RBGC SG3: (almost) ALWAYS WAR!

I'd have to disagree Aviator (don't take this personally though!). If we wish to upgrade our production in the future, the GSX is crucial. We are going to be losing a LOT of population to invasions. The GSX will help with getting revenue from all our new worlds, and any old worlds that have had 5-10 bill stripped from them.

We also may lose Eyes if any AI (including the minors) gets the tech this round to a rushbuy at the start of the next round. Frictionless clothing and the Galactic Exhibition are still available also, both of which could be useful to us in the future. That extra 10% moral boost is going to be VITAL in de-stabilisation prevention. Tri Stronium is already 3/4 built at one of our worlds. We should at least push for that in the next 12 turns (if Zed decides on a mil push, he could possibly cash rush it to help us out). Every military boost is VITAL to our survivability. Especially when Death Knights come around, since they take FOREVER to build.

Another point to consider is that many of our core worlds finished building frigates at the start of January, so the next batch won't be coming off the shelves until halfway through the next turn anyway. The more I think about this, the more I think it would be worthwhile getting sensors and then finishing all the trade goods/wonders we can. Hopefully the reload police pick up the Galactic Exhibition if anything this turn. That's the one trade good/wonder that won't benefit us.

-Smegged
 
@smegged-- Its OK to disagree. What I like about SGs is the fact that you can pick up any point and play it out from there as your play style demands and see if it was a good or bad call, or a better or worse ending as it were.

What you say may have merit, not saying it doesn't, its just not the way I would play it. (opinion) Monkey boy looks like easy meat and I fancy the feel of broken bodies under the feet of my stormtroopers......

(gosh did I say that) :rolleyes:
 
Even with the 4x limit on income from taxes, we are likely to be in the population growth trade for a while before we get to interstellar capitalism. I suspect we will push to capital ships first, too. That means there is a significant period where the GalStockEx will give us a boost (as well as denying the boost to our enemies). I also think eyes will be huge boon--we want to have sensor coverage that is greater than enemy movement, so we are avoiding out-of-the-fog attacks.

As far as heated debate and disagreements go--folks on this team have been involved in at least one or two SGs, so we should all be used to debates on our course of action.
 
Humourously enough, this little debate can be related quite easily to modern politics. Do we focus internally on improving our own economy, or do we have an external focus and try to improve our economy due to external means. External means in this case being at the pointy end of a phase pistol.
 
Votes on priorities for the coming year:
- Infrastructure: Smegged, Isit, Bam-Bam
- Military: Aviator suggests Drenin.
- No comment: Aaberg

How about some of each? :) Though, if I'm going on offense, I don't want to attack the Drengin just now; that would leave us with some awkward to defend borders. Snagging the bottom side of the map sounds like a much better deal. We'll see what I can put together. Initial screen says that we are the most powerful, which is nice to hear. However, it also says we are doing 3 percent of the trade in the galaxy! :confused: Say what? It appears Scotty can send us trade, even though we are not in the UP, as we have one route from them. I also note they have Interstellar Business, which would give us the ability to build Ultra Spices.

Drengin want peace. DENIED!

Jan 2186: I plop down some waypoints on resources so we will know where they are later if some other races plant bases on them. This is the tiny down arrow button on the upper right hand side of the screen for anyone who doesn't know. What are all our corvettes doing at home?? Shouldn't they be out looking for raiding opportunities now that we have a number of frigates for local defense & offensive prosecution?

The plan: Send the corvettes out to do their jobs and harass the enemy rather than sit at home. We have a significant Frigate force for home defense and are building more. Swap several frigates over to transport production. The plan is to get as much stuff done within a 2-month window as possible and then switch off military to research for sensors followed by social for building Eyes, Tri-stromtium, and Stock Exchange. I should be able to build 5 transports in that time without straining too much, which is not as many as I'd like but will have to do for now. We have a speed advantage; if we blitz quickly we should be able to put a significant hurt on the Arceans in exchange for little retaliation.

IT: We meet the Yor, who have freighters flying around near our corvettes. One of our corvettes gets ambushed by an enemy starfighter and damaged, but not killed. Heads back to base for repairs. This is why we need Eyes...

Feb 2186: Declare war on the Yor by way of destroying a freighter. Destroy two Altarian transports. IT: Scotty builds Tri-Strontium; at least we can buy it from him.

Mar 2186: Drop spending and switch funding to research. I may get a couple of cheap wonder techs, we will see how long they take to research. I'm not interested in spending a long time, but Nanobots for Harmony Crystals and +10 soldiering would be nice. Advanced Repair would be good too but it would probably take longer than I want to spend. Not much killing this round, but I spot a couple of juicy targets. IT: We spot a Carinoid freighter and make contact!

Apr 2186: Trading opportunities exist with the Carinoids as we have several techs they lack. We are able to pick up Warp Drive (more speed, Cap'n!), Interstellar Business, and Energy Focusing for five obsolete techs. We trade Scotty Energy Focusing and Gravity Accelerators for Tri-Strontium Steel (stronger hulls, Cap'n!) Things are looking good militarily speaking, the other AIs are well behind the power curve. We are paying quite a bit for fleet maintenance so it's a good thing I'm planning to do something with it. We take out a Drengin transport with a corvette, but it might be in a bit of trouble as there are Drengin ships closing in. Another corvette destroys an Altarian constructor. A frigate in Altarian space destroys a couple freighters. IT: Our corvette staves off a Star Fighter but now needs repairs, so will head for home, destroying a freighter on the way.

May 2186: We now have completed Sensors and Nanobots, time to switch to social. We start Eyes at Xasica but we are in dire need of funding right now as I can barely manage 40% spending. I start Multimedia Centers everywhere to try and get our morale up a bit so we can hold more pop; we're nowhere close to 4xPQ income levels yet. Xasica starts Eyes instead. I kill another Torian freighter and a Star Fighter with a different corvette but I suspect it is going to get dogpiled on. IT: We're in luck, our corvette only gets attacked by one enemy ship, defeating it. It will return to base for repairs.

June-Jul 2186: Destroying more enemy ships... IT: Torians want a peace treaty. DENIED!

Aug 2186: Wounded frigate destroys an Arcean Battle Axe after having killed off a number of smaller ships. It's approaching 1/2 hp so I will send it home. Altarian Battle Cruiser comes out of hiding (biggest ship I've seen yet) so I whack it with the Frigate wandering through their territory. That ship's getting a bit damaged too so I send it homeward. A stack of 4 transports and 4 frigates has formed near Xasica. That should be enough to take a couple Arcean core worlds. I already have another transport and frigate on the way to the colony south of our core.

Sep 2186: While killing a fully loaded Arcean transport near their colony south of our core, which should make taking that world relatively easy, spot a Alexian freighter. Bag another Yor constructor with a corvette. IT: We make contact with Alex. Torians want another peace treaty. Are you DEAF? REJECTED!

Oct 2186: Alex is on a lone star system in the bottom left corner of the galaxy, what a lovely start. :) As befits his starting location, he is utterly useless.

Nov 2186: Things don't look good for the attack on the colony south of our core. I underestimated how large the colony would have grown by now; it turns out the planet is a PQ32 and has grown a huge population! The good news was our single transport of 1 Billion killed 9.5 Billion of the enemy; the bad news was the planet had 11.8 Billion on it. We will have to be more judicious with our main invasion fleet. IT: Scotty builds Frictionless Clothing -- another good we can buy.

Dec 2186: I pump up spending for one turn so we can complete Eyes before the save/reload penalty has a chance to bite us on it. This will put us about 300 in the red but that can be fixed on the next player's turn. While killing a couple of Arcean Battle Axes (we now have a significantly damaged frigate in Arcean space) I spot a couple of their core worlds and notice they have much less population; I see two with about 1.5 Billion and one with about 5.5 Billion, all of which should fall pretty easily to a single transport apiece. We spot an I-league transport. IT: We make contact with the I-league.

End-of-turn cleanup & diplomacy: Eyes of the Universe comes in, and wow can we see a long ways now. :) This should make our raiders' jobs much easier. Set spending back down to 40%. I-League have built Ultra Spices but are missing several techs. I trade them 4 obsolete techs for the spices. Get Zero-G Manufacturing from Carinoids for Zero-G Research. Can't get Frictionless Clothing from Scotty yet, though. A couple of planets complete builds and are started on Galactic Stock Exchange and Harmony Crystals, but these will take a while; feel free to veto.

Note to next player: Don't trade away Nanobots. Otherwise, have fun invading Arcean space. Resistance has been spotty and light. Our damaged Corvettes have been using Weber as their repair base, while Xasica and Sol are our repair bases for frigates.

Note to the team: This looks like it is going to be pretty much a cakewalk from here on out. Though our economy could be in better shape, the AI is busy killing itself by sending its population out on unprotected transports to get shot down -- that is, in Civ3 terms, they are self-pillaging as they go along. As a result I don't anticipate the AI's economic progress will be much faster than ours.


Here is the save:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/rbgc4-2187ad.zip
 
I'm sorry i haven't been able to participate in the debate (work has been keeping me busy, busy, busy :( )

I wouldn't have had much to say that hasen't already been said, but...
I do agree that we should try to take out Arceans, as it has been said that would our homeworlds easier to defend and they are also the ones with the largest number of planets, so eventually they will grow strong if we don't take them out.

Nice progress btw :goodjob:
 
Another note: we might want to consider diverting one of the transports heading to the Arcean core back toward the PQ32 world. That puppy sure would be nice to have, and we don't want to let it build up a big pop again before we send the next transport. Either way, we should try to put some priority on taking it.

EDIT: We do NOT need more frigates right now, we are having troubles with unit maintenance costs as is. And no excuses needed if RL is keeping you busy, Aaberg; we've all been there! :)
 
Nice work, Zed. We look to be in great shape here. I think the ability to trade with the minors makes this game a whole lot different than the one Smegged played. The bonus picks for sensors also makes a world of difference.

Good luck to Aviator the bloodthirsty.
 
start
start
Well done to the previous leader. (I did say invading an 11B planet would be interesting).
no way monkey boy
trades:
Trade Cari Nano freq elec and basic repair for Hi density metals.
I notice that although Scotty won’t part with his wonder I could make him attack the Yor, interesting..

Q1
Ships killed:
Alt : Freighter (2), freighter, B.cruiser, corvette, transport NOTE they have Frigates
Dren: transport, constructor
Arc : Freighter, freighter(2)
Invade Ditla
Invade Ditla
Invade Severus

Q2
Invade Ancros
Invade Ancros
Invade Nestor
Invade Nestor

Ships killed:
Alt: Transport (3), Freighter(2), corvette, defender, Colony ship, sensor drone, B.axe
Yor: Constructor(2)
Dren: corvette(2),constructor(3),freighter(2), corvette
Arc: constructor, transport(2), corvette
Tor: Starfighter
Council Election (I want the pacifists against that wall now)
Alt builds a starbase resuply
ET begs
Half year report

Q3
Ships killed:
Alt: Constructor, freighter(3), corvette
Dren: Corvette, transport(2),constructor, freighter(2)
Arc: freighter, constructor
Yor: corvette,constructor,freighter
ET wimps out.

Q4
Alt builds Galactic Stock exchange
And come begging
Invade Hoth
Invade Hoth

Ships killed:
Alt: Constructor, freighter(3), corvette
Dren: Corvette, B.cruiser(2),B.axe,freighter(2),constructor
Yor:freighter, corvette,

Total lost: None

Situation:
Scotty has Battleship technology.

Invasion fleet for the first 5 drengin worlds on its way, Sauron can be taken this month.

Invasion of the last Arc worlds is going to be a bit patchy, you can do Devra in a couple of months and Hyadea in about 3 but use the transport in flight to pick up the malcontents in Hoth and use them for the invasion, there is only 1 transport heading towards the old ET worlds which should be enough to take out the big planet but you are going to have to scrabble about to get a final transport. Arc has built only 1 ship in the last 6 months.

Invasion Fleet for Sander is about 2 months away.



The Game

Aviator
 
Originally posted by Zed-F
Another note: we might want to consider diverting one of the transports heading to the Arcean core back toward the PQ32 world. That puppy sure would be nice to have, and we don't want to let it build up a big pop again before we send the next transport. Either way, we should try to put some priority on taking it.

I didn't do that, but the 1.5 B on its way should do it this turn.

Originally posted by Zed-F

EDIT: We do NOT need more frigates right now, we are having troubles with unit maintenance costs as is. And no excuses needed if RL is keeping you busy, Aaberg; we've all been there! :)

I realised that and turned most planets over to Transports, there were a few that had frigates beyond transport size so I let them finish as frigates. I think it was about 19 or 20 Transports I built which was keeping populations down so that morale wasn't a big deal, except where we invaded a planet and had several 100 on a size 16 and they went red face. You just cannot have too many transports. ;)

Isit should be able to eliminate the Drengin and hurt the Altarians but may not be able to scrabble a last transport to finish Arceans, (have some good fun my friend) before the enemy starts to produce frigates in any quantity. With luck we may be able to finish it before the majors can actually build a capital ship.

The only tech I researched was Hyper and the extra speed+1 will click in next turn.


Aviator
 
I'm gonna stick my neck out and say that the game could be closed off in the next 2 or 3 turns, and won't come back to me. Looking at what needs to be done I would think that with a bit of luck (and speed) then it is possible to take out, or force surrender, on Dren/Alt/Arc with what is on the board, but I would expect to lose some frigates doing it.

I would be relaxed about the majors getting BS's because I don't think they have the resources to finish any, not quickly anyway, and we may well capture the technology and maybe a ship on the stocks. We won't have enough transports to take out the Yor, but to do that we probably need to build a few CTs after we have rolled up through the Dren and Alt.

Anyone want to open a book on the date of the finish? :scan:

@Isit-- So kind of you to say so. :love:

Aviator
 
I would not be surprised if this finishes soon. We have a big advantage in that our troops are pretty good and, importantly, we know how to escort them properly, unlike the braindead AI. :) We also have a substantial advantage in ship capability, especially as our frigates gain experience mopping up the AI small fry. I would not be surprised that even if the AIs do manage to somehow put out a couple capital ships, we could take them out with our frigates with minimal losses. The AI's just don't have enough economy to do more than that, with us crippling their trade and them self-pillaging their own worlds.

Next challenge: Maso always war! :) Or maybe always war even against minors...
 
The Drengin sue for peace. Silly monkey boys.

We have enough ships and transports to take a major chunk of out of most of the major races. I am going to focus to grabbing as many planets as I can and starting research on battleship tech. Because of the sheer amount to ship movement I will only mention the highlights in this report.

Spending is at 35% and I will leave it there until we are in the black. We might want to rush something at some point.


Jan

We take Sauron from the Drengin.

We shoot up a few transports and couple of freighters.


Feb

We take Sander from the Altarians

We take Hyadea from the Arceans.

We take Devra from the Arceans, a nice PQ 31 planet.

We take Petroni from the Arceans.


March

We take Bevora from the Drengin.

At this point we are starting to run low on transports. I am starting to see battle cruisers and other, tougher, ships so I am going to play things safe and focus on getting battleships rather then press any harder with our current attack.


April

We take Thuban from the Drengin.


May

Nothing much. Just a few more ships blown out of space.


June

The Arcean get a brief moment of hope as the Drengin surrender to them! They have more lives then a cat.



We take Arcadius from the Arcean.


July

Take a look at this train! They have been chasing one of our raiding ships for a couple of turns now. Time to lure them into a little trap. Hehe



We take Amcor from the Arceans.


August

One corvette and a frigate took out that whole train. We lost the corvette and the frigate got down to 3 hp.


September

More ships blow up.


October

We get battleship tech. I got to 50-50 military/research. I choose to research advanced repair as our ships are healing too slowly on the front lines.

Our planets are ordered to build a mix of ships including battleships, frigates and transports.


November

We take Gabriel from the Altarians.

Our first new transports come off the line and are ordered north.

We take Sivil from the Altarians.


October

More fighting. I finish off some transports heading to our systems.


December

Our system, Sander, Defects to the I-league. I lower taxes slightly to combat this but several of our systems are still vulnerable. At this point I don’t think it’s a major issue. We have more then enough planets to finish this even if we lose some.

We take Anteras from the Altarians.


January

I cancel all auto move orders. Some transports are finished and launched. We get advanced repair and I shift spending to 100% military.


Notes:

We only have 6 systems left to take to win the game. The fighting is getting fairly heavy as frigates and battle cruisers make it to the front. I have many frigates orbiting planets to repair. Thats why we look so thin on ships. We should only need a few more transports and ships to finish this game.

I might also add that I had a great time playing this turn. It blew up more ships in two months then I normally do in two games! Well done with the setup Aviator! I had everything I needed to bring flaming death to our enemies. :D

The map:


The game:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/RBGC_SG4_2189.zip
 
Yep--looked at the save. This one is in the bag. It's all a matter of how fast we can get transports to that Yor planet in the northeast corner. Great playing folks. Guess we have to think about how to make this more difficult. Perhaps a complete AW game--no trading, and war to be made on the minors?

BTW, we are getting over 200bct in trade income. I am 99% sure taht this is from trade routes that the minors established with our enemies before we made them our worlds.
 
@Isit-- Sure looks like you had fun.:goodjob:

When its over I think I'll play that year myself (just for the hell of it):thumbsup:

Aviator
 
We have 7 trade routes setup from minor races. One is to our starting system and the other 6 are to planets we conquered.
 
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