Immortal - How to pit AIs against each other ?

[Magean]

Hi,

I started my second Immortal game yesterday. First one was as Venice, I won surprisingly easily (diplo victory though I could have won science a few turns later), but Venice removes a lot of the risk taking anyway.

I picked Russia and decided to go the liberty-wide challenge. I'm more used to tradition-tall and I think I would even fare better at wide with tradition, but I thought.. let's try something new. Even while the second immortal game is perhaps not the best time to try something new. I also wanted to go wide to maximize Russia's UA, in order to trade loads of horses/iron.

The map was tweaked Continents Plus (without the specific CS placement on islands).

I had two runaways in this game. Pocatello on my continent, who expanded like crazy, as usual. And William on the other continent, who went 4-city tall. Till the Industrial era, Pocatello had the lead. Then, William outdistanced him in culture, tech, and even military. A quite surprising outcome since wide AI tend to be stronger on the long run than tall ones.

Pocatello's empire was far too strong and spread out for me to attack him early (starting near Dandolo left him much room to expand). So I preferred keeping him as a friend and trading partner till modern warfare makes blitzkrieg possible.

But I hadn't expected, when I met the civs of the other continent, that William would become that powerful. And since I started in the middle of a compact landmass, it took me time to set up productive coastal cities. Moreover, William is at an extremely hard to hit position, see a screen with map revealed :

I really need to get around the continents and a naval invasion would be hard to sustain.

So I thought I could defuse the Netherlander threat by bribing other guys into war against him. Nobody agreed, neither to a bought DoW or to a 10-turns-pending war agreement... Since he wasn't prone to expansion, and was peaceful and nice, most other leaders loved him. Even Shaka and Alexander wouldn't go to war against him.

Later, Pocatello and William picked Order (William was first). They became best buddies, teamed up against poor Shaka... While they should have been victory competitors.

I lost hope since I couldn't strike them both at the same time. DoW'ing the Shoshones would have resulted in a long war, leaving enough time to William to become unstoppable. DoW'ing William would have left me vulnerable to Pocatello's inevitable counter-strike.

So, here's the thing : I've read multiple times that it's important at higher difficulty levels to handle the AIs into warring against each other, but I can't figure how to do it. I'd also like to make the best use possible of Cult of Personality (tear 3 Autocracy tenet granting +50% tourism boost to allies in a war), since I want to perform better at Autocratic culture victories. Unfortunately I'm bad at it, ATM.

Thanks in advance for your advice

 

[RaidandTrade]

My $0.02...

I've been working with bribing AIs to fight each other. Use demographics to see if one of the guys you want is either strongest or weakest in military - that'll give you a little clue. If they're strongest, they're more likely to be bribed to DOW someone. If they're weakest then whoever you want to bribe to fight them is more likely to go for it.

Also check diplo. If they've denounced someone, again, likelihood of them going for war improves. If they're friends, chances reduced.

Some of the more warmonger types seem to be more willing to Dow. I paid Japan to DOW Songhai and 100 turns later they were still at it - a bargain if ever there was one for one furs for 30 turns.

You can also shop around if you have a specific target in mind.

If none of that works, try getting them to DOW a city state instead. That will get them hated and you might then have a better chance getting someone to go after them.

 

[Magean]

Also check diplo. If they've denounced someone, again, likelihood of them going for war improves. If they're friends, chances reduced.

Alas, since BNW AIs seem to be much more prone to sign many DoF and stay in good terms with most of their neighbours. Excepted Shaka, Monty and the other psychos, the rule is that everybody is friend with everybody.

If none of that works, try getting them to DOW a city state instead. That will get them hated and you might then have a better chance getting someone to go after them.

Aha, thanks ! That may do the job.

 

[phillipwyllie]

I find you must denounce first before the AI will join in. Denounce and click next turn and you'll see if you have any potential allies, or potential threats.
Another way is to get a DOF with your target and piss him off. If the target denounces you whilst the DOF is in progress then they will suffer diplomatically. Then you denounce and see what transpires.

My second tip happened in my current game unintentionally. I spawned next to Rome and Augustus settled his fourth city near the spot I want to plant my third. I had to raze that city and suffered diplomatically with the rest of the known world. Rome and I eventually had a DOF and a RA(Rome was being deceitful). Out of the blue Augustus denounces me whilst the DOF is active, I denounce back and next turn 4 civs denounce Rome. Wasn't hard to get allies after that.....