he's also talking about MP games where things are different against human players. free settler and worker can be big when you cant do the normal steal/lux trades with AI.
Good civ for flexible start? (Tall or Wide)
- Thread starter Big J Money
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he's also talking about MP games where things are different against human players. free settler and worker can be big when you cant do the normal steal/lux trades with AI.
truenarnian
Emperor
Whoa, wait - what? What's being discussed here? I thought I knew all the high-level strategies and tactics, but I have no idea what you all are talking about. someone fill me in or link me to it?
Exactly, assuming half decent players the game will have been decided by turn 200 (see the next paragraph) Rare exceptions exists (such as ganging on the runaway or whatnot) but by then, the economic/science differences are a vast gap, to my experience at least.
That been said, what you will gain through rationalism I can simulate with the growth bonus from tradition (and lets not add religion growth bonuses, extra gold happiness and the aqueduct hammers.). And I will build unis and will go rationalism as well (IMHO there is no other way), so in effect I will out-science in the end, by virtue of pop, say about 20 turns later. Maybe even less. At that time is game over for a non tradition player. Traditions cities will have grown like weeds, will produce more science,gold and eventually hammers. So the only option to deal with an empire like that would be through military means but I wouldn't stake my hopes on it.
Lets throw the AI out of the window. I am talking about MP too
The liberty= Faster expansion is flawed (personal experience). By having more citizens in each city I am using more tiles therefore I can produce more settlers faster. One city from liberty isn't going to cut it. Plus the growth bonuses allow for the growth pause of training settlers. In the end the trad player can actually simulate by management all the liberty options, while it cant happen the other way. 4 Trad citys will grow faster than 4 liberty cities even when the Libs are settled by 10 or even 20 turns gap in between the two policy trees.About the relevance of delaying/ignoring tradition to the point where you are ready to get Siams special University (which gives culture) for free and using the extra culture to go hop directly into rationalism. The tactic revolves around opening tradition, going another branch (commerce or Patronage), build your culture buildings (delayed I assume since you don't want vast policy gains till the Renaissance) and then opening legalism to gain Siams vats (they count as a cultural building).
well, he mentioned the potential for 10-15 cities and not as puppets. im not sure anyone was arguing 4-city traditions vs 4-city liberty. the 50% bonus to building settlers will definitely justify it for 10+ cities.
Perhaps I was mistaken then because I read the quotation below and I though I would try to elaborate why even in MP liberty is not a good way to follow with the current game state.
AlcatrazUK
Chieftain
- Joined
- Aug 9, 2012
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- 76
How about the Aztecs? You can start focusing on Barb hunting and getting the extra culture and if there's loads of space for expansion, a lack of cultural city states, or an aggressive neighbour, you can switch to wide and go on the attack for a domination victory.
the example you gave why 'MP liberty is not good' compared 4-city trad to 4-city lib which i was only pointing out wasn't what the OP had in mind. if that's the debate then im fine with the conclusions regarding it, but based on the idea of settling 10+ cities i think it changed the conclusion, at least for me, that is.
and im not suggesting that's the path to take, just giving options if he wants to try it.
Me too I am saying my opinion through my experience, I am not trying to shove things down anyone's throat. My apologies if it came that way
Me too I am saying my opinion through my experience, I am not trying to shove things down anyone's throat. My apologies if it came that way
no worries on my end.
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