GOTM-02: First Spoiler:
- Thread starter ainwood
- Start date
diamond geezer said:
That, and they're more difficult than other victories, in some ways. Especially cultural, which seems to be at right angles to all the other victory conditions. I'd like to see one of the top players take it on and see how well they do, whether it's possible to get an early cultural victory that's also high-scoring.
Of course, none of that stopped me.
Financial/philosophical/redcoats is the perfect storm for one type of cultural victory, and I just had to try it, even being a complete novice at it and still shaky in *normal* prince games to boot.I pulled off a cultural victory in the last one and my score was rather medicore for the effort I felt.
I was tempted to do it again this time around but I think I'll go for a domination victory simply to try and get a more accurate sense of where I stand compared to the best players.
I was tempted to do it again this time around but I think I'll go for a domination victory simply to try and get a more accurate sense of where I stand compared to the best players.
Writeup from 400BC through to 1AD.
F9 Statistics:
timeplayed 1:08
cities built: 4
GNP: 20 (2nd)
MFG: 30 (2nd)
Crop yields: 41 (2nd)
Soldiers: 6900 (6th.. dangerous)
Land area: 112000 (1st)
population: 26200 (1st)
Wonders:
Pyramids -me
Oracle -me
Stonge Henge -me
Religions founded:
Hinduism: me (york)
Confucianism: me (york)
Judaism: Isabella
Buddhism: Montazuma
Great Leaders Generated:
1)Scientist - Academy in London
2)Prophet - Confucian shrine in York
3)Prophet - Yet to be used (founded this exact turn)
Writeup
I started off with the aim of giving myself a solid start after which I could expand continuously reguardless of rising maintenance costs without crippling my economy. To do this I decided to use a CS-slingshot tactic combine with a GL super city based around great merchants and, to a lesser degree, prophets.
In the first turn I founded my starting city in the default spot and sent my warrior scouting west. London begins production of a worker while bronze working research is started.
In 3560 my warrior pops a hut which reveals a scout, things are going well. My luck continues to go strong as the scout then heads north and pops a hut in 3440 to grant me agriculture. A few turns later, at 3320, I switch londons worked square to the inland lake so that my worker is timed to arrive one turn before bronze working is completed (a turn I use to move him onto a forest).
I wanted my second city out ASAP because the bigger it was the faster it would complete the oracle because my main city would be too busy with a library and then Scientists to produce it. Because of this I double chopped towards it and York was founded to the west in 2640bc (in the same spot many of you had a barbarian village pop up). Continuing on my goal of having york at its peak as fast as possible I used the founding of hinduism in 2160 to expand its borders while washington gifted it with its first worker, even if it was extremely reluctantly.
I decided that while I waited for the oracle to become available I would take a shot at stonehenge in York, mainly for the free +4 great prophet points, but also it would help my cities gain borders when I finally reached my rapid expansion phase. I was tempted to found a third city instead but forced myself not to because 1)I wanted duel religions in york 2)a third city would hit my economy harder than it could deal with. Meanwhile London was pumping warriors (although not very fast, it was focused on those inland lakes and the commerce they provided) because they were going to be my only defence for quite some time.
My tech point after bronze working was an extreme beeline. Mysticism, polytheism, priesthood, writing, code of laws. I had few worker techs so my two workers spent most of their time doing the only three things they could, irrigating, mining and chopping.
As stonehenge completed (1550bc) York began production of the oracle. Meanwhile London began its library which culminated in the founding of an academy in 1050.
In 1000bc my plan finally reached fruition. Code of laws was researched in the same turn as the oracle completed and I grabbed civil service as my free technology. One revolution later and my nation burst into bureaucracy and civil service. London immediately began work on a settler while york began to produce a temple. Research began on alphabet.
Finally I was able to found my third city in 720bc near the stone while my fourth followed soon after (280bc). With alphabet done I engaged in a technology trading frenzy that caught me up on all the basic techs and had me still posess a significant lead. From there I moved onto iron working and then metal casting.
With York connected to the stone it raced through the pyramids thanks to 14 hammers per turn (28 with stone) and two worker chops of 90 each. A second revolt ensued (obviously my people didnt like me destroying my forests
) and representation was the result. three merchants were assigned to york, each bringing in 3 gold and 3 beakers while allowing me to continue running at 90% science.
and thats pretty much everything up to that date. If you read through all of that you've either got too much time on your hands or it was alot more interesting than I thought
Screenshost
My empire at 1AD (try not to laugh too hard):
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/VenomLord/Civ4ScreenShot0007.jpg
End notes
I've enjoyed this game so far, I could have done some things better but I'm reletively happy with how I've gone. Any comments, suggestions or questions are MORE than welcome. Next writeup will probablybe at around 500AD (in whichever thread it fits in best), my expansion should probably be done by then and war will be on the horizon.
F9 Statistics:
timeplayed 1:08
cities built: 4
GNP: 20 (2nd)
MFG: 30 (2nd)
Crop yields: 41 (2nd)
Soldiers: 6900 (6th.. dangerous)
Land area: 112000 (1st)
population: 26200 (1st)
Wonders:
Pyramids -me
Oracle -me
Stonge Henge -me
Religions founded:
Hinduism: me (york)
Confucianism: me (york)
Judaism: Isabella
Buddhism: Montazuma
Great Leaders Generated:
1)Scientist - Academy in London
2)Prophet - Confucian shrine in York
3)Prophet - Yet to be used (founded this exact turn)
Writeup
I started off with the aim of giving myself a solid start after which I could expand continuously reguardless of rising maintenance costs without crippling my economy. To do this I decided to use a CS-slingshot tactic combine with a GL super city based around great merchants and, to a lesser degree, prophets.
In the first turn I founded my starting city in the default spot and sent my warrior scouting west. London begins production of a worker while bronze working research is started.
In 3560 my warrior pops a hut which reveals a scout, things are going well. My luck continues to go strong as the scout then heads north and pops a hut in 3440 to grant me agriculture. A few turns later, at 3320, I switch londons worked square to the inland lake so that my worker is timed to arrive one turn before bronze working is completed (a turn I use to move him onto a forest).
I wanted my second city out ASAP because the bigger it was the faster it would complete the oracle because my main city would be too busy with a library and then Scientists to produce it. Because of this I double chopped towards it and York was founded to the west in 2640bc (in the same spot many of you had a barbarian village pop up). Continuing on my goal of having york at its peak as fast as possible I used the founding of hinduism in 2160 to expand its borders while washington gifted it with its first worker, even if it was extremely reluctantly.
I decided that while I waited for the oracle to become available I would take a shot at stonehenge in York, mainly for the free +4 great prophet points, but also it would help my cities gain borders when I finally reached my rapid expansion phase. I was tempted to found a third city instead but forced myself not to because 1)I wanted duel religions in york 2)a third city would hit my economy harder than it could deal with. Meanwhile London was pumping warriors (although not very fast, it was focused on those inland lakes and the commerce they provided) because they were going to be my only defence for quite some time.
My tech point after bronze working was an extreme beeline. Mysticism, polytheism, priesthood, writing, code of laws. I had few worker techs so my two workers spent most of their time doing the only three things they could, irrigating, mining and chopping.
As stonehenge completed (1550bc) York began production of the oracle. Meanwhile London began its library which culminated in the founding of an academy in 1050.
In 1000bc my plan finally reached fruition. Code of laws was researched in the same turn as the oracle completed and I grabbed civil service as my free technology. One revolution later and my nation burst into bureaucracy and civil service. London immediately began work on a settler while york began to produce a temple. Research began on alphabet.
Finally I was able to found my third city in 720bc near the stone while my fourth followed soon after (280bc). With alphabet done I engaged in a technology trading frenzy that caught me up on all the basic techs and had me still posess a significant lead. From there I moved onto iron working and then metal casting.
With York connected to the stone it raced through the pyramids thanks to 14 hammers per turn (28 with stone) and two worker chops of 90 each. A second revolt ensued (obviously my people didnt like me destroying my forests
) and representation was the result. three merchants were assigned to york, each bringing in 3 gold and 3 beakers while allowing me to continue running at 90% science.and thats pretty much everything up to that date. If you read through all of that you've either got too much time on your hands or it was alot more interesting than I thought
Screenshost
My empire at 1AD (try not to laugh too hard):
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/VenomLord/Civ4ScreenShot0007.jpg
End notes
I've enjoyed this game so far, I could have done some things better but I'm reletively happy with how I've gone. Any comments, suggestions or questions are MORE than welcome. Next writeup will probablybe at around 500AD (in whichever thread it fits in best), my expansion should probably be done by then and war will be on the horizon.
Lord Jimbob
Lord of the flies
I've been away from Civ for a while, and this was my first complete Civ4 game, although it ended early the first time around when wave after wave of barbarians finally overtook London ~2000bc LOL- it was, like, 3 barb uprisings in a row or something ><.
Anyway, although it can't be submitted, I was aiming for a 3 city culture victory, and after I tried again I managed to get setup pretty well, keeping up with techs and good city growth, although I couldn't resist building a fourth city near the NE marble on the other side of the lake =P. All is well following a few brief border wars with Monty and Izzy around the time I got my redcoats on line... I'll let you know how it went in the next spoiler! BTW I hate epic speed LOL, at least as a builder trying for culture!
Anyway, although it can't be submitted, I was aiming for a 3 city culture victory, and after I tried again I managed to get setup pretty well, keeping up with techs and good city growth, although I couldn't resist building a fourth city near the NE marble on the other side of the lake =P. All is well following a few brief border wars with Monty and Izzy around the time I got my redcoats on line... I'll let you know how it went in the next spoiler! BTW I hate epic speed LOL, at least as a builder trying for culture!
Harok
Vagabond
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2005
- Messages
- 271
Goal: Cultural victory as soon as possible.
Reality: So many mistakes in 1 game isn't good.
Cities:
London 4000 BC on the starting spot
York 1675 BC south of London in the spot to grab the copper and 2 gems.
Nottingham 1250 BC on top of the stone.
Hastings 840 BC to the West of Rome near the corn spot that the barbs like to build.
Coventry in the middle of the lake to get the fish and clam to use the city as a GP factory.
Others were founded after spoiler cut off.
I targeted London, York, and Hastings as my 3 cultural cities with Coventry as my main GP city along with London.
Mistakes and mishaps:
When the barbs founded that nice city to the West of London near the corn I stationed troops outside the city and had them sit there until it grew to size 2 so it wouldn't autoraze. Unfortunately the Aztecs had 2 archers show up and beat both of the warriors fortified in the hill city. So then I had to wait for a settler to be built to claim it setting that city back a number of years.
My next big mistake came when I accidentally sent a settler to the wrong square away from his axeman protecter. Naturally this put him right next to a barb warrior. Poof goodbye settler, this set Coventry my main GP city back many many turns as I had to produce a new settler and move him back into position. In a non GOTM game I would have reloaded considering the mistake was a misclick and not a miscalculation but in GOTM those are the breaks.
Next mistake, I moved one unit out of Hastings to pick off a barb archer leaving it defended by a single axeman with an injured barb axeman next to it figuring it wouldn't attack but heal or if it did attack I would win easily. He attack and goodbye Hastings. Luckily it wasn't razed and I took it back the very next turn but I had to turn around and rebuild its library again setting it back many years worth of culture.
And now for the biggest problem of all, I managed to found ZERO religions getting beat by just a few turns a number of times. In most of my culture games I skip the early 3 and then try to sweep the rest hoping one of the others had spread to me so I have plenty of religions to make cathedrals. With all the jungle and big lake to the East it took FOREVER to get even a single religion. Not good.
To get to enough cities to build all the cathedrals I wanted to I had to found one city a little too close to Isabella and she was none too pleased about it. Her culture border was pushing on that city with her land being right next to the city. I figured I would be able to push her back once I got some of the stuff I wanted to build there. But before I got the chance she landed the most impressive stack I have seen yet in Civ4 for the AI.
The list wasn't long enough to cover all the units but there were a few more axes and a number of spears also in that stack. Needless to say I was in no position for a stack like that showing up at my doorstep. This is a little past the cutoff point so I chopped the picture to get some data off the screen. And I will end here telling the rest of the story in the next spoiler.
Not one of my best efforts up to this point.
Reality: So many mistakes in 1 game isn't good.
Cities:
London 4000 BC on the starting spot
York 1675 BC south of London in the spot to grab the copper and 2 gems.
Nottingham 1250 BC on top of the stone.
Hastings 840 BC to the West of Rome near the corn spot that the barbs like to build.
Coventry in the middle of the lake to get the fish and clam to use the city as a GP factory.
Others were founded after spoiler cut off.
I targeted London, York, and Hastings as my 3 cultural cities with Coventry as my main GP city along with London.
Mistakes and mishaps:
When the barbs founded that nice city to the West of London near the corn I stationed troops outside the city and had them sit there until it grew to size 2 so it wouldn't autoraze. Unfortunately the Aztecs had 2 archers show up and beat both of the warriors fortified in the hill city. So then I had to wait for a settler to be built to claim it setting that city back a number of years.
My next big mistake came when I accidentally sent a settler to the wrong square away from his axeman protecter. Naturally this put him right next to a barb warrior. Poof goodbye settler, this set Coventry my main GP city back many many turns as I had to produce a new settler and move him back into position. In a non GOTM game I would have reloaded considering the mistake was a misclick and not a miscalculation but in GOTM those are the breaks.
Next mistake, I moved one unit out of Hastings to pick off a barb archer leaving it defended by a single axeman with an injured barb axeman next to it figuring it wouldn't attack but heal or if it did attack I would win easily. He attack and goodbye Hastings. Luckily it wasn't razed and I took it back the very next turn but I had to turn around and rebuild its library again setting it back many years worth of culture.
And now for the biggest problem of all, I managed to found ZERO religions getting beat by just a few turns a number of times. In most of my culture games I skip the early 3 and then try to sweep the rest hoping one of the others had spread to me so I have plenty of religions to make cathedrals. With all the jungle and big lake to the East it took FOREVER to get even a single religion. Not good.
To get to enough cities to build all the cathedrals I wanted to I had to found one city a little too close to Isabella and she was none too pleased about it. Her culture border was pushing on that city with her land being right next to the city. I figured I would be able to push her back once I got some of the stuff I wanted to build there. But before I got the chance she landed the most impressive stack I have seen yet in Civ4 for the AI.
The list wasn't long enough to cover all the units but there were a few more axes and a number of spears also in that stack.
Needless to say I was in no position for a stack like that showing up at my doorstep. This is a little past the cutoff point so I chopped the picture to get some data off the screen. And I will end here telling the rest of the story in the next spoiler. Not one of my best efforts up to this point.
. I guess you had been better off moving all those troops out of Warwick into the jungle.
Roland Ehnström
Prince
Very nice start Venom3. 
It's gonna be interesting to compare our games, as at 1 AD you have 4 cities (15 pop) while I had 6 cities (21 pop), but you can run at 90% science while I was down to 40% at this time... We both have Pyramids and an Academy, but you also have Oracle and Stonehenge, a Shrine and another Prophet. You have two religions founded, I have none.
Comparing our two games will more or less determine once and for all if number of cities is everything in Civ4 like in Civ3, or if more balanced tactics actually pay off now. Too bad you're going for Domination while I'm going for Space.
-- Roland
It's gonna be interesting to compare our games, as at 1 AD you have 4 cities (15 pop) while I had 6 cities (21 pop), but you can run at 90% science while I was down to 40% at this time... We both have Pyramids and an Academy, but you also have Oracle and Stonehenge, a Shrine and another Prophet. You have two religions founded, I have none.
Comparing our two games will more or less determine once and for all if number of cities is everything in Civ4 like in Civ3, or if more balanced tactics actually pay off now. Too bad you're going for Domination while I'm going for Space.
-- Roland
in retrospect I would have founded the 3rd city earlier and taken the science hit, I probably wouldnt have bothered with stone henge either. From that point on I was already starting to be boxed in expansion wise and my military was really shocking, with only 1-2 archers per city. But live and learn I guess.
one good thing is that I'll probably get that city to the west from America on the flip eventually. I'm already eating into its cultural borders without even meaning to, I think it was like that as soon as he founded it.
one good thing is that I'll probably get that city to the west from America on the flip eventually. I'm already eating into its cultural borders without even meaning to, I think it was like that as soon as he founded it.
grahamiam
In debt to Mr. Geisel
holy cow, Harok! that stack is massive! Can you try to extract the turnlog via Gyanthaar's utility and double-check to see if Isabella was at war with someone else 1st? That's a ton of Ancient units, not something expected at only Prince
that stack is massive! Can you try to extract the turnlog via Gyanthaar's utility and double-check to see if Isabella was at war with someone else 1st? That's a ton of Ancient units, not something expected at only Prince
Harok
Vagabond
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2005
- Messages
- 271
grahamiam said:holy cow, Harok!
Yeah I wasn't expecting it either.
I have never used the turn log thing but will figure it out and include it in the next spoiler. I am positive she had just recently finished a war, it was either with Saladin or Monte but I can't remember which.
Amao said:That couldn't be true.
The AI's like to fight "pretend" wars in the ancient age a lot. They'll declare war on each other but no fighting actually takes place. During that period the AI's will build units in almost all their cities because of the war status, but then they'll make peace and still have all those units sitting around.
But even then, that stack is completely massive. Notice the ... at the end of it, meaning she has even more than are displayed on the screen. I'm curious what the game date is as well and how Warwick ended up without its first ring tiles. It's generally not a good idea to place a city within 2 tiles of the AI's borders. But if Warwick was put down before Isabella's city then it's just tough luck. It looks like she culture bombed it even.
Harok
Vagabond
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2005
- Messages
- 271
The year was a little after 1100, 1120 I think but not positive. I believe there were 6-8 more units than the list shows. Warwick hadn't been around long and started out with the usual area but just a few turns after it was founded her border expanded. I built a library as the first thing and then went to the courthouse it was building when it came under seige. It actually took her a few turns to amass that many units as the stack first showed up with about 8 then 8 or so more for the next couple of turns.
I would not have normally built a city that close to her but I needed 9 cities to get 3 cathedrals and with the setbacks I described in my other post my intial expansion/land grabbing had been slower than normal so I had 2 cities less than optimally placed.
I would not have normally built a city that close to her but I needed 9 cities to get 3 cathedrals and with the setbacks I described in my other post my intial expansion/land grabbing had been slower than normal so I had 2 cities less than optimally placed.
I founded my city in the starting square. This was my first game as a financial leader and this looked like a good place to make lots of money. I sent my warrior first to the west then had him swing south and east.
My second city (York) was founded on the rivers to the West of London, while my third(Nottingham) was founded to the south by the gems and copper. I went for Stonehenge right away to get the Obelisks in every city to allow them to expand their borders without having to waste the time in each city building one.
My next city(Hastings) was built on the little peninsula on the other side of the lake from London. With the food sources in the lake and the large number of sea squares, this looked like another great place for a commerce city.
After getting the basic techs for city building, I decided to make a beeline for Alphabet. This of course allowed me to go back and trade for the techs I had passed by. Mansa Musa ended up being the best source of techs for trade. I was lagging in the tech race at this time.
I founded Canterbury next, to the Southeast of the large lake on the river. I wanted to try to block off Mansa Musa from going any further West.
I started running into happiness problems as my cities got to the 4-5 size range. At this time I put York and Hastings on do not grow, and made one of my biggest mistakes of the game when I forgot about this fact until much later in the game.
In the 1-200AD range a number of barbarian cities sprouted up around me. In succession I took Khosian, which was to the Southwest of my territory in Isabella’s direction, then Circassian which was on the peninsula on the large lake to the east. I had planned to build a city there of my own, but the barbarians founded it for me.
At this time I had to bring my research down to 40% as I fought to absorb these new cities and come up to speed with the size of the empire. I managed to found Confucianism at this time and was able to found the Kong Miao. I started producing Missionaries and spreading it as much as I could to help with my finances.
In 420AD Montezuma decided to walk half way around the world and attack me. He brought a couple of small stacks of troops, which I was able to destroy. Eventually he signed a peace treaty with me after a period of quiet. I built my army up a little at this time, but as I would find out later not quite enough.
My last barbarian acquisition was the city of Avar, which was to the South on my Eastern border. I focused on getting my finances in order at this time and started researching Currency.
So this left me with 8 cities stretching from the mountains Southeast of the English lake West along the north edge of the jungle back up along the mountains to the West of London. My finances were slowly getting better as my cottages started growing, but I still had some work to do to catch up with the AI civs in technology.
4000BC Founded London
3520BC Discovered The Wheel
2640BC Discovered Bronze Working
2240BC York Founded
2240BC Discovered Mysticism
1825BC Discovered Agriculture
1400BC Discovered Animal Husbandry
1175BC Completed Stonehenge
1150BC Discovered Pottery
980BC Founded Nottingham
840BC Discovered Writing
740BC Founded Hastings
260BC Discovered Alphabet
20AD Discovered Iron Working
40AD Canterbury Founded
200AD Captured Barbarian City of Khosian
320AD Captured Barbarian City of Circassian
330AD Discovered Code of Laws
Founded Confucianism
360AD Completed The Kong Miao
420AD Montezuma declared war on me
490AD Captured Barbarian City of Avar
My second city (York) was founded on the rivers to the West of London, while my third(Nottingham) was founded to the south by the gems and copper. I went for Stonehenge right away to get the Obelisks in every city to allow them to expand their borders without having to waste the time in each city building one.
My next city(Hastings) was built on the little peninsula on the other side of the lake from London. With the food sources in the lake and the large number of sea squares, this looked like another great place for a commerce city.
After getting the basic techs for city building, I decided to make a beeline for Alphabet. This of course allowed me to go back and trade for the techs I had passed by. Mansa Musa ended up being the best source of techs for trade. I was lagging in the tech race at this time.
I founded Canterbury next, to the Southeast of the large lake on the river. I wanted to try to block off Mansa Musa from going any further West.
I started running into happiness problems as my cities got to the 4-5 size range. At this time I put York and Hastings on do not grow, and made one of my biggest mistakes of the game when I forgot about this fact until much later in the game.
In the 1-200AD range a number of barbarian cities sprouted up around me. In succession I took Khosian, which was to the Southwest of my territory in Isabella’s direction, then Circassian which was on the peninsula on the large lake to the east. I had planned to build a city there of my own, but the barbarians founded it for me.
At this time I had to bring my research down to 40% as I fought to absorb these new cities and come up to speed with the size of the empire. I managed to found Confucianism at this time and was able to found the Kong Miao. I started producing Missionaries and spreading it as much as I could to help with my finances.
In 420AD Montezuma decided to walk half way around the world and attack me. He brought a couple of small stacks of troops, which I was able to destroy. Eventually he signed a peace treaty with me after a period of quiet. I built my army up a little at this time, but as I would find out later not quite enough.
My last barbarian acquisition was the city of Avar, which was to the South on my Eastern border. I focused on getting my finances in order at this time and started researching Currency.
So this left me with 8 cities stretching from the mountains Southeast of the English lake West along the north edge of the jungle back up along the mountains to the West of London. My finances were slowly getting better as my cottages started growing, but I still had some work to do to catch up with the AI civs in technology.
4000BC Founded London
3520BC Discovered The Wheel
2640BC Discovered Bronze Working
2240BC York Founded
2240BC Discovered Mysticism
1825BC Discovered Agriculture
1400BC Discovered Animal Husbandry
1175BC Completed Stonehenge
1150BC Discovered Pottery
980BC Founded Nottingham
840BC Discovered Writing
740BC Founded Hastings
260BC Discovered Alphabet
20AD Discovered Iron Working
40AD Canterbury Founded
200AD Captured Barbarian City of Khosian
320AD Captured Barbarian City of Circassian
330AD Discovered Code of Laws
Founded Confucianism
360AD Completed The Kong Miao
420AD Montezuma declared war on me
490AD Captured Barbarian City of Avar
Arizona_Steve
King
Gave up sometime in the early AD's. Wasn't doing too badly until Saldin declared on me. A couple of his archers were camoflaged in the forest and I completely missed them. He captured two workers. I decided it wasn't worth continuing.
I had many setbacks in my game including lost a just conquered barbarian city to Mali. And my attack force deminished under poorly defended Spanish city simply because of the odds. I also had my only horse resource pillaged by Saladin. Not to mention that more than 5 workers got captured or lost to different enemies. But, come on! I didn't lose my game yet! They were just the price of learning.Arizona_Steve said:
Similar threads
