Is this game winnable

[Ribannah]

The capital is in the right place, where it has lots of tiles to work. It has lots of food without trade routes, so send your food Cargo Ships to St. Petersburg which needs them.

Novgorod needs to be on the plains, one tile further from Moscow, where it has access to a few additional tiles. This is where you want Petra.

And do build that Whales town. Four is better than three. Settle on the snow.

 

[Memoryjar]

Domination will be tricky (longer), one caps is non coastal and in my game it's civ leader cap.

 

[nokmirt]

Maybe if you can meet everyone and sell all that salt. Are you using any mods? Way too much salt there.

 

[beetle]

The capital is in the right place

I respectfully disagree. I think he needs to be able to build workboat in the cap.

 

[wydon]

Are you using any mods? Way too much salt there.

Only legendary start, that's why I tend not to move on turn 1.

Novgorod needs to be on the plains

I settled on desert to get something outta that tile.

 

[Memoryjar]

I respectfully disagree. I think he needs to be able to build workboat in the cap.

I agree your disagree. More for frigate and privateer building than workboat.
I settled Moscow on coast between salt tiles to have access to Sri Panda (4 salt + 2 wheat + Sri Panda = size 17 T120).
Novgorod is on tundra hill to have access to whales, 2 fish tiles, 3 deers, 2 salt (and Iron later).
I didn't gamble a third cities in desert near Quebec. Without a lux, I thought I'll have unhappiness issue. I was right. I avoid growth 3/4 turns before having Coliseums up and I need to build Circus Maximus.
Now with an AI capital with Notre Dame and Chichen Itza and two lux, it's easier.

 

[beetle]

No marble friend, it's just wine & salt to start and whale if I can expand to it.

Sorry about that. What is the Marble icon in the cap? Lux the city is asking for? I don’t think I have ever seen that before, but I don’t turn the bubbles turned on except for screen shots. Yes, I bet you pick up the whale before too long, just from natural border growth in the cap.

More for frigate and privateer building than workboat.

Agreed, but missing easy workboats is the first pain point.

I settled Moscow on coast between salt tiles to have access to Sri Panda (4 salt + 2 wheat + Sri Panda = size 17 T120).

Best spot for cap, but is it realistic to find that if you didn’t have map foreknowledge?

I didn't gamble a third cities in desert near Quebec. Without a lux, I thought I'll have unhappiness issue. I was right. I avoid growth 3/4 turns before having Coliseums up and I need to build Circus Maximus. Now with an AI capital with Notre Dame and Chichen Itza and two lux, it's easier.

I don’t blame you for waiting, but I think you have St. Petersburg right where OP put it, if only because you don’t want an AI city that close. You can run rails to it, so I feel like that’s better than picking up an off-continent city with a lux.

 

[Chum]

Workboats aren't even the important part. The Lighthouse is the important part. That's what turns all your fish into stuff you can work and grow on early.

 

[LoneRebel]

Dude, look at Moscow and Novgorod. Now think about what you said about a 3 tile radius.

The 'waste' there is that half of a city's potential is down the toilet immediately.

You don't NEED 4 cities. You certainly don't need 4 cities on that island.

Thinking it over, I suppose Novgorod could be settled instead on the plains NW of Sri Pada.

As for making Moscow coastal as people are discussing here...hmm, well he'd lose out on the river if he did. Best spots I can think of are two tiles east of its current location, which would give two additional fish, or, not as good, two tiles west. Both locations are on top of salt, though, and I'm not sure settling on salt is a good idea.

 

[Memoryjar]

Agreed, but missing easy workboats is the first pain point.

I only build workboats for lux or if it takes one turn. As Chum, I think lighthouse is more important (+2 food +1 hammer).

I agree with map acknowledge, except I didn't notice Sri Panda on screenshot and discover it when I move my worker to south.

I have 2 cities so it's St Petersburg, not Novgorod.
Other are AI caps.

 

[beetle]

Yes, being able to build navy in cap is more important than workboats. Yes, lighthouse is more important than workboats. (But cap can’t specially help expo with that.) My point is that being able to build workboats in a nearby high production city to send to new expos, even just for fish, is very important. Given continents, this alone is reason enough to settle cap on coast.

I agree with map acknowledge, except I didn't notice Sri Panda on screenshot and discover it when I move my worker to south.

Great, I want justification for playing this map with that spot for my cap! [I think you mean warrior (not worker)?]

What are names of second and third Russian cities? I may have them reversed.

 

[Uzael36]

Work boats are not an issue what so ever, as you can build them in your other cities and plant there where ever you want. The lighthouse is the only issue, if not on the coast.

 

[wydon]

This is both the greatest and worst island I have ever seen in a civ 5 game...

 

[beetle]

Workboats are not an issue what so ever, as you can build them in your other cities and plant there where ever you want.

That is my point. Workboats are an issue for OP because his cap is landlocked. He does not have a city to build them for other cities! His first expo (St. Petersburg) will take a while to become strong. Workboats would grow it 3x faster.

 

[Chum]

That is my point. Workboats are an issue for OP because his cap is landlocked. He does not have a city to build them for other cities! His first expo (St. Petersburg) will take a while to become strong. Workboats would grow it 3x faster.

Not really. You use lighthouse as a granary on sea resource heavy cities. It turns standard fish tiles into 4 food 1 hammer, and that's amazing for growth, production, and whatever else you want. We tech all the way to civil service to get those tiles for our land cities, and it doesn't take much at all to buy a few fish tiles and build lighthouse first.

Workboats come WAY later, my man. If it's not a lux, it doesn't need a workboat for a long time.

 

[Uzael36]

It's pretty easy to purchase work boats as well and with all the hills by St. Petersbug, he will be able to build boats relatively fast before too long, regardless.

 

[beetle]

I hate choosing between workboats and lighthouse because I want both. If I can avoid it, I don’t want to rush buy a workboat because the opportunity cost is too high: that gold could be an archer or 15 turns of CS alliance. I would much rather commit my cap for two turns. I think it will be 30 turns before St. Petersburg has decent production, and it won’t until it gets lighthouse, harbor, and three workboats. I am gonna try and not get dragged into this much more, since the consensus seems to be that the non-coastal start for OP is okay.

 

[Uzael36]

My point wasn't whether it was a good move or not, but it is not the lack of work boats that make it bad. He has tons of great tiles to work to be concerned about a couple missed work boats early on. When the cap gets big enough to miss them, they can be built/bought elsewhere. The lighthouse is a bigger loss.

 

[Chum]

I hate choosing between workboats and lighthouse because I want both. If I can avoid it, I don’t want to rush buy a workboat because the opportunity cost is too high: that gold could be an archer or 15 turns of CS alliance. I would much rather commit my cap for two turns. I think it will be 30 turns before St. Petersburg has decent production, and it won’t until it gets lighthouse, harbor, and three workboats. I am gonna try and not get dragged into this much more, since the consensus seems to be that the non-coastal start for OP is okay.

Come on, what city gets "decent production" in under 30 turns? Like none. The first 30 are for growing anyway.

 

[Dr. D]

1) the distance

Settling cities on top of each other only flies if you're the ai. You should generally leave 6-7 tiles between cities so you aren't over lapping borders, gimping them both resource wise in the long run.

2) the location...

"Oh look coast! I'll just settle my city one tile inland."

On an island no less.

My advice to the OP is; when settling cities, completely ignore the little gold flags that pop up when your settler is selected. An optimal place to settle cities is on top of a hill (windmill) next to a river (watermill/hydro plant) and on the coast (obv reasons). Don't just blow your settlers because the ai tells you to. Try to picture how large the borders are going to be at 20-25 population.

Not sure where you're getting at with either of those points.

First, I'm pretty sure you'll find the majority of people will say that spacing cities six (much less seven) tiles apart is unnecessarily far... the likelihood of working all of those tiles is extremely minimal and that's assuming you've filled up all your specialist slots. Yes, bunching several cities together three tiles apart is likely a bad idea, but sometimes it's necessary to put cities that close to grab certain resources.

Secondly, you might want to take another look at the screenshots provided... the only city not on the coast is Moscow and it's hard to fault the OP from settling in place with that start.



Back to the original topic, I think this map is a classic case in which there sometimes aren't ideal places to settle. Moscow really is in a fantastic spot, but given that this is an island and there aren't really many other consensus no-brainer settling spots, this map was generated to frustrate anyone who starts in this location.