Understanding Denounciations

[Emanca]

So, Catherine declared war on me without provocation (as she has on every single game I've played with her as a AI). I attacked her and after killing her invaders, I started to kill off some of her units inside her territory taking advantage of her lack of ships. Then I get denounced by two different civs, to which I have done nothing. What's the deal?

 

[Dushku]

While it might seem like "without provocation" to you, there's a reason, however flimsy or nonsensical. You can hover over her disposition (or leader head with EUI) to see exactly WHY she dislikes you. If all you've done since she declared war on you is kill her units, then the other leaders wouldn't think anything of this. Either they're upset with you for the same reasons Catherine was or you're not disclosing a city capture.

[EDIT]
Sorry for my avatar; had it this way for awhile. Not teasing.

 

[Emanca]

I did start a war with a CS on the first turns to steal some workers, but that's about it. Do wars with CS without allies/friends cause denounciations?

Sorry for my avatar; had it this way for awhile. Not teasing.

Hahahaha I wouldn't have thought it was teasing

 

[Sclb]

Attacking CS with pledge of protections incur diplo penalty. I notice that if an AI covets your land and/or thinks you expands too aggressively, that almost always get followed by DoW unless you bribed them to attack someone else.

 

[Emanca]

I suspect that once you do anything worthy of a denunciation, every single violent action counts towards more denunciations. 150 turns after the aforementioned attack, even though I only fought Catherine's units (she declared war on me), I kept getting denunciations and FOUR civs declared war on me.

 

[beetle]

I suspect that once you do anything worthy of a denunciation, every single violent action counts towards more denunciations.

I have not played vanilla in while, but I really cannot image that is correct.

I attacked her and after killing her invaders, I started to kill off some of her units inside her territory taking advantage of her lack of ships.

Okay, but you took no cities?

I did start a war with a CS on the first turns to steal some workers, but that's about it.

I note that workers is plural. Did you make peace with the CS between worker steals?

 

[Emanca]

Okay, but you took no cities?

I took no cities, i didn't even invade her. I had a small army, compared to other Civs, perhaps the denunciations were excuses to declare war? I've noticed most AIs really take advantage of having more "pointy sticks" than you.

I declared war on the CS only once, and made peace after the first denunciation came (several turns later)

 

[poom3619]

I think... did you ever reject a peace deal that is either white peace (Peace treaty - Peace treaty) or a deal where she gives anything to you?

AI think rejecting such treaty counts as warmongering.

AI offering something for peace, human turn it down. Boo!

 

[Chum]

AI think rejecting such treaty counts as warmongering.

Pretty sure that's not the case.

 

[Sclb]

I think... did you ever reject a peace deal that is either white peace (Peace treaty - Peace treaty) or a deal where she gives anything to you?

AI think rejecting such treaty counts as warmongering.

AI offering something for peace, human turn it down. Boo!

Rejecting any AI deal has no diplo penalty. In fact, I never take white peace when I'm at war since it's much better to milk gold from AI.

 

[Emanca]

Further question about denunciations: Is it possible that signing a treaty with an AI could cause a denunciation from an AI at war with the one I'm signing it?

 

[sixty4half]

No, signing Peace with one AI while at war should not cause another AI to denounce you. Maybe if you made a declaration of friendship the enemy of your new friend might denounce you.

 

[reddishrecue]

Pre war denounciations are most effective. Other civilizations could eventually join your cause.

 

[phillipwyllie]

There's a somewhat rare neutral diplo modifier and that's the one when you first meet a civ. It goes something like "there's been nothing to shape our relationship but they want peaceful relations". I assume there's an opposite one.

I remember a game where I hadn't even met Shaka yet I took a CS's worker. When I eventually did meet him he seemed to have had prior knowledge of my "labour outsourcing program" and almost immediately denounced me. It wasn't a problem as I was Genghis......

 

[Emanca]

No, signing Peace with one AI while at war should not cause another AI to denounce you. Maybe if you made a declaration of friendship the enemy of your new friend might denounce you.

Ah, yes, that might've been what caused it, I think i did sign a declaration with Cesar, which could explain why Alexander, at war with him, denounced me out of nowhere.

 

[mtt9999]

There may be another reason as well, when you get denounced by one AI, other civs evaluate which side they should 'be on'. Even though you may have been on good standing with the other civs, once Catherine denounces you, if they have more positive bias toward her, you may incur a penalty stating something like 'A civ we like more than you denounced you', which usually comes in the bold red, which is a bad negative quantifier. Once this happens, sides have been drawn in the sand, and it is very very hard to regain relations with that side.