situation of the structure(metro,city,town) which is corruption is most likely the case. i consider temple as well as a remedy.
building structure improvements unwisely will end up to otherwise outcome. maintenance will going to eat your income.
and what makes the game interesting is for considering those wonders which shows the beauty of its complexity. i think you dont really have to live with "mano a mano" fight. its a strategy game so deal with how will you gonna use those resource.
Temples have no effect on corruption.
I think this is one of the points that several posters are trying to convey. Building too many unnecessary structures is a common mistake among new players, and this practice winds up eating their economy alive. It's good that you've realized the danger here.
"happy citizens - less corruption" but temple is my last on the list.
Bartleby
Remembers laughter
I may be wrong but I think WLTKD affects waste (red shields) but not corruption (red coins)?
splunge the 2nd
King
- Joined
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- Messages
- 741
Great D, not trying to patronize! I know I built just about everything as a starting player. Glad you've got a better sense of what's useful than I had!
um its not really as what you think, i play a game before asking question and try to share ideas from what i may learn from it, you know just want to come up with question that worth answering. i dont think being a totally newbie posting question here and there is a good idea. that would be annoying and it pays to try teaching a totally newbie. i was actually a totally incompetent fool as well at the first i played the game. i started playing just this week and still confuse with several stuff.like:
1) terrain dis/advantages. do terrain shield has effect with or during a fight?
2) i dont understand why a single spearman is able to owned 2 or more knights/cavalries.
- im thinking the battle has some sort of momentum that seemingly depends on the situation. i took noticed of this when i ambushed a worker while doing his stuff in their boundary/land then i think i made them so mad that they had to declare war on us and keeps on rejecting my envoy and when they were rallying their units to one of my structure they were like being powered up that even my crusader unit (5/3/1) deployed in that structure had to kneel to their stupid regular spearman (1/2/1). i was so shocked.LOL
3) is there any way to get rid of resisters? strong garrison would be the remedy but sometimes there is a situation that i had to deploy-fortify a single unit because i had to continue my attack to nearby enemy structure and what annoys me is when the structure i have captured already says "they have given up their loyalty and made alliance to my foe)
4)just wondering what is your first structure improvement to newly captured enemy structure after civil disorder?
-trying to understand the concept of the game makes you hooked up and wont be boring.
splunge the 2nd
King
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2007
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- 741
1. Shield production doesn't impact combat, but terrain type does. Certain terrains add to defense (hills, forests and especially mountains). Defending accross a river also helps defense.
Defensive benefits add up as well, so a fortified spearman in a town with a wall, built on a hill that's defending against a unit attacking across a river will have a much higher defensive value than the same spear man not fortified sitting in the middle of grasslands.
2. A common complaint! Battle outcomes are determined randomly with the odds depending on the ratio of the effective attack and defense values of the combattants. There are combat calculators available on the site to determine the odds of winning or losing a given combat.
3. Resistors can be starved out (set all population to entertainers or other specialists and let the population fall from food underproduction) and from stationing milatary units in the city. I believe it doesn't matter what units you put there so using old defunct units to quell resistance while using tougher newer units makes sense. Interstingly destroying the civ to which they belong, I believe, does not stop resistance but makes the surviving non-resistors less unhappy.
4. It depends. If it's fully corrupt, I may not build anything there and use the city as a "specialist farm". That's a city where you put the population to maximize food to support scientists or tax collectors usually. Since the income from specialists is not affected by corruption, having a ton of small towns each with 3 income producing specialists can be a significant boon to your economy. Each town also makes unit support whuch helps.
Making a worker in a captured city will drive down the popuylation helping resistance possibly and avoiding culture flips. I have read that if you make a worker from a foreign population they are slaves and do not require unit support, but it never seems to work that way for me.
Defensive benefits add up as well, so a fortified spearman in a town with a wall, built on a hill that's defending against a unit attacking across a river will have a much higher defensive value than the same spear man not fortified sitting in the middle of grasslands.
2. A common complaint! Battle outcomes are determined randomly with the odds depending on the ratio of the effective attack and defense values of the combattants. There are combat calculators available on the site to determine the odds of winning or losing a given combat.
3. Resistors can be starved out (set all population to entertainers or other specialists and let the population fall from food underproduction) and from stationing milatary units in the city. I believe it doesn't matter what units you put there so using old defunct units to quell resistance while using tougher newer units makes sense. Interstingly destroying the civ to which they belong, I believe, does not stop resistance but makes the surviving non-resistors less unhappy.
4. It depends. If it's fully corrupt, I may not build anything there and use the city as a "specialist farm". That's a city where you put the population to maximize food to support scientists or tax collectors usually. Since the income from specialists is not affected by corruption, having a ton of small towns each with 3 income producing specialists can be a significant boon to your economy. Each town also makes unit support whuch helps.
Making a worker in a captured city will drive down the popuylation helping resistance possibly and avoiding culture flips. I have read that if you make a worker from a foreign population they are slaves and do not require unit support, but it never seems to work that way for me.
Once the AI is gone, any resistors will be automatically pacified by units in the town (one per unit), but they won't go away without ground troops in the town (air units, naval units, and artillery units do not pacify resistance). While the AI is still around, resistors have a chance to be pacified each, but you can only pacify one resistor per unit.
If you make a worker using a foreign citizen, it will be a slave and will cost no upkeep. However, if there are both native and foreign citizens in a town, you may not get a slave. I'm not sure if there is a way to tell which you will get.
I usually build either wealth or libraries in newly captured cities after they are starved down. While starving I build settlers or workers. If I need culture, I build libraries. If I expect the city to become productive, I build a library. Otherwise I will probably turn it into a science farm, and I'll build wealth. If it is early in the game, I might build catapults (as they don't benefit from barracks), but artillery cost too many shields. (Note that I usually play culture/fast science games, rather than for military victories, and this greatly affects what I build.)
If you make a worker using a foreign citizen, it will be a slave and will cost no upkeep. However, if there are both native and foreign citizens in a town, you may not get a slave. I'm not sure if there is a way to tell which you will get.
I usually build either wealth or libraries in newly captured cities after they are starved down. While starving I build settlers or workers. If I need culture, I build libraries. If I expect the city to become productive, I build a library. Otherwise I will probably turn it into a science farm, and I'll build wealth. If it is early in the game, I might build catapults (as they don't benefit from barracks), but artillery cost too many shields. (Note that I usually play culture/fast science games, rather than for military victories, and this greatly affects what I build.)
Snarkhunter
Prince
However, we know that the developers wanted to see the ancient units survive a little longer in the game, so they gave units like spearmen a slight extra advantage in combat. Some would opine that they went overboard
kk
They did not give them any advantage, they just did nothing to make them disadvantaged. It is just the crazy rng. It is pretty much worthless.
You can take a test with no preserve seed. Have two units of equal levels run a number of combats with each other. You can get as wide a results as A beats B and lost no hit points to B beating A and not losing any hit points.
To me that is an rng gone crazy. It should be altering the battles on the margins only. So A vs B varies a little, but not that much. You can get the same results where A is superior to B as well. You just have to roll with the punches.
You can take a test with no preserve seed. Have two units of equal levels run a number of combats with each other. You can get as wide a results as A beats B and lost no hit points to B beating A and not losing any hit points.
To me that is an rng gone crazy. It should be altering the battles on the margins only. So A vs B varies a little, but not that much. You can get the same results where A is superior to B as well. You just have to roll with the punches.
Snarkhunter
Prince
Way I've always heard it here is that one of the developers liked the idea of spears having a sporting chance against up-tech units, so gave them a little extra boost in the RNG in those situations. Without actually looking at the code, I don't think there is any way to tell for sure.
As for the RNG, it should allow for streaky results & extremes as well, & if you roll your test battle enough times, you should see the behaviors you mention. But it does seem to me as you noted that it is too streaky, without, I hasten to add, having actually tallied the results.
A related question is whether the RNG deliberately favors the AI against the human. I recently played a game where I was forced to let the AI's battle it out in my territory for a long time. Seemed to me that I was seeing the same sort of streaky results (& improbable victories) in their combats as I do in mine. And I witnessed a lot of combats--made for very long turns, I must say. I admit that I didn't tally the results in this case either; would have been difficult to keep up with the pace. But I did find it reassuring.
In any case, it is as you note: it's the RNG we have for better or worse & there is no changing it--unless someone wants to try disassembling the executable & re-jiggering it
So, might as well learn to live with it.kk
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