Insane AC results

[xienwolf]

Actually, instead of a ritual I might make it a process. Then he is lured to your city only for as long as the city is acting to lure him, but the city doesn't REQUIRE any production at all to accomplish it (though it also cannot swap over to make backup defenders while you wait for arrival), and you can break off the attraction at will. I can potentially make this a seperate process per Horseman, so that you can choose which to lure if 2 are in the world at once, and don't summon down quad-doom on yourself should all 4 be in the world at once.

 

[Korias]

I agree with Warkirby on the issue of general area attraction- that would solve the issue of you stockpiling your troops in the city where you build the ritual and wait for the Horsemen to show up.

 

[WarKirby]

I can potentially make this a seperate process per Horseman, so that you can choose which to lure if 2 are in the world at once, and don't summon down quad-doom on yourself should all 4 be in the world at once.

Since when is armageddon about cherry picking your fights?

I'd say just make it a "piss off demons" process, that attracts all the horsemen, sailor's dirge, avatar of wrath, and random wandering demons, if they happen to be around.

Maybe give them a strength bonus while they're in your territory, too. Since being able to control when you fight is kind of a big advantage.

 

[2Hydroclopse]

That could be an awesome defense, should you be at peace with the demons and your enemies not be.

Who needs archers on your cities when the four horseman prowl your streets.

To be fair you would have to make it war-dec demons I suppose.

 

[Korias]

That could be an awesome defense, should you be at peace with the demons and your enemies not be.

Who needs archers on your cities when the four horseman prowl your streets.

To be fair you would have to make it war-dec demons I suppose.

Yeah, you would have to make it a war-dec on demons. After all, you ARE taunting them

 

[Korias]

Double Post

 

[dyx]

Stupid horsemen never did anything for me, I guess they're not balanced for marathon games which don't have skyrocketing AC...
By the time they arrive for me everyone has enough cities and units to kill them off. I'd like them to scale a bit, or maybe make the AI build less units, because it can easily overwhelm those buggers.
I'd like them to be a real thread in the endgame, especially because the AC is designed to make the endgame less boring, right? The way it is those guys kill the fun early on and that's it.

 

[stupidnewbie]

I don't think this is supposed to happen. I'm certain non-living units were supposed to be immune to AC 100.

I just looked at the python... undead units are immune to AC 100. Then it checks if you're scions, and if you are, it runs your undead units through a kill check with a 20% lower chance to fail.

But for everyone else, your undead units should be fine!

 

[WarKirby]

That doesn't seem fair. One of the primary reasons you'd want to pick an undead civ, is to... be undead. Not much fun being so if you don't get the good parts of not being alive.

I shall poke tarquelne

 

[Valkrionn]

The check was put in because others said it was unfair they were immune.

Personally, I think a partial immunity, which they have, is good. The Scions are not truly undead in my mind... They're not living, but they also aren't skeletons or zombies or any kind of traditional undead.

 

[Iceciro]

The scions are intelligent undead. But for me, I still point them at the same list of immunities your average D&D Lich has, (since Fall is based on a D&D game at it's core) which includes
"Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects)". Immunity to Poison, Sleep effects, paralysis, stunning, disease, death effects and critical hits."

If my undead suddenly become victims to things your average skeleton/lich would not, they need to be affected by all of the buffs which miss them in the game currently because they don't apply to "not alive" targets.
The Scions are either "full undead" or not. I think you take a lot of the flavor away from them by making them something else.

 

[Valkrionn]

Oh, I make them immune to all kinds if disease and effects that shouldn't affect undead... But I think 100 AC is a valid exception.

 

[Iceciro]

I like the idea of giving them immunity to AC100 because it gives you a reason to go AV Scions instead of some other religion (the others are generally much better than AV for the Scions. Oh boy, we can use 1.5 food per pop instead of 2! wait a second...)
Cause Armageddon then slaughter the rest of the world with your walking dead because they were able to weather the wrath.

 

[Valkrionn]

Not a bad point... I tend not to think about religion as scions. Guess who I play.

 

[Iceciro]

I tend to. Guess who I play (Hint: Not Korinna.)

 

[Tarquelne]

The check was put in because others said it was unfair they were immune.

Yep.

And it'd be fine with me if they were fully immune. One of those balance vs. lore(ish) decisions.

If the final decision comes down to "fun", I can still see it going either way. Might depend on how often AC 100 comes up in your games. It rarely comes to that in my games, so I think the Scion's exception would be a fun variation. If AC100 were common I'd probably find it too unbalancing to be fun.

 

[Iceciro]

I've never seen AC100. If the Scions were immune to it I could see AV Korrinna or Xiven a viable strat, rush the AC as high as you can then mop up everyone you can while they're crippled by it. And thus, I might actually see it.

 

[stupidnewbie]

Yeah, I can't even remember the last time the AC reached 40 without me actively trying to pump it up. That probably has more to do with the early game FoL/RoK world takeover, though. If the Sheaim, or anyone else I guess, were to ever actually adopt AV, I'm sure it would be different.

 

[Iceciro]

I've noticed the early game FoL/RoK takeover hasn't been such an issue with the new tech trees for the AIs, but I've never seen AV become dominant either.
The real problem is that there's only one civ that gets a big fat buff from going AV and that's the Sheiam, and they tend to start fights with nearby neighbors, lowering their techspeed and increasing the possibility they get reduced to a greasy spot long before AV is even founded.

 

[stupidnewbie]

I've noticed the early game FoL/RoK takeover hasn't been such an issue with the new tech trees for the AIs, but I've never seen AV become dominant either.

Tell that to these people.

Though, I guess order would outnumber RoK if I'd stop killing them off... Still, every religion but AV is active in this game.