[BTS] News: BOTM 117, Emperor Asoka, starts October 18

[Deckhand]

BOTM 117: Asoka of India.


Peace is not the way. Asoka of India. You should be playing Gandhi, but Asoka is only leader who has never starred in BOTM. The Indian civilization would prefer to live in peace with all. But your neighbors might not agree. I will be very impressed if anyone can win without ever being at war. In fact I will be impressed by any victories at all.

Map Maker's Challenge:

Spoiler Peaceful Win :

Win without declaring war and without capturing any AI cities.

If that is too hard, you can take the easier challenge where you can capture cities but must return them all to make peace (before the city comes out of revolt).
No razing cities for either.
You can join a war if requested but must still abide by city rule.

Taking over cities via cultural flipping is allowed.
Recapturing your cities taken by AI is allowed. But you can't declare war to do so.

Game settings:
Playing as: Asoka of India
Rivals: 5 AIs
Difficulty: Emperor
Starting Era: Ancient
Speed: Normal
Options: Unrestricted leaders, no vassal states, no goody huts, no random events
Victory Conditions: All enabled

Map settings:
Map: Arboria (some missing/scarce resources added/increased)
World Wrap: None
Mapsize: Worldsize_standard
Climate: Climate_temperate
Sea level: Sealevel_medium


Asoka is Spiritual and Organized, and you start with Mysticism and Mining.
The Spiritual trait gives no anarchy and double production speed of Temple and Cristo Redentor

The Organized trait gives -50% civic upkeep and double production speed of Courthouse, Factory and Lighthouse

Unique unit: Fast Worker (replaces Worker)
The Fast Worker benefits from: 3 movement points. This compares with the Worker which has: 2 movement points.

Unique Building: Mausoleum (replaces Jail)
Provides +2 Happiness in addition to Jail features (-25% war weariness, +4 espionage, +50% espionage, can make two spy specialists). You might want to build some.

Starting screenshot

This is the start of the game (click for a bigger image):




Note that in this game, any espionage-culture victories will be counted as cultural victories.

To Enter the Competition:

This competition will open at 00:01 am on 18 Oct 2016, server local time (UTC-6:00). From that date and time, you'll be able to get your chosen starting save >>>here<<<.

Submit the save after your victory (or defeat) here, by 20 Nov 2016.

Here is a link to a list of the differences between Vanilla, Warlords and BtS.

Software Versions

Windows: This game MUST be played in Beyond the Sword (NOT Civ4 Vanilla or Warlords), patched to version 3.19, and with the BUFFY mod version 3.19.003 installed. You can download the BUFFY mod here. Players using Windows Vista or Windows 7 are encouraged to read the notes on Vista fixes here.


Macintosh: This game MUST be played in Beyond the Sword (NOT Civ4 Vanilla or Warlords), patched to version 3.19, and with the Mac BUFFY mod version 3.19.003 installed. You can download the Mac BUFFY mod here.
While playing...

Remember - for your entry to be accepted, it MUST be your first attempt to play this game, and you MUST NOT replay any turns. If you make a mistake while playing, you have to live with it, learn from it, and carry on the game without replaying.

We will open 'spoiler' threads during the month for players to discuss what happens in their games. Do not discuss any details of your game outside those threads.

 

[Dhoomstriker]

(some missing/scarce resources added/increased)

I greatly approve of this choice!

A barren Grassland square and a barren Grassland Hills square... very suspicious.

As for where to move the Warrior, I'd probably first think about where I might want to settle and then use the Warrior's movement to help make that decision.

But, which locations look best? It's not an easy choice. Where the Warrior starts looks decent, but what is on that square at 1 NW + 1 N of the Settler, which looks to be missing a Forest, which would make settling 1 N of the Warrior look better if it were a nice Resource?

Also, what about those extra Rivers in the west, if we were to settle 1 S of the G Riv Deer For? We'd miss out on the two potential Strategic Resources, but might get more Riverside squares and would get that Peak out of our capital's big fat cross.

One way to do it might be:
T0 Warrior 1 moves 1 NW G Riv Deer For
T0 Settler moves 1 SW G Riv For
T1 Warrior moves 1 NE G Riv For
The Settler then decides whether to settle in place for the two possible Strategic Resources or to move 1 N G Riv For (1 E of the Deer) if the Warrior revealed something interesting

Another way to do it might be:
T0 Warrior moves 1 SW G Riv For
If no new Resources were spotted, Settler moves 1 W G Riv For (1 E of the Deer), blindly hoping for an extra Resource in the north, but also missing out on the Grassland Hills square
T1 Warrior moves 1 NW G Riv? (1 SW of the Deer) and then the decision comes between blindly settling 1 E of the Deer or moving to 1 S of the Deer to pick up another Resource that the Warrior had revealed

With Unrestricted Leaders, can the Map Maker choose the Leader plus Civ combinations for the AIs?

It looks as though we'll be facing at least a French (Lego) army.

 

[Deckhand]

I greatly approve of this choice!

(regarding adding resources) I was influenced by your appreciation of my doing it in my last game (divided donut).
Mapmakers (this one at least) do try to please their customers and listen to suggestions.

With Unrestricted Leaders, can the Map Maker choose the Leader plus Civ combinations for the AIs?

Yes.

(I am disappointed that random personalities is just that (random) and not assignable by mapmaker. Thus we don't do that often.)

It looks as though we'll be facing at least a French (Lego) army.

neilmeister likes Legos.

 

[georgjorge]

Standard Arboria with only 5 AIs? That means there will be a lot of space to settle, and a lot of trees to chop. And that can mean only one thing:

Horse Archers!

 

[BornInCantaloup]

I wonder how favourable to a space race this map will be...
... I should remember not to make too many plans before hand, though.
The extra (happy ?) resources are a nice touch.

Settling : with deer in the 1st ring speeds up both the initial worker and the travel time to move worker onto the deer. (It should, yes ? Did not do the maths.)
Start looks very strong with only commerce being a potential issue.
Researching Hunt + AH + BW would take very long without any additional commerce source. It's not a problem in itself but it may deny, for example, going down the Mysticism line.

 

[lymond]

Arboria is a rather unused map, but I actually like it. Better suited to certain civs, but India can do well here with fast worker. Surprised Asoka has not been used in BOTM, but come to think of it, I don't recall a game with him.

Yeah, I think there are certain resources that just don't appear on this map. Usually a crap ton of deer, which are actually pretty nice with 5F usually and at least a hammer. Commerce is usually an issue on this map, but this start position already looks like a possible bureau. Also, I think the map is all or almost entirely grassland.

Hunting and AH are an issue here I think. I'm hoping for more deer hidden here, so we can go something like Hunting>BW>POT to get some cottages up early for commerce. Otherwise, expansion can hit the wallet hard early on.

Not sure if warrior move of any type will be highly useful, but as this map is rather flat, I'm thinking SIP is looking ok here with at least a hill and most likely a hidden resource for more hammers. It appears there is a non-forested tile 2N1W of settler which is odd as well. Could very well be a resource, as this map is usually entirely covered in forest unless non-forested resources are present.

(I know one can do some kinda of debug option to find the random personality setup, but not sure if it can be adjusted in a WB file)

(yeah, unrestricted combos can easily be setup in custom game options)

 

[Rusten]

I wonder how favourable to a space race this map will be...
... I should remember not to make too many plans before hand, though.
The extra (happy ?) resources are a nice touch.

Settling : with deer in the 1st ring speeds up both the initial worker and the travel time to move worker onto the deer. (It should, yes ? Did not do the maths.)
Start looks very strong with only commerce being a potential issue.
Researching Hunt + AH + BW would take very long without any additional commerce source. It's not a problem in itself but it may deny, for example, going down the Mysticism line.

You're going for space?
Maybe we should we restart the BOTM gauntlet and add a chosen VC competition? (Anyone can join)

 

[BornInCantaloup]

I think I may Settings look tempting to me.
I should probably do some map reading first, though (exploration).

Last BOTM turned out to be a fiasco for me, because I entered it with too many preconceptions and the map didn't fit them well enough and I didn't adapt my plans.
I'd like to avoid doing the same mistake, if possible.

 

[georgjorge]

I like Rusten's idea a bit because there's been low attendance for the last BOTMs - so you play a tight game to place well, and then it turns out nobody else chose your victory condition anyway. Everyone having the same victory condition might help here.

The problem with it might be that I find Conquest/Domination rather boring on lower levels (below Emperor). Horse Archers, Horse Archers, Horse Archers (with some Axes and Chariots thrown in). I always go for Space on the lower difficulties and for Conquest or Domination on the higher ones. Plus attendance might decline even more because there are people who don't want to go for Culture (like me) or Diplomatic at all.

Of course, maybe Civ VI will be so incredible that everyone will just turn to playing that, but I have some doubts about that.

 

[Rusten]

I'll go ahead and declare this month's gauntlet to be Space. These were usually played with the challenger save (doesn't exist anymore), so I'd say it's fair to limit it to the higher level BOTM (emperor+).

It's completely optional, and like the previous iteration there are no official awards from the GOTM staff. If I end up being the only one chasing the VC then too bad and no worries, but chasing the gold medal every time is of no interest to me (some of these chosen VCs, like Space, can't compete). It's simply an added incentive by player(s) for increased competition. It also makes spoiler threads more interesting as you'll have an easier time comparing your progress/gameplay. A game going for Space will be very different from one going for Conquest at 1 AD -- competely different goals.

Maybe some of the original gauntlet players (привет русские товарищи!) are still lurking too.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

Ok, let's do it !
That's it, this is it, I can feel THE FEAR creeping within. I have it.




Prolly sending the warrior SW to begin with.
Hoping I can Oracle something. *crosses fingers*

 

[Rusten]

Agree with warrior SW. Settle 1W if nothing in particular is found.
Oracling something simple like mathematics could be good here. At least based on what we see now there's not a lot of raw commerce early on so taking something big like CS is extremely ambitious. On the other hand mathematics will give immense production thanks to all the forest. But if there's enough commerce to quickly research mathematics anyway then CoL makes more sense ( --> bureaucracy).

Sid's Sushi doesn't yield much on Arboria I think, but Mining Inc should still be worthwhile. Would be nice to find an early stone for some GE points. Can stone even spawn on Arboria given that it's all grassland? If not we'd have to hope for mapmaker help.

This could be a map type suited for State Property Space though.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

Totally State Prop in my mind. Electricity, Watermills. Will have to re-assess after playing what a late-game setup can be. I doubt these decisions should be made on t0.
Depending on the worker (steals) count, a real cottage spam is also an option. Possibly even with a +100% growth civic switch (forgot the name).

Oracle -> CS, I've never seen achieved to great results. It requires too much stress on early science (vs production) to really pay off, compared with more modest bulbs that let one expand simultaneously. Rephrazed : I'd rather get 2-3 extra cities than Oracle CS.

Agreed on the settling.

 

[Rusten]

I agree completely regarding Oracle. Unless you have a silly HoF start with 2 or 3 riverside gold or gems then it can't be done without sacrificing too many other things. Taking mathematics on the other hand will boost the second expansion phase (or first war effort).

edit: CoL gives half-price courthouses though, so that might be better depending on the flow of the game. CHs will definitely be worth it at 60 hammers in a space game.

State Property was my first thought as well, but ORG trait goes well with corporations.

 

[lymond]

There is some water. Basically just one large Pangaea (unless there's more settings for Arboria that I forget) like landmass surrounded by sea. So there's usually some seafood, but certainly not enough for Sid's.

BAsed on my experience, the early CH's could help on this map.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I wonder how favourable to a space race this map will be...
... I should remember not to make too many plans before hand, though.
The extra (happy ?) resources are a nice touch.

Settling : with deer in the 1st ring speeds up both the initial worker and the travel time to move worker onto the deer. (It should, yes ? Did not do the maths.)
Start looks very strong with only commerce being a potential issue.
Researching Hunt + AH + BW would take very long without any additional commerce source. It's not a problem in itself but it may deny, for example, going down the Mysticism line.

In the late game, with towns everywhere, I can see this map being science heaven! We should easily be able to have lots of cities with 10 or more towns each. But you're right that early commerce is going to be a pain. Basically no cottages until we have both bronze working (to actually clear out some grassland) and pottery. I wonder if a better strategy might be to go Hunting ->AH -> writing, foregoing bronze working at the start for the sake of getting some early libraries and therefore scientists. It would mean slow expansion at first, but with all the forests to chop later and the likelihood of so much land, we'd be able to make up for it soon enough.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

The Indian civilization would prefer to live in peace with all. But your neighbors might not agree. I will be very impressed if anyone can win without ever being at war. In fact I will be impressed by any victories at all.
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/civ4games/images/botm117large.jpg

This bit makes me wonder if we are in for some kind of hidden shock. After all, emperor should be reasonably winnable for quite a few players. Are we going to discover that our nearest neighbours are Monty, Alex and Toku?

 

[Deckhand]

... I will be very impressed if anyone can win without ever being at war. In fact I will be impressed by any victories at all.

This bit makes me wonder if we are in for some kind of hidden shock. After all, emperor should be reasonably winnable for quite a few players. Are we going to discover that our nearest neighbours are Monty, Alex and Toku?

I'm mostly just playing with your heads.
But 25% (5/20) managed to lose my last game (botm114) at Monarch where I tried to help the player. (Although I also helped some of the AIs). This is a level harder.

So, here's my map maker challenge: win without declaring war and without capturing any AI cities.
If that is too hard, you can take the easier challenge where you can capture cities but must return them all to make peace (before the city comes out of revolt).
No razing cities for either.
You can join a war if requested but must still abide by city rule.
I think there are a few of you up to this challenge. And you can do the Space gauntlet with it.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

In the late game, with towns everywhere, I can see this map being science heaven! We should easily be able to have lots of cities with 10 or more towns each. But you're right that early commerce is going to be a pain. Basically no cottages until we have both bronze working (to actually clear out some grassland) and pottery. I wonder if a better strategy might be to go Hunting ->AH -> writing, foregoing bronze working at the start for the sake of getting some early libraries and therefore scientists. It would mean slow expansion at first, but with all the forests to chop later and the likelihood of so much land, we'd be able to make up for it soon enough.

The key to cottages is that they must come early enough. Otherwise, mills/shops should be the better choice.
That implies a fast control over the map and a large workforce.

Skipping Bronze might work very well for expansion purposes (6 yield tiles can do the job) but it does seem, indeed, that BW will be needed early on to allow tile improvements.
Depends on what exploration reveals and what special resources are up for grabs.
Spamming Libraries without BW might be a tall order. 90H.

 

[georgjorge]

Looks like I will be the only one going for Domination/Conquest then this time (I will go for Space in the next BOTM). For obvious reasons I'm going to pass up on the Deckhand challenge as well. It will still be fun!