I just started a game as China. So far I've only built a scout and a warrior and have just been exploring the map. Rome suddenly denounces me, even though I've only talked to them once. I didn't refuse to do anything, make demands, nothing at all, or to any other players for that matter. Does anyone know why rome would do this?
So why does the AI denounce you?
- Thread starter blac
- Start date
Oerdin
Deity
Because the diplomacy AI is broken. End of story.
Game is broken, wait for next patch and cross fingers, play something else in the meanwhile.
metatheory
Chieftain
- Joined
- Oct 13, 2010
- Messages
- 69
Mouse over their diplomacy disposition (Friendly, Neutral, etc) and it should tell you why. Most of the time anyway. At some point even freindly AIs will denounce you simply because you are trying to win the game.
elthrasher
Revcaster
- Joined
- Sep 11, 2009
- Messages
- 712
Early denouncements happen a lot and without apparent cause. The only real balancing factor here is that the AI do it to each other constantly, so the human player isn't being picked on or anything.
It's pretty idiotic. Also note that 5000 years can pass and people will still be mad about it. Gosh, we're still just so angry you moved your scout by our city 5000 years ago!
Maybe some day diplomacy will actually make some kind of sense. I was playing yesterday and I was thinking that I wish the AI were sophisticated enough so that when their stupid culture snakes out and breaks my trade route, everybody could see that was an aggressive act designed to disrupt my commerce.
I'd like to be able to demand those tiles be turned over to me.
If they aren't and I go to war to restore my trade route, the other AI should agree my enemy got what's coming to him. Do they like losing their trade routes?
It's pretty idiotic. Also note that 5000 years can pass and people will still be mad about it. Gosh, we're still just so angry you moved your scout by our city 5000 years ago!
Maybe some day diplomacy will actually make some kind of sense. I was playing yesterday and I was thinking that I wish the AI were sophisticated enough so that when their stupid culture snakes out and breaks my trade route, everybody could see that was an aggressive act designed to disrupt my commerce.
I'd like to be able to demand those tiles be turned over to me.
If they aren't and I go to war to restore my trade route, the other AI should agree my enemy got what's coming to him. Do they like losing their trade routes?
I don't have the full list but some of the things the AI doesn't like:
1. You built a wonder the AI wanted to build.
2. You built too many cities.
3. You bought too many tiles.
4. Your culture expanded too fast.
5. You made friends with the same city state the AI wanted to make friends with.
6. Your territory is too close to that AI's territory.
Highlight over the "Friendly"/"Neutral" reason and you may find out a reason.
But in any case, even if they are showing Friendly; they really aren't (this is pretend friendly) so if they've denounced you; a lunary for a lunary deal is okay, and so are deals in which they pay for all of it at the beginning and you give your part over 30 turns; but don't sign any trade agreements or deals involving you paying lump sum to them.
1. You built a wonder the AI wanted to build.
2. You built too many cities.
3. You bought too many tiles.
4. Your culture expanded too fast.
5. You made friends with the same city state the AI wanted to make friends with.
6. Your territory is too close to that AI's territory.
Highlight over the "Friendly"/"Neutral" reason and you may find out a reason.
But in any case, even if they are showing Friendly; they really aren't (this is pretend friendly) so if they've denounced you; a lunary for a lunary deal is okay, and so are deals in which they pay for all of it at the beginning and you give your part over 30 turns; but don't sign any trade agreements or deals involving you paying lump sum to them.
If you are a friend they will denounce you if you don't honour the friendship. You might get a couple of strikes before you're out. They'll get annoyed by you settling close, armies on their borders, not giving tributes, not giving help, interfering with their city state, etc. In fact friendship seems like an opportunity for them to hold your diplomacy to ransom, since they have no concept turning a blind eye for the sake of friendship. It might end the friendship, it might not, the AI seem to have their own rules here since players cannot cancel friendships.
Otherwise whey will denounce you if plenty of others have denounced you and they just want to join the club. They might denounce you if you're too weak or strong, too aggressive, a neighbour, or doing anything they might not like (see the list above). It's all just a numbers game, who gets the most pluses and minuses on their diplomacy by who denounces who. To summarize.
Otherwise whey will denounce you if plenty of others have denounced you and they just want to join the club. They might denounce you if you're too weak or strong, too aggressive, a neighbour, or doing anything they might not like (see the list above). It's all just a numbers game, who gets the most pluses and minuses on their diplomacy by who denounces who. To summarize.
SpearMan153
Prince
also they don't like it when you:
kill a city state
wipe out another civ
aggresively increase the size of your army
denounce their friends
how much they don't like your various misdemeanors depends on their flavor settings, there's a tread on it in the strategy section called diplomacy by numbers.
and sometimes they just don't like the look of you (random roll on first meeting)
kill a city state
wipe out another civ
aggresively increase the size of your army
denounce their friends
how much they don't like your various misdemeanors depends on their flavor settings, there's a tread on it in the strategy section called diplomacy by numbers.
and sometimes they just don't like the look of you (random roll on first meeting)
LegionSteve
Motörhead
Last night I started a new game, large pangaea with all 22 civs, emperor.
Met Germany on turn 3. Turn 4, he calls to tell me my military is pathetic (duh) He is now Hostile.
Few turns later, met Spain. Next turn, yep, she calls to say my economy is pathetic. Hostile.
Turn 15, an unknown civ has denounced an unknown civ. From this point on there are denouncements flying around every turn (but not against me, strangely).
Turn 31 Spain declares "war" though nothing happens at first. After a couple of turns a warrior+settler enter my territory. The warrior retreats after being bombarded, the settler continues until it gets captured. The "war" goes on for about 20 turns, at one point a swordsman and a couple of archers approach one of my cities and are easily killed.
Spain asks for a straight peace deal, no demands. I am not ready to expand yet (need to put some more happiness buildings up) so I agree. Next turn she calls to complain about me settling near her. The city in question was settled on the 2nd turn of the war. But despite this complaint, and the war, she is now Friendly.
The weird thing is on about turn 120, the denouncements are still flying around like crazy but no-one has denounced me yet. Not even Spain.
Zombiebirdhouse
Chieftain
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2011
- Messages
- 11
I've noticed that if a civ is friendly toward me and suddenly denounces me, their attitude will remain friendly for a couple of turns. As soon as I'm denounced, I check to see if there is anything that I can trade with them since they won't be friendly for long and at least I've locked in a trade for 30 turns.
In my latest game, France was friendly and suddenly denounced me. I immediately went to the diplomacy screen and hovered over their attitude (which as usual remained friendly) and the only negative was that they had denounced me. WTF? The denouncement has no effect on my relationships with other friendly civs.
I think it would be helpful if the world politics info screen would tell you who had denounced who and who is currently at war with who.
In my latest game, France was friendly and suddenly denounced me. I immediately went to the diplomacy screen and hovered over their attitude (which as usual remained friendly) and the only negative was that they had denounced me. WTF? The denouncement has no effect on my relationships with other friendly civs.
I think it would be helpful if the world politics info screen would tell you who had denounced who and who is currently at war with who.
CivMcNut
Having Fun At It
This denouncement thing puzzles me too. I can accept a Civ that is already hostile to me denouncing me, but when the friendly ones do, it really changes your gameplay. You can be really relying on someone and all of a sudden they give you that denouncement. Then usually 2 or 3 turns later their opinion of you plummets and never comes back. It's just about like having war declared on you. You can kiss goodbye any fair trades with that Civ again. Like the Open Poster said, it doesn't take much to set them off.
The AI denounces because that's the driving factor behind global hostilities.
In CIV, this same function was served primarily by religion.
You decide which is the better feature. I find it to be religion by far, even if religion itself was a little wonky and could use some upgrades.
In CIV, this same function was served primarily by religion.
You decide which is the better feature. I find it to be religion by far, even if religion itself was a little wonky and could use some upgrades.
Teperi Blaze
Warlord
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2010
- Messages
- 225
I met Rome on turn 9, he was friendly and smiling. On turn 11 he taunts me and on turn 12 he denouces me. OK??? No, I will have to kill you now.
Ottomans, my best friends loves me. Until they see I did mean what I said when I was going to kill Rome. They go guarded and soon denouces me, after all those years of friendly trading, they hates me for killing their enemy. OK??? I have to kill you too now.
Arabs are guarded as they've been all game and are now trying to grab old roman space, my settler there plops down a city right in their wake and destroys their future infrastructure. Ha! He denouces me next turn. OK?? No, there is noone left on this continent that will listen and you will die too.
At least this gives me a reason to step out of my builder-habits.
Ottomans, my best friends loves me. Until they see I did mean what I said when I was going to kill Rome. They go guarded and soon denouces me, after all those years of friendly trading, they hates me for killing their enemy. OK??? I have to kill you too now.
Arabs are guarded as they've been all game and are now trying to grab old roman space, my settler there plops down a city right in their wake and destroys their future infrastructure. Ha! He denouces me next turn. OK?? No, there is noone left on this continent that will listen and you will die too.
At least this gives me a reason to step out of my builder-habits.
If they have units close to your borders, or, units near their units, they will start complaining about you amassing troops on their borders.
But I managed to keep good relations with all civs even though I captured 3 best cities of Egypt. I think it's not as broken as people tell it is though.
But I managed to keep good relations with all civs even though I captured 3 best cities of Egypt. I think it's not as broken as people tell it is though.
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