Is a Great Person really so great?

CalGal

Chieftain
Joined
Jun 13, 2014
Messages
48
Location
Monterey, CA
I have earned a couple of Great Persons now. It kinda bugs me that the only place to build a Landmark via Great Guy is to put it on a tile that is already producing, e.g., Farmland. So it will reduce my Green Apple but increase my Hammer. Is it better to replace my Farm with a Manufactory?? :confused: as usual....
 
Use Great Engineer to rush hammer production in city, which almost always means build wonder in 1 turn?
 
I have earned a couple of Great Persons now. It kinda bugs me that the only place to build a Landmark via Great Guy is to put it on a tile that is already producing, e.g., Farmland. So it will reduce my Green Apple but increase my Hammer. Is it better to replace my Farm with a Manufactory?? :confused: as usual....

Not on a farm, no. Manufactories work best on resource tiles like iron or coal or aluminum etc.
 
I put manufactories on plains, sometimes even grassland. You have a lot of tiles usually, put it where you will get the most benefit.

If I find a decent early mountainside city, ot gets NC and an Observatory and all my academies.
 
That's a good idea.. You could add great farmers or expert farmer great people that can increase food in a tile.
 
I never use great people for the tile improvements.


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I never use great people for the tile improvements.

Aside from Scientists achieved early, this is a good way to go. Manufactories are a waste considering how good you can make mines with certain tenets, and especially considering the value of a 1 turn wonder.
 
Aside from Scientists achieved early, this is a good way to go. Manufactories are a waste considering how good you can make mines with certain tenets, and especially considering the value of a 1 turn wonder.

Agreed. Plant your first 2-3 GS but keep your GE for building (1) Wonders on higher difficulties (2) spaceparts if aiming for a SV and you go Order. Good places to plant your GS are sheep and horse tiles and if you got a bunch of mines then placing on just one mine isn't going to hurt your production much.

As the game progresses and you discover technologies you'll discover iron, coal, aluminum and oil. Working those gives you a ton of production so I haven't had a need to plant a GE since as long as I can remember. In this screen shot I put in another thread you'll see my planted scientists but I also have enough production because of iron, coal and aluminum, quarry and tenets that boost them.
Spoiler :


One of my expos has even more production but a lot less food growth.
 
I usually settle great people until about the modern era. And I usually do NOT run out of tiles. If I start running out of tiles, I settle them in a 2nd city.

I prefer to settle them on a grassland tile with no fresh water, saving the irrigated tiles for farms. I like to settle them on 2F tiles because it helps my city grow huge. Putting them on a marsh is great since it saves the worker from having to drain it.

I love settling great engineers, I can never get enough hammers in my capital. I generally only use GE's to get wonders if the wonder is absolutely critical to my game, or if it's late game and I don't care about upgrading tiles. Usually if I am willing to use a GE to get a wonder, I am also willing to ragequit if I don't get that wonder. Otherwise, I prefer to settle him, even pretty late game.

One reason why I never run out of tiles is because mid/late game I start running a lot of specialists.

If you are planning to go tall, FREEDOM gives you an awesome social policy that doubles the output of the great people tiles. Plus the other modifiers you can get over time, they are truly awesome.

Remember that the great people tiles are "primary production", that benefit from all the other modifiers.
 
If I was to settle great people, would it br better to put them alk on my capital or spread them out to several cities?
 
I think the philosophy is: if your cap is you science hog, then all academies should go there. Concentrated base science that takes advantage of all those multipliers. Manufactories are similar - focus on your wonder city or unit city. I think the exception is when you have one of those expansion cities that just bogs you down because it's production sucks.
 
Well in a normal game, you should not produce GE at all actually, as engineer slots are used only in the very late game ... So the only GE's you get should be the bonus GE's you get from building something (like Pisa, or liberti finisher etc.) or bought with faith.
 
@tegofc
It's one of the best starting locations I've ever seen. Seriously.

There are several rules of the thumb when it comes to great people:

1. Scientists
Build academies around the city with NC, which is usually your capital. If you have cities with an observatory, they are as good. Since industrial era, it's better to bulb them, i.e. use to discover an advancement early. Remember that you can queue your research on the tech tree with shift-click. This way you won't waste excessive hammers on something you don't want/need tight now.

2. Engineers
They are best used to hurry production in a city. You get (X + Y*citizen) hammers when you do so which is important because bigger cities will allow you to build bigger wonders. If there are no useful wonders available and there won't be any for quite some time, improve a tile because it's always some additional production and it also eliminates unkeep for the unit.

3. Artist, writers and musicians
Being able to defend yourself against enemy influence is important in BNW so all early units of these types pretty much must be used for their great works. Try to time their appearance with appropriate buildings. In late game, their instant benefits may come handier, though if you are going for cultural victory, remember that their tiny bonus to tourism will be multiplied by many factors so it's not the basic +2:tourism:

4. Merchants
Aka the useless ones. Their tile improvement is negligible and their trade mission is only slightly better. Try not to earn any.

5. Generals and admirals
Admirals are useful merely as combat aid on the sea. They help, though if you don't have +2 movement for them, they can be a burden. Generals are much better because they can steal land. sometimes it's the most important feature for me, in other cases I want to block certain route with a citadel, and sometimes they just stick with armies. They are their own specific case.

6. Location of tile improvements
It's usually the best option to place great people's improvements on strategic resources because they can connect them and will also provide small tile improvement bonus. Note that it does not work with luxury resources. In early game, make sure that you are getting enough food so if you have an empty grassland and a hill with iron to choose from, the grassland may be a better option.

7. Tile improvement vs. an immediate benefit
There's one more thing to remember besides what was already said. On one hand, if you are planning to go down the freedom path, you'll be doubling the quality of great people's improvements, and if you will also be able to create numerous great people in your empire, the combined benefit will be huge. On the other hand, if you won't be getting any additional bonuses from such tile improvements, it's obvious that you should not focus on them too much.
 
GWAM rule of thumb - Am I going for a cultural victory?

Yes - settle, settle, bomb musicians later
No - Political Treastise, Golden Age, settle musician.
 
Aside from Scientists achieved early, this is a good way to go. Manufactories are a waste considering how good you can make mines with certain tenets, and especially considering the value of a 1 turn wonder.

ENGINEER:

I think people really underrate the power of Manufactories when one of your cities lacks production.

There are sometimes brilliant locations to settle (natural wonders, luxuries, strategic position etc ) which still have very small production. Yeah, production trade routes, but production trade routes aren't always possible (and you still 'waste' one of trade route slots).

For example, my Arabian game on TSL Earth. I start in Iraq, settle second city in Mecca spot, settle third city in very good coastal location of Oman - but this location completely lacks production (flat deserts). I plant manufacture here, boom, naval exploration and quick development while I use my trade routes slots to spread religion (Arabian UA).

Although of course usually I use Engineer to boost wonder production (85 - 90% of cases).

MERCHANT

Underrated. +30 influence with few hundred gold basically means free alliance with City - State. No gold? No problem - you can snipe this valuable CS from runaway civ.

Although I have to admit, his terrain improvement is ridiculous. I have never built it.

SCIENTIST

Did anyone said Academy is weak? Get Scientist in early - mid game. Plant Academy in science city with percentage bonuses (such as National College). Plant few more Academies in this single city. Free Scientific Victory.

Seriously, I use him to discover tech only in really late game or if this tech is really valuable (Shaka attacking me and I need 8 more turns to discover Crossbowmen!! :p )

ADMIRAL

Well, definitely the weakest Great Person. Although some genius released the mod on Steam Workshop, Great Admiral Aquaculture, which essentially allows to sacrifice Great Admiral for improved Fish tile. You think it is weak? With Seaport this is something like +7 yield on a normal sea tile.
 
One thought or maybe observation with placing Great People, if you have deer on grassland with forest that yields a base of 3 food 1 hammer with a granary but no camp. Chopping the forest or putting an academy on it would mean you get a base 4 food tile right? 2 food from grasslands, 1 from deer and 1 from granary. The camp bonus isn't that great so this could be an efficient way of working a great person tile and still make a lot of food from the base tile?
 
MERCHANT

Underrated. +30 influence with few hundred gold basically means free alliance with City - State. No gold? No problem - you can snipe this valuable CS from runaway civ.

Although I have to admit, his terrain improvement is ridiculous. I have never built it.

It's not that merchants themselves are underrated, it's that they increase the cost of other scientists and engineers, and that's just not worth what they bring to the table. Scientists are better, period. Engineers are better. Period. Merchants are okay, but they're very clearly 3rd in that race, so if I have a choice, I'm never spawning a merchant.

Aside from games where I grab some early oddball wonder I never do (like the Colossus or something), I never spawn one. Can't remember the last game I did.
 
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