STR-06: 3CTCC goes Monarch

[Strauss]

I messed up the dates, so blid was actually still within his 24 hours. Sorry about that. Going to bed now, will read tomorrow.

 

[GreyFox]

And according to some: "Napolean very rarely build wonders, preferring to build military and gold?" .... pbfftttt!

I think our wonder building period is over, and it is high time to concentrate on military.

I think, even if others are not in Merc, we should do that nonetheless. We don't a lot of overseas trade with only 1 coastal city if I recall correctly.

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[Pvblivs]

There's a simple rule with wonders in civ. When the wonder is important and you have the chance to speed it up - speed it up! Because in the end you could loose by one turn and notice you could have done simple things to speed it up.

Whipping is a no brainer - chopping is not, because chopping usually is a one-timer and you're likely to miss those forrests later. If you even decided to chop forrests I don't understand why you didn't whip it. Even because we did not switch to Caste yet.

Otherwise a very interesting set of turns with good trades! The Taj would have been your mountain top to reach. Poor us

For switching civics I'd highly suggest that you guys pop a Prophet next ;-) I don't want 2 (or 3) turns of revolt when we can have the first of the two last switches we may need for free. Just to say this again and again.

I'd support the thesis that we need some defense military now. But we will have to decide what to plan on. I think against a serious "mighty one attacks us weak ones" we can hardly plan, because than we would be building military all the time.
It would be a better plan to do two other things: Befriend the mightiest or the two next mightiest and don't be the last in the power graph. This one is likely to fall before Napoleon, I fear.

On culture: Did you already calculate what we still need? I think we will build culture while we can. I doubt we're ready yet. Hardly any further religion will spread to our cities. So there will be hardly any additional multipliers than one cathedral and one radio tower per city (and the Hermitage). Is that enough? Build more wonders

 

[pholkhero]

getting a CTD once i press enter ~ trying to sort it out ~

edit: no more CTD, but i've got no interface! tried out the space mod last night, and i started w/no interface either. going to try reinstalling later today when i have the time. (and yes, I tried alt-I and ctl-I!)

 

[GreyFox]

Nobody would whip a wonder ... it's the most inefficient thing to do. You would instead whip something else, and let the hammer overflow to a wonder. But I think it could happen to anyone. How many times do people rush a wonder wen it is only 2~3 turns away? It's just pure bad luck, no need to get too work up.

I still think we need to concentrate on troops in the near term. All the wonders in the world won't help when Nappy declare on us.

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[GreyFox]

Let review the situation.

Athens: 228cpt @ 12729
Sparta: 256cpt @ 17276
Corinth: 227.50cpt @ 10471.5

Strangely, we started Hermitage at the culturally poorest city of Corinth Shouldn't we built it at the best city??? Hmmm ... in this case, I suggest building 2 cathedrals at Sparta, and one in Athens. Corinth should overtake Athens, so probably we would use some artists for late bomb in Athens.

We still have one more religion to spread to one city, do that and build a monastery (+2 base culture) ASAP before SciMeth is in.

Our power graph doesn't looks pretty.

@Pholky: I have no problem with the save.

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[pholkhero]

it's not the save ~ something's up w/my Civ. as i said, i tried playing the Space mod last night after my other post at the other forum, and had no interface in-game. then, when i tried to play the save then, STILL no interface.

Okay, i thought, i'll just let the computer relax overnight, and start fresh in the morning. But come this morning, first ws the CtD, and now, i've STILL got no interface.

Well, now i do, in a way. I have reinstalled vanilla, and it works fine. Am going to try BtS next and see where that gets me.

i'm going to try to keep editing my posts, rather than post new replies so peeps don't keep clicking the thread expecting new turns

edit: intalled BtS and the bug is back, so i'm not sure what to do @ this point. I'm going to post in the bug forum and see if i can figure something out. if something was wrong w/that Space mod, could it've transferred to the normal game??

edit: a kind soul in the Bug Reports forum is trying to help me out, so . . . i discovered that there's a ton of Python errors upon loading up the game!

FINAL EDIT: fixed! won't be able to play now until tomorrow, but will be playing. Look for a post in about 18 hours or so ~

before my game the first time, i had enough time to look @ Athens briefly ~ we're out of culture bldgs there and so will focus on some military there first

 

[Pvblivs]

edit: a kind soul in the Bug Reports forum is trying to help me out, so . . . i discovered that there's a ton of Python errors upon loading up the game!

Sounds like !!! I modded my game away

And yes, military should be No 1 priority now. After this monastery thing. We still need like more than 200 turns to achieve legendary with the first city. Maybe wonders are really useless (as they're expensive to build). Employing 2 artists after building some power graph upgrades seems to be much more effective than building a 8cpt building for 20 turns and not having artists.

 

[pholkhero]

Athens finished its Galleon, and went w/a Knight to increase our power. Sparta went w/a Longbow after it finished its . . . er . . . last build

Also, MM wanted world maps, so I took that. He also came by a turn or two later wanted Liberalism + 385g for Economics. I took that as well, figuring we could use the banks and didn’t have Econ on our tech horizon at all.

We met Justinian who is friendly w/Napoleon and Willem van Orange so I took OB with him, gifted him 30g for the +4 boost, and traded his Cow and Fur for one of our Horsies. Unfortunately, he is at war w/Hannibal, who I also met later on. I tried to gift him some cash, but we're still at Cautious with him. He took Constantinople and Adrianople this set, and I fear for a DOW from him later on down the line. In other war news, Willem made peace with HC.

Corinth finished its Hermitage, and I have it start on an Islamic temple. I also noticed that it doesn’t have Taoism yet, and Sparta doesn’t have Islam so I queue up 2 missionaries in Athens, as well.

We also got a GE as our next GP, so I left him in Athens for now, so we can decide how we want to use him. My guess is maybe on the Statue of Liberty??

I also used that Galleon and our Malinese warrior to go exploring and found a goody hut on a barb island ~ I was hoping for a tech, but got another warrior

Sparta finished its Longbow (our first Archer unit!) and I have it going on wealth until it gets its last religion in a turn or two.

Corinth finished its Islamic temple, and I started it on a Taoist one, and also started Sparta on the Islamic one there.

Oh, and I also stopped Scientific Method with 1 turn to go ~ I wasn’t sure if it obsoleted the culture aspect of the monasteries. I’m don’t think that it does, but just to be sure. I started on Constitution, and we’ve got about 6 turns left on that. I also made some resource trades to our neighbors, mostly for heath and happy resources, but I traded away our 2nd extra Horse ~ the next player may want to cancel them when possible (which reminds me I was supposed to cancel a trade I think!).

And that was the 15 ~ it actually took a bit of time because I had about 4 units to move around ~ phew!! I didn’t revolt yet since we got the GE and didn’t trigger a Golden Age ~ wasn’t sure if the swaps were worth it just yet w/o a GA. Athens can still build units, while Sparta and Corinth finish up their last couple religious buildings.

and sorry about the lack of screenies, but there's only so many pics of the trade screen I can take

 

[GreyFox]

You cheating rotten Pholk-coward -- you used an exploit in this game???

SciMeth wouldn't obsolete culture IIRC, and we need it sooner rather than later to head towards radio. So as soon as the monasteries are built, we should complete SciMeth and go on with Physics.

Got it for tonight or tomorrow morning.

 

[pholkhero]

You cheating rotten Pholk-coward -- you used an exploit in this game???

is that really an exploit?

edit: even if so, to me, it makes good "realistic" sense; a gift of gold upon first meeting a foreign leader is bound to start things off on the right foot.

 

[ungy]

A couple of things: we have a 10XP chariot that has not been promoted. It should be and then we can build the HE in Athens.

I think we should take Free religion after the next GP if not immediately.

As for the engineer, we are doing surprisingly well in tech and have excellent chances at Broadway etc later on. They are really very useful and the Statue of Liberty is a lot of turns even with the engineer. My guess is we're better off skipping the Statue since we really should be building units in Athens with the Herioc Epic and not wonders.

We will win this game I'm pretty sure if we don't have an unplanned war. I would play it safe and tech towards rifling--I think we'll get at least one late wonder if we save the engineer and maybe 2.

 

[Pvblivs]

Whar do we need 2 wonders for? The later you build wonders the later they pay off. Paying off means that they have to give the same amount of culture in the end if you'd had no production but invested everything in artist specialists. A wonder would only be reasonable with an Engineer because then it's almost for free (if not too expensive).

That is, if we get another GE then I'd support a second wonder

 

[ungy]

Whar do we need 2 wonders for? The later you build wonders the later they pay off. Paying off means that they have to give the same amount of culture in the end if you'd had no production but invested everything in artist specialists. A wonder would only be reasonable with an Engineer because then it's almost for free (if not too expensive).

That is, if we get another GE then I'd support a second wonder

This makes sense. We can get to electricity in about 60 turns on a beeline--maybe 100 or so if we detour for rifling (my choice), and my guess is we're something around 200-250 to win. So getting the first wonder is pretty big, and you're right about the second.

Constitution is not too useful for us but most likely we can trade it to Mansa for gunpowder.

Remember that the BTS phalanx has been changed--it is only an axeman now and should not be built.

As for defending, I'd put our units in Athens. I don't think I've ever seen an AI just land on culture--always next to a city.

 

[GreyFox]

Inherited Turns: change some trades. Canceled a tribute to Nappy. Swap all artists in Sparta to priest. If we want a golden age, better get a prophet.

Unfortunately:

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I've decided that we have waited long enough ... no big deal if w edon't have a golden age. It's just 3 turns of revolt.

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I've wondered if artist should be settled. If settled, it will give 28cpt. Our slowest city (Athens) has 260 more turns to legendary, so offhand, it would be roughly break even. The beakers and coins benefit made me seriously considered settling, but then I decided to save him for bomb, since the above calculation of breaking even did not take into account cultural bomb or speed up due to 50% cathedrals, wonders and more specialists in the future.


In the other news, Peace returns:

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and Peace broken:

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We got constitution, and instead of from Mansa, I got Gunpowder from Oranje.

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Next player should keep a close eye on tech trading opportunity of constitution.

I was delaying SciMeth further for monasteries, but I think enough delays. We should hurry on towards Electricity/Biology now. So, suggest switching back to SciMeth after Replaceable Parts. Incidentally, that will coincide with a final monastery build (I think).

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Athens is now the weakest city. I still suggest 2 cathedrals in Sparta and one cathedral in Athens.

>>> The Save (1600AD) <<<​

 

[Pvblivs]

"unfortunately" a great artist. Bad for a 3-turn revolt, great for our goal.

What did you do with Michelangelo? If we have only 150 turns left, settling is'nt worth it anymore. If 200 it is. What do you vote for?

 

[GreyFox]

I thought I mentioned in the report. He is now sleeping with the great engineer in Athens (Brokeback Mountain ... ) The GE is ofcourse waiting to rush a wonder, and Michelangelo, is waiting to bomb.

Bombing will give 6000, settling will give 28cpt, slowest city is now 254 turns away from legendary. Strictly speaking, settling now is slightly better, as it will yield ~6200 in 254 turns. But that is simplistic since we haven't actually taken into account future wonders, cathedrals, and the turns taken off due to bombing. That's why I decided to save him for a bomb.

 

[blid]

Sorry I wasn't able to comment, I was on a business trip for 3 days.

Concerning research, I would try to get the physics free scientist first then we can decide if we should research rifling ourselves or if there's a trade available.

Concerning the artist, I agree we should save him. The current estimates would probably go down when we hire more artists and with final bombing. By the way, when deciding for multiplier buildings, we should look at the base culture points not the modified one, because all the multipliers apply to the raw culture.

 

[GreyFox]

Just noticed something ... Cornith is showing 150% multiplier instead of 100% ... did some again sneaked n a cathedral at cornith ?

 

[ungy]

Bombing will give 6000, settling will give 28cpt, slowest city is now 254 turns away from legendary. Strictly speaking, settling now is slightly better, as it will yield ~6200 in 254 turns. But that is simplistic since we haven't actually taken into account future wonders, cathedrals, and the turns taken off due to bombing. That's why I decided to save him for a bomb.

Initially I thought settling better because of the coin and research--multiplier will work for artist as well. But I agree better to bomb--mostly due to time off for future bombing.