Isolated start

[Entilzha]

I'm curious; what do you guys do when you have a start that is so isolated you cannot meet any civs or even city states until you've researched embarkation? Would you just reroll? Research Optics asap? Stay under the radar as long as possible? Or do something else?

Obviously your early game will suffer with no workers to steal or civs to sell luxuries to, but being difficult to attack has merit, too. I assume it would somewhat depend on dificulty level, too.

Here's a screenshot of what I mean. Note that I'm not asking for advice on my game. I've already decided to just go with the start and see what happens. But I'm curious how people react to something like that.

Spoiler :

 

[Phukit]

researching optics here isnt a big deal.we dont have to worry about defending against early dows or barbs so we can do a nice 3 city tradition and grow from there. could be some CS and other civs not far away.

early NC then beeling astronomy

 

[Sclb]

Consider going liberty and use the finisher for a great admiral to cross the ocean before astronomy. One of the difficult thing for liberty is the limited land to settle on, and with isolated start, this problem is solved. Also you get a free worker and much faster settlers.

 

[joncnunn]

Hum, on this start, I'd go back to the initial 4000 BC auto save, and assuming the settler started on the hill tile your capital is move it SE to the coast.

 

[stormtrooper412]

Not a bad starting dirt though. You are going to be a bit in the dark but there's a big chance someone is just around the corner and you don't need Astronomy for them, just Sailing

 

[HughFran]

Obviously your early game will suffer with no workers to steal

By stealing workers - do you mean DoW on another Civ or CS just to get their worker or do you mean recovering them from a Barb camp? I never go to war just to steal a worker but I would occasionally take a worker from a Barb camp.

As for isolation games, I kind of like them. I like getting my infrastructure up to speed before meeting anybody. More times than not (especially on higher levels), the closer the AIs are, the earlier war will be declared and therefore resources having to be poured into units instead of Science/Culture

ps I always start with raging barbarians so an isolated start means more of them to kill and more culture generated from unlocking (just unlocking, nothing more) Honor

 

[Sclb]

Isolated start is always slower on higher difficulty due to lack of early beaker leeching and worker stealing from neighbor ai. Also science discount only applies after meeting other civs. Most AI won't DoW later if you send them early caravans even after stealing their workers and making peace. For the ones that will DoW, you can always bribe them to keep them busy with other AI for cheap price.

 

[beetle]

OP, did you know the map settings at the start or was it all random? I don't mind starting isolation and hard-building my workers, but being tricked, like maybe you were, from just missing the coast would be too much of a handicap for me!

Hum, on this start, I'd go back to the initial 4000 BC auto save, and assuming the settler started on the hill tile your capital is move it SE to the coast.

Where the warrior is now is good too. Rivers always usually lead to the ocean. So maybe not cheating too much to follow it down up stream.

 

[FrostK]

I would restart - settle on desert hill and try to go 2 city, 2 cargo > Petra. Will prolly loose Petra to AI and go new game.

 

[Entilzha]

OP, did you know the map settings at the start or was it all random? I don't mind starting isolation and hard-building my workers, but being tricked, like maybe you were, from just missing the coast would be too much of a handicap for me!



Where the warrior is now is good too. Rivers always usually lead to the ocean. So maybe not cheating too much to follow it down up stream.

It was completely random.
I actually met someone else fairly soon, because Honolulu is right beyond that mountain range cutting me off from the rest of the continent. But the game didn't work out well; I went into Patronage trying for a DipV and then found out that Alexander is in the game, so trying to keep a CS allied is like hitting my head against a brick wall. For some reason, I can't get my cities to grow well despite Tradition, so I must have done something wrong somewhere.
I'm planning to reload the turn 1 autosave and start over, see if I can do better the second time around.

By stealing workers - do you mean DoW on another Civ or CS just to get their worker or do you mean recovering them from a Barb camp? I never go to war just to steal a worker but I would occasionally take a worker from a Barb camp.

As for isolation games, I kind of like them. I like getting my infrastructure up to speed before meeting anybody. More times than not (especially on higher levels), the closer the AIs are, the earlier war will be declared and therefore resources having to be poured into units instead of Science/Culture

ps I always start with raging barbarians so an isolated start means more of them to kill and more culture generated from unlocking (just unlocking, nothing more) Honor

I'm talking stealing from AI/CS. I only started to do that a few months ago when I started to read up on strategies and it has markedly improved my performance.

 

[beetle]

Like I said before, I kind of like isolated started -- but zero CS access is kind of harsh.

It was completely random.

That is why I hate random starts! I also don't want naval civs on a map without oceans.

I went into Patronage trying for a DipV and then found out that Alexander is in the game, so trying to keep a CS allied is like hitting my head against a brick wall.

Start early and spend often. None of the AI, including Alex, will spend more than 500 gold for ally status. But diplo is not much fun IMHO.

For some reason, I can't get my cities to grow well despite Tradition, so I must have done something wrong somewhere. I'm planning to reload the turn 1 autosave and start over, see if I can do better the second time around.

Please consider posting the file. What difficulty level is it? I know just where I want to my four cities!

I'm talking stealing from AI/CS. I only started to do that a few months ago when I started to read up on strategies and it has markedly improved my performance.

Yes, but stealing from CS is kind of a crutch. If you need the boost to win, it makes progressing to the next level harder. Since I pretty much gave it up (on Deity no less), I am finding good opportunities for late game CS DOW that I value more.

 

[Entilzha]

Please consider posting the file. What difficulty level is it? I know just where I want to my four cities!

It's King difficulty so it might be too easy for you if you're playing Deity regularly. But I'll gladly give you the save if you can tell me how to upload it to here. I've never done that before.

Note that it is a modded game; you will need the following mods to play it:
Sukritact's Maasai civilization (v.2) (who I was playing)
JFD's Civilopedia (v.1)
Historical Religions Complete (BNW or GK) (V.27)

Also, sorry for being clueless; would you need the one called AutoSave_0000 or the one called AutoSave_Initial_0000? Or does that not matter? Just found out that the AutoSave_0000 is after I played my first turn, so you would obviously need the Initial one. Consider this question solved.

 

[Sclb]

One way to deal with Alex, would be to DoW him once you have enough CS so that he can't steal any more. Game is trivial if you can conquer him.

 

[shaglio]

Sukritact's Maasai civilization (v.2) (who I was playing)

That's who that was! I knew it was a modded civ, but I couldn't read the capital's name. Sooki might want to rethink that color combination (although, I don't remember having an issue when I played them).

 

[FaohKi]

I love isolated starts. I would definitely would continue to play that game.

Btw, in isolated start like this also helps you to gain culture from barbarians. How? Open Honor tree and just find a barbarian camp and bombard it with archers but never capture the camp, new barbarians gonna be there soon. Just kill them and enjoy your fast groving culture Also, "Raging Barbarians" would make your job easier.

 

[HughFran]

I love isolated starts. I would definitely would continue to play that game.

Btw, in isolated start like this also helps you to gain culture from barbarians. How? Open Honor tree and just find a barbarian camp and bombard it with archers but never capture the camp, new barbarians gonna be there soon. Just kill them and enjoy your fast groving culture Also, "Raging Barbarians" would make your job easier.

Exactly! I mentioned this in above post (I think) - isolation means plenty of meaty Barbs to give you loads of little culture boosts!!

 

[ShakaKhan]

Isolated starts are fine and fun up to and including immortal difficulty. At deity, you're essentially playing out the real world scenario of the Inca: you're just waiting someone to find you and annihilate you.

 

[Entilzha]

That's who that was! I knew it was a modded civ, but I couldn't read the capital's name. Sooki might want to rethink that color combination (although, I don't remember having an issue when I played them).

It's perfectly readable in game, it's just the screenshot that makes it difficult to read.

 

[Sclb]

Culture from honor opener from barb is overrated. You'll never be able to regain the culture wasted. On deity, isolated start is the worst start you can possibly get, as you'll be guaranteed to be the slowest until industrial era, so say bye to most early wonders.

 

[HughFran]

I don't think Culture from Barbs is overrated, I think it's great for an early boost and definitely not wasted culture opening Honor. I played a game recently and I was isolated for ages and I did just fine on my own for a very long time. When I finaly met other Civs, I wasn't worse off in technology. Not every isolation game ends up with you being behind, it all depends on how you utilise the situation