Stitched up?

[RaidandTrade]

Started a new game on Deity last night. I settled in place and started exploring.

Met the Aztec and Assyrian scouts fairly early.

Turn FIFTEEN (yep, 15) the following happens:
1. Lose my starting warrior to barbs
2. Get DOWed by the Aztecs
3. Get DOWed by Assyria

Turn 17 and two armies appear out of the fog...

Never been stitched up like that before!!!


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[joncnunn]

#1 lead directly to #2 & #3 (you had a very weak military following having your starting warrior killed)

 

[HughFran]

Agree with joncnunn! Basically, if I am starting on Diety and end up beside two Civs that are in very close proximity, I sacrafice other production and try to build/buy enough units to defend myself. This is usually a mixture of ranged and a few melee to soak up the assault which will inevitably happen!! I will even sacrafice the Liberty tree temporarily and try to get some Honor policies (Great General will be handy). Then I will sit back and watch wave after wave of enemy units break upon my defence while my units gain some nice veteran bonuses. This also means you will not be seen as a warmonger because you did not DOW and you can use your promoted units to attack a now weakened enemy.

This doesn't always work mind you (Diety is a son of a ) but once I see an AI starting very close to me, my plans are always to set up a good defence!!

 

[beetle]

OP, if you have the initial game save, please share! It sounds too dire for me, but I think the challenging neighbors might appeal to more than a few folks on the board.

 

[joncnunn]

OP, if you have the initial game save, please share! It sounds too dire for me, but I think the challenging neighbors might appeal to more than a few folks on the board.

The only downside is that with this knowledge, none of them are going to move their starting warrior more than a few hexes away from their capital. (They'll all use much more expendable scouts for exploring, and may even forgo that in favor of more military units to keep at home given the known neighbors)

 

[BruinBound]

The only downside is that with this knowledge, none of them are going to move their starting warrior more than a few hexes away from their capital. (They'll all use much more expendable scouts for exploring, and may even forgo that in favor of more military units to keep at home given the known neighbors)

Nah, there's a chance of dying to barbs any game. It's extremely rare, OP was either very unlucky or took a bad risk (or both). I can't imagine not using my starting warrior to scout just because I heard the barbs were a bit of a rough crowd in this one.

 

[Sclb]

Even if you build units, you'll not be able to build enough to fend off such an early rush by 2 ai. You'll have to avoid the DoW completely.
Another variant of this is a turn 70 AI carpet which is quite hard to defend unless you're also already started training CB.
I tend to see this when playing wide liberty which tends to trigger planting cities too aggressively and AI covets my land. There is no way around it other than to bribe them since planting that many cities means I don't have the hammers for lots of archer->CB

 

[HughFran]

Even if you build units, you'll not be able to build enough to fend off such an early rush by 2 ai.

I disagree, I've had two AIs DoW me plenty of times on high level games but they key is to be well prepared. The minute I realise I am right next to potentially aggressive AIs, I forgo my planned research and instead research better military units. As long as you don't go too wide with your cities and stay conservative, defending yourself is very achievable. Like I said above, with the right mix of units and enough of them so that you can afford to pull them off the front line to heal (and buld experience), you can defend against higher number of units in the AI's army. Granted, it is very tough but very achievable. In fact, in a masochistic way I quite enjoy being planted next to agressive AIs as you can get away with being aggressive early game without being accused of being a warmonger!!

 

[RaidandTrade]

Hey Guys - No original save - sorry! And, yes, stupid risk with the warrior. Had taken a camp and marched carelessly into a new camp - still scouting instead of returning to heal.

Learned my lesson!


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[Sclb]

I disagree, I've had two AIs DoW me plenty of times on high level games but they key is to be well prepared

Yes, but defending 2x turn 15 DoW on deity? You probably cant even get much more than an archer out. In fact I've had games where the AI do not sign peace after a worker steal and they come back with a real army and lost a city because of that. So now I carefully pick which ai civ to steal workers from.

 

[Redaxe]

That's surprising. I've never actually been DoWed so early before. I've been denounced by Shaka around turn 12 though (just after he met me!)

Is losing your starting warrior really that influential on the AI diplomacy?

 

[sixty4half]

Having 0 pointy sticks is.

 

[reddishrecue]

A few archers and spearmen could be a good defense, backed up with oligarchy from tradition? Eventually ending up to monarchy which will help upkeep the beginning costs of the spears and archers that are defending your capital.

If liberty, it could be a bit more difficult since the lack of oligarchy won't make that much damage to units soon enough so defending a rush could be difficult particularly with liberty. Fast walls from building bonus social policy in liberty could be helpful.