Zardnaar
Deity
In the USA/Europe and probably a few other places immigration has become a hot button topic. Broadly speaking the extremes seem to be "let them in" and "they want our jobs".
I live in New Zealand and we are one of the most diverse pro immigrant countries on the planet. I used to be right of centre but are probably left of center now. In USA terms this would make me somewhere between a blue dog Democrat to somewhere in the middle. Last election I voted for a 37 yo unmarried pregnant women and have voted for a female candidate around 50% of the time.
In NZ immigration has become a hot button issue as well. In 2017 we had a change of government where a popular right wing neo liberal government was turfed out and replaced by a party that got a smaller % of the vote. This is because they had no friends to coalition with. Unlike Europe and the US this right wing government was very pro immigration. The immigration levels however were unsustainable. NZ has a small population but lots of land but we could not build houses fast enough along with infrastructure, class sizes+ pressure on the public health sector. For the most part we get free (via taxes true) health care although you can go private if you want (its cheaper than the USA private care).
We were letting in over 100k people per year (70k gain after departures changed the ethnic make up though) and over a 10 year period the population went from 4 million to 4.5 million. In land size NZ is bigger than the UK but due to various laws and the farming based economy no to much land is actually available to build houses. This caused a housing crisis where NZ started to get homeless people in significant numbers. When I was younger the homeless people in NZ were around 200 people and we have universal welfare here. House prices in popular parts of the country shot up to around a million dollars. Per capita in USA terms were were letting in around 7 million migrants a year (way more than immigration from central/South America). In European terms per capital the refugee crisis Germany was having. Well that was an annual event here but 20-50% higher.
New Zealand has no capital gains tax. And we have very liberal laws over who can buy property here and capital gains were hovering around 10% return per annum in some areas it hit 15% some years. If you are rich in China or the USA its fairly easy to come here and buy land. If I went to China I can't buy land period. The reason the right wing government was so pro immigration was likely due to 3 main reasons.
1. Drive up house/land prices for the investors class.
2. Made the economic figures look good. Excluding immigration though the figures were sub 1% economic growth.
3. Keep wages down for the corporate types.
In regards to 3 there are a few jobs here NZers won't do due to crap wages/conditions. Or even if the wages look alright once you factor in travel costs, accommodation costs etc they are actually bad. Some places have reputations of not willing to hire NZers who know about things like labour laws vs immigrants and tourists who don't. This is usually seasonal work on farms and vineyards. I have done such work when I was young and did not mind it but some days you might be outside in 37-39 degree Celsius weather and the wages were not that good that it made paying rent on two places worth doing. It was alright for me being young and living with parents but you are better off working at McDonald's in your local town/city if you have things like rent or mortage to pay. If you are an immigrant here with a job (any job) it makes getting citizen ship a lot easier so now we have a lot of Indians for example delivering pizzas and stocking supermarket shelves. If those immigrants were not available wages would go up and we have tens of thousands of people on unemployment. Note you would still need some immigrants for certain parts of the country and I would support a working visa type deal for them with a path to citizenship. I don't mind immigration at all, its mass immigration at the levels we are seeing that is a problem.
A side effect of the immigration I suspect was also they were importation voters en mass. We are in a position now where 5% swing can carry an election. Import half a million well off immigrants from nations that do not have a strong record on left wing issues such as labour rights and guess what happens. Last year we had our 1st conviction on a modern slavery charge. To many crap employers here have been exploiting their workers in jobs NZers generally don't do and in some cases have been out right abusing them. Generally in most developed democracies the cities are liberal the country side conservative but in Auckland where 40% of the population is foreign born several left wing seats are now voting right wing.
Since around 1/3rd of the population now lives in Auckland a large number of NZers have friends and family up there and we are hearing stories of things like empty houses owned by foreign investors driving up the cost of living. Teachers on 50-70k per year are struggling because they can't afford to teach in our biggest city+ certain other areas. They are also struggling with classes where English is not the 1st language and schools are getting up to 2000+ students in size (mine was around 500). So immigration was causing massive social problems (still is) and we have a housing crisis. It doesn't effect us to much as we own our own house that doubled in price but its voodoo money as income has not doubles and if we sell our house we just have to go buy another over priced one (with a massive deposit to be fair, next mortgage will be smaller than the current one). I'm 40 but some of the 20 year olds friends and families are struggling with wages that in real terms are 30-50% lower than what I got 15-18 years ago and with house prices and rent that are around double what I had to deal with.
Our economic numbers look good but the way the wealth is distributed is a problem. Only 30% of the country for example earns the average wage or more. Mass immigration has either drove wages down/kept them fairly static and drove living costs through the roof. Our household is doing alright if not good relative to a lot but we don't have children and have a decent income. Put simply liberal elites in various places such as the EU and the USA have completely failed to take into account their own citizens desires. There are other factors at work as well and I regard neo liberal economics as an abject failure but this has propelled things like Brexit and the ascension of Trump to the presidency. Building a wall is idiotic but I totally understand the sentiment behind it. I suspect the solution is a top to bottom reform of everything from labour and tax laws through to immigration reform whether you live in the USA, UK, EU, Australasia or wherever.
And on a lighter note. Australian brilliance.
I live in New Zealand and we are one of the most diverse pro immigrant countries on the planet. I used to be right of centre but are probably left of center now. In USA terms this would make me somewhere between a blue dog Democrat to somewhere in the middle. Last election I voted for a 37 yo unmarried pregnant women and have voted for a female candidate around 50% of the time.
In NZ immigration has become a hot button issue as well. In 2017 we had a change of government where a popular right wing neo liberal government was turfed out and replaced by a party that got a smaller % of the vote. This is because they had no friends to coalition with. Unlike Europe and the US this right wing government was very pro immigration. The immigration levels however were unsustainable. NZ has a small population but lots of land but we could not build houses fast enough along with infrastructure, class sizes+ pressure on the public health sector. For the most part we get free (via taxes true) health care although you can go private if you want (its cheaper than the USA private care).
We were letting in over 100k people per year (70k gain after departures changed the ethnic make up though) and over a 10 year period the population went from 4 million to 4.5 million. In land size NZ is bigger than the UK but due to various laws and the farming based economy no to much land is actually available to build houses. This caused a housing crisis where NZ started to get homeless people in significant numbers. When I was younger the homeless people in NZ were around 200 people and we have universal welfare here. House prices in popular parts of the country shot up to around a million dollars. Per capita in USA terms were were letting in around 7 million migrants a year (way more than immigration from central/South America). In European terms per capital the refugee crisis Germany was having. Well that was an annual event here but 20-50% higher.
New Zealand has no capital gains tax. And we have very liberal laws over who can buy property here and capital gains were hovering around 10% return per annum in some areas it hit 15% some years. If you are rich in China or the USA its fairly easy to come here and buy land. If I went to China I can't buy land period. The reason the right wing government was so pro immigration was likely due to 3 main reasons.
1. Drive up house/land prices for the investors class.
2. Made the economic figures look good. Excluding immigration though the figures were sub 1% economic growth.
3. Keep wages down for the corporate types.
In regards to 3 there are a few jobs here NZers won't do due to crap wages/conditions. Or even if the wages look alright once you factor in travel costs, accommodation costs etc they are actually bad. Some places have reputations of not willing to hire NZers who know about things like labour laws vs immigrants and tourists who don't. This is usually seasonal work on farms and vineyards. I have done such work when I was young and did not mind it but some days you might be outside in 37-39 degree Celsius weather and the wages were not that good that it made paying rent on two places worth doing. It was alright for me being young and living with parents but you are better off working at McDonald's in your local town/city if you have things like rent or mortage to pay. If you are an immigrant here with a job (any job) it makes getting citizen ship a lot easier so now we have a lot of Indians for example delivering pizzas and stocking supermarket shelves. If those immigrants were not available wages would go up and we have tens of thousands of people on unemployment. Note you would still need some immigrants for certain parts of the country and I would support a working visa type deal for them with a path to citizenship. I don't mind immigration at all, its mass immigration at the levels we are seeing that is a problem.
A side effect of the immigration I suspect was also they were importation voters en mass. We are in a position now where 5% swing can carry an election. Import half a million well off immigrants from nations that do not have a strong record on left wing issues such as labour rights and guess what happens. Last year we had our 1st conviction on a modern slavery charge. To many crap employers here have been exploiting their workers in jobs NZers generally don't do and in some cases have been out right abusing them. Generally in most developed democracies the cities are liberal the country side conservative but in Auckland where 40% of the population is foreign born several left wing seats are now voting right wing.
Since around 1/3rd of the population now lives in Auckland a large number of NZers have friends and family up there and we are hearing stories of things like empty houses owned by foreign investors driving up the cost of living. Teachers on 50-70k per year are struggling because they can't afford to teach in our biggest city+ certain other areas. They are also struggling with classes where English is not the 1st language and schools are getting up to 2000+ students in size (mine was around 500). So immigration was causing massive social problems (still is) and we have a housing crisis. It doesn't effect us to much as we own our own house that doubled in price but its voodoo money as income has not doubles and if we sell our house we just have to go buy another over priced one (with a massive deposit to be fair, next mortgage will be smaller than the current one). I'm 40 but some of the 20 year olds friends and families are struggling with wages that in real terms are 30-50% lower than what I got 15-18 years ago and with house prices and rent that are around double what I had to deal with.
Our economic numbers look good but the way the wealth is distributed is a problem. Only 30% of the country for example earns the average wage or more. Mass immigration has either drove wages down/kept them fairly static and drove living costs through the roof. Our household is doing alright if not good relative to a lot but we don't have children and have a decent income. Put simply liberal elites in various places such as the EU and the USA have completely failed to take into account their own citizens desires. There are other factors at work as well and I regard neo liberal economics as an abject failure but this has propelled things like Brexit and the ascension of Trump to the presidency. Building a wall is idiotic but I totally understand the sentiment behind it. I suspect the solution is a top to bottom reform of everything from labour and tax laws through to immigration reform whether you live in the USA, UK, EU, Australasia or wherever.
And on a lighter note. Australian brilliance.
