Overcrowding with the Illians. Help!

[Itherael]

Hi,

Long time player, first time poster.

I have finally had a few decent goes with every race and enjoy them all

Though now I seem to be having a problem with the Illians, they were one of my first played races - I love the idea of agnostic races and like the whole frosty theme.

The first time I played this team I had no problems whatsoever but this time around I seem to be suffering constant overcrowding in all my cities which is dragging production and research to a standstill.

The problem stems from not enough food leading to stagnating yet I dont have the patience to manually give every one of my workers orders for farms as everytime I try that as soon as they become autmated again they just run over the farms with cottages etc. On the note of workers I also seem to get them constantly building over the same plot and replacing it over and over. Is this normal?

I can only assume I'm making some large fatal error. Please Help!

 

[Lone Wolf]

I can only assume I'm making some large fatal error.

Automating workers.

The "Automated Workers Leave Old Improvements" option can help you a bit.

 

[Emptiness]

By "overcrowding" do you mean exceeding ? More farms isn't really a solution to that problem; it would probably make it worse, actually, by increasing population further. You would want to seek out additional sources of , by trade or conquest. You will probably also want to research and build Aqueducts and Infirmaries.

If your economy is suffering and your cities are bigger than their limit can support then changing farms to cottages would probably improve your economy even if it meant lower population due to starvation. Unless you are using the Aristocracy civic, of course, in which case switching farms to cottages is a waste.

(And Lone Wolf is right about automated workers.)

 

[WarKirby]

In the city screen, there's an "Avoid Growth" button near the lower right. Click it when you're at your health/happiness limits, and the city won't grow anymore.

Aside from that, when playing as Illians, you don't need farms, ever. You get 2 from snow, which allows you to cottage or mine every tile and not worry about anything.

 

[Deon]

I prefer camps as a food source for illians wherever possible. Also I think that automatic workers is one of the worst things in Civ4, since one of the main points of city planning is a thorough placement of improvements. It's like automating a build queue.

 

[Tasunke]

well, unless you have a couple food resources you need to still work out a farm to mine ratio ... having all ice terrain has its benifits and weaknesses. Weakness being generally less production and commerce, while a slightly more constant source of food.

Honestly tho, I have farms for the sake of security, it makes me feel safe for when I need extra food. Farms are those improvements that you get rid of last once the city is almost completely mature ... cause in most cases it helps me leapfrog from on pop cap to the next as happiness jumps rapidly in mid-game conquest, and/or mid-game trade.

 

[slowcar]

you don't have to build a hand temple, if your surroundings are good as they are: don't.

 

[Tasunke]

Also I think that automatic workers is one of the worst things in Civ4, since one of the main points of city planning is a thorough placement of improvements. It's like automating a build queue.

This just reminds me of my first couple games of Civ III

I would have the build que's automated ... until I needed libraries or factories, at which time I would set every city to build those buildings. Then late game I just had them spam tanks.

I think I used to never attack before tanks ... at least at the very beggining of my experience with civ III

 

[Feyd Rautha]

It's been mentioned, but I always do the following...
Personally, I farm plains, cottage grasslands and floodplains, mine hills, lumbermill forests (I rarely cut), and farm tundra. I will alter this sometimes based on what a city needs (if it is mostly hills and few flatlands, I will farm the flatlands to allow for more hill production, if it is all flatlands I may even throw a workshop or two in it just depends on the situation.
In your options you can set the options to "Workers Leave Forests" and "Workers Leave Old Improvements" so you can automate the majority while keeping a handful for spot improvements (that will not be touched by the automated ones).
Finally, if you are nearing or at the cap you should definitely make use of the "Prohibit Growth" toggle in the bottom right of the city screen. When you are about to get another resource or other item that will increase your numbers on that screen uncheck it and check it after it pops to cap again.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

why do you farm plains? given how powerful agrarianism is, I always use cottages on plains, that way I don't lose the hammer on the tile.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

Yeah... still new and in old habits. I guess what I would do is workshop or cottage depending on the city goal. Granted I could just vitalize it in the late game and farm it again.

 

[Kranden]

Don't use automated workers. They will always build the wrong things that you need. You need to analize your cities and decide which improvements will benefit them the most. Remember unless you're using conquest just having a large city wont cut it. you need a good balance of production to keep your armies moving.

 

[Tasunke]

In MP games, with turn timer, usually its best after your initially growth stages to automate workers for any sattelite cities, that way your focus will stay with your core cities, as well as on the battlefield if need be.

 

[Itherael]

When I first posted in this thread I made an error in thinking my true issue was overcrowding - I seemed to get it into my head that all my cities should be huge and grow forever until reaching some absurd population.

I now know this was not the case but my production was not dropping at all it was simply not growing so as things began to use more everything ground to almost a halt.

I did not have enough in my surrounding tiles, I have now fixed this with workshops.

Originally I did not understand workshops and thought they were one in the same as siege workshops. I now understand this is not the case.

When I first posted this thread it was my first ever post and I was poor at making good research choices as such I often overlooked the construction line as not having enough worth.

I now understand workshops are an essential part of any civ with limited trees and mine options and have adjusted my tactics to suit.

 

[NobbynobLittlun]

Automated workers are fine in my experience. So long as you go into the city government screen and specify "emphasize gold", "emphasize food", or whatever you're after, and of course... check the option that prevents workers from replacing improvements. Workers tend not to do anything stupid then, and the computer often finds ways to min-max improvements vs. specialists that a human would miss.

To the right of the food and production bars at the top of the city government screen are two options you can check, if it matters with your civics: Avoid Unhealthy Population, Avoid Angry Citizens, or something like that. With these checked, the computer will automatically reallocate citizens to tasks that will lower food production and increase other outputs if the city is about to expand beyond its means. That way you leave the tedium to the computer without your populace going out of control.

Just every so often, you scan through your cities looking for (Growth Control). Unlike (Stagnant), this means that your city can grow, but is not because there would be no advantage in doing so.

Also keep in mind that sometimes unhealthy or unhappy citizens just don't matter. I.e., unhealth will stabilize your birthrate for you without negative economic side effects, and if you can make up for that health later your population will be ready to take advantage of it. Similarly, overpopulation generally translates to citizens not producing enough food to get even more overpopulated, again often stabilizing without negative economic side effects. And then of course there's Pillar of Chains and the like.

On the other hand, happy, healthy citizens are ever important in cultural wars or when allied with Good.

Relieving the tedium from managing your empire is essential to an enjoyable mid-to-endgame

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

avoid unhealthy/unhappy are FF/Orbis only, sadly.

 

[Tasunke]

avoid unhappy is one of the best buttons ALIVE!!! its like the only choice for ALL non calabim civs, and even the calabim before governors mansions are built.