*Video* Warlock: Master of Arcane = Fantasy Civ5

[TLF]

One thing I forgot.

There is no building in FW and Elven legacy. Just battles.

That's what I meant when I said "purely turn based tactical war games".

So, not really like AoW.

 

[Heretic_Cata]

Finished my first game - by magic.
What stuff can you find in outer planes ? I cleared one of them and i found some very rare resources. Is that all you can find there ? It was quite hard to explore even one of them !

 

[Zhahz]

Calling Warlock a Civ 5 mod is pretty much ignorant. It's more like MoM than civ. Ultimately it stands alone, IMO, and with the 1st patch the AI is already much stronger - and it's nice to see timely patches, especially ones that deal with AI.

The gods gifts to gaming types that beat diety on dual maps exploiting every known AI flaw in the universe probably won't find a game like Warlock that challenging...but it's fun for us mere mortals.

 

[Ribannah]

I played the demo a couple of times. In 50 turns, it is possible to take out both rivals or explore one of the other plains (you can even settle cities there).

The game is promising but is only half finished, with lots of minor imbalances and annoyances, missing info, lack of diplomacy (the AI will declare on you despite a good relationship and again the turn after you made peace) and a few bugs.

The map feels crowded. They're trying to do HoMM stuff on Civ5-size hexes.

 

[Ribannah]

Finished my first game - by magic.
What stuff can you find in outer planes ? I cleared one of them and i found some very rare resources. Is that all you can find there ? It was quite hard to explore even one of them !

In the demo at least, that's where the Holy Grounds are. But otherwise they're just like the starting plane, except with tougher monsters and better treasure and special tiles.

 

[Heretic_Cata]

In the demo at least, that's where the Holy Grounds are. But otherwise they're just like the starting plane, except with tougher monsters and better treasure and special tiles.

In the full game you can find holy grounds on the starting plane (tho it's rare and heavily guarded).

Anyway what's this missing info that everyone keeps talking about. I had one playthrough and didn't find whatever info i was looking for. (except for the spell tree - which apparently doesn't exist, it's all random)

 

[GrumpyGamerLP]

I like turn-based war games. I am not some grognard who can handle the super deep ones that try to simulate every little detail of warfare though.

I like the fantasy setting in Warlock because it allows you to do things that you couldn't do in a normal "ultra-realistic" war game. For example, I cast haste and levitate on a heavily-buffed mage. He is more or less like a fast-moving floating artillery piece. I can use him to concentrate firepower rapidly on any point on the battlefield.

The summons are cool too. I cast imps behind enemy lines. In other words they are like paratroopers. You can use the serpents like air cavalry. If you give them haste and far sight they are good for recon. They are also great for mopping up units near death.

The versatility the fantasy setting gives this game gives it a lot of longevity IMHO. If you just view this game for what it is, a fantasy war game lite, then you'll love it.

 

[Malachi256]

I like turn-based war games. I am not some grognard who can handle the super deep ones that try to simulate every little detail of warfare though.

I like the fantasy setting in Warlock because it allows you to do things that you couldn't do in a normal "ultra-realistic" war game. For example, I cast haste and levitate on a heavily-buffed mage. He is more or less like a fast-moving floating artillery piece. I can use him to concentrate firepower rapidly on any point on the battlefield.

The summons are cool too. I cast imps behind enemy lines. In other words they are like paratroopers. You can use the serpents like air cavalry. If you give them haste and far sight they are good for recon. They are also great for mopping up units near death.

The versatility the fantasy setting gives this game gives it a lot of longevity IMHO. If you just view this game for what it is, a fantasy war game lite, then you'll love it.

I completely agree with you regarding the fun of fantasy strat games - I feel much the same way. All the different variables make for lots of interesting combinations / strategies.


How is the AI in this game, though? I haven't bought it yet cause I'm largely just waiting to see how people feel after the honeymoon phase. If the AI gets boring fast, then meh, ya know?

 

[GrumpyGamerLP]

Well, there are two types of strategy games, IMHO. Ones with scenarios and ones with randomly generated maps. The ones with scenarios are highly scripted and the AI seems better because the developers know what the maps look like and they can add a lot of conditional logic. For example, "If player attacks city A before turn 9 then do this."

I prefer the randomly generated maps like in this game and the Civ series. The AI isn't as good but it has a lot more replay value and exploration is more fun.

So to answer your question, the AI could be better but they have already improved it a little in the first patch and they are making it even better in the future. I think the AI is already better than civ 5 in the combat department.

I would highly recommend this game. I have been having a lot of fun with it. You can try the demo if you aren't sure. The demo is a fairly accurately depiction of the game.

I didn't like this game at first because I was expecting a fantasy-based Civ 5. I am actually happier with this game than Civ 5 now. Once you figure out how to play the game you begin to appreciate how stream lined it is. It plays really fast for a wargame. For example, when you come up with a strategy in Civ it can take you over an hour to implement it and put it into action/ The turns fly by so fast in Warlock that you can see a plan go into affect in around 15 minutes.

 

[Bandersnatching]

Well, I bought the game after reading about it here and playing the demo, and I can say that it is quite fun. The fact that I stayed up playing it (the demo) for an entire night kind of speaks to its design and enjoyability...
I'm not sure how balanced everything is yet - I got it after the patch, apparently - but the most important thing is that the AI is actually capable of defending its cities and casting magic correctly, which to me is awesome; after all, this is a war game, and so the AI should be good at it. The three factions, with their different units and buildings, as well as customizable Leader traits, add to the replayability and uniqueness of the game, so more points for it there. All told I think that the game is sound, fun, and possesses room for expansion.
If you are thinking about buying it, definitely play the demo first. I don't think that they leave anything out in the demo that is in the real game, so it is a good representation of the gameplay and mechanics.

 

[Wolfbeckett]

Does the AI still waste turn after turn firing death magic at undead that are immune to death magic like it did in the demo? . I haven't gotten the game yet cause $ is a little tight right now but I certainly intend to at some point, it's on the list.

 

[Bandersnatching]

Does the AI still waste turn after turn firing death magic at undead that are immune to death magic like it did in the demo? . I haven't gotten the game yet cause $ is a little tight right now but I certainly intend to at some point, it's on the list.

I've only played through about 5 games, but I've never experienced an AI shooting useless spells at my units. But that is likely because there haven't been enough tests.
Most of the time it summons up ghost wolves, or imps, or enchants its own units with stuff. There was one particularly tough undead guy who had an amazing amount of units on his side of the continent, most of which he enchanted with a powerful elemental protection spell once I started summoning up fire elementals in his base. What he DIDN'T do was cast death spells on my elementals. Truth be told, I have rarely had an AI use damage spells against my units, and have never had an AI debuff my dudes (which ends up being really problematic for them). The lack of debuff use has actually been noted in the forums for the game, so it isn't an isolated case.
I'll go test out what you've said, though, but the developers might've actually fixed this already - they have been unusually fast in creating balance patches and fixing bugs.

 

[GrumpyGamerLP]

I have seen them use some damage spells in at least two games. If you cluster your units up then I've had two AIs in different games cast firestorm which is an AoE spell. The AI wiped out half my army this way.

Furthermore I've seen them cast a LOT of the weakness debuff. In one game I have 5 or 6 units with debuffs on them. They will debuff cities too from what I am told.

The AI will take into account the vulnerabilites of your units too. For example, if you have a unit with a vulnerability to fire then it will try to do fire damage to you first if it can.

Most of the time the AI is smart enough not to suicide units too. For example, if I have a couple of archers parked on a coastline then it won't move it's caravel in range of them. If I move the archers away then it will come closer to shore to get line of sight inland.

 

[Bandersnatching]

Playing the game a bit more, the AI seems to be really fond of summon spells, a few unit enchantments, and as GrumpyGamerLP said, weakness debuffs. In nearly every game one of the AI's casts that Grum-Garog damage/weakness debuff area of effect spell (this would work better for them if they cast it before, not after, they've fought my army). They also rarely use damage spells, but it seems like against the AI more than the human (for no apparent reason...) Incidentally, whenever a spell is cast near a mana vent (at least in my observation), the words 'spell combo' appear and everything around the target gets hit with the same spell. The AI is far more likely to cast a damage spell around a mana vent than anywhere else.
The AI also seems bad at mounting an offensive, but that doesn't surprise me.

 

[GrumpyGamerLP]

Yeah, I forgot, the AI uses a ton of summon spells. The AI likes to build lots of towers and forts too.

 

[jimkirk]

it kinda reminds me of heroes of might n magic 3 .. although the interface is kinda clunky

 

[Malachi256]

So does anyone have any updates on the AI? Has anyone had their butt kicked by the AI yet?

 

[SemperFi2382]

So does anyone have any updates on the AI? Has anyone had their butt kicked by the AI yet?

I have had a few poor starts where the AI had a huge advantage at the start of the game. Some of it are factors like starting placement, terrain, and other world placements. Then the first great wizard I run into tried to demand just about all of my resources.

Of course denial = war, and acceptance = death, so I pretty much tried to fight my way out, but with low level units and no place to expand, I got resource tapped out.

In another game, I have been hammered by AoE spells, and swarmed by units by the first enemy wizard I ran into. I ended up winning in the end, but I definitely worked my rear off. The constant AoE prevented me from killing him for 75% of the game, as every invasion force was getting tore up. I had to wait until other wizards were also at war with him and I picked at his cities for a coup de grace.

Definitely has a leg up over Civ5 AI in some cases. I am not sure if the AI is intentionally random, but it seems you could see a smart AI or dumb AI every new game (per wizard). I have yet to see a game with all one way or another, but I also think that the AI is also heavily influenced by its starting location and resources.

I would say a tougher AI has more favorable resources nearby, with less "barbarian" units/cities spawning close by. While a dumber AI does not know how to effectively deal with a poor start.

Final verdict, the AI can be hit or miss, but considering there have been starts that I have been hard pressed to overcome, I think the AI is acceptable. Leaves room for improvement, but not the worst you could get.

NOTE: This is also before any patches have been released for the game, and the official forums do have interaction with the developers, so it is likely the AI could improve in the near future.

 

[player1 fanatic]

The biggest problem with game AI is that it can't handle late game, when "tier 3" units get available (temple units, upgraded vampires, trolls, etc...). Those troops are just too much for AI's regular carpet of doom, and are usually additionally upgraded with perks/magic, making them unstoppable by anything AI throws at player.

 

[Malachi256]

Yeah I looked at the main forums for the game and it seems like a primary complaint is the poor AI (I heard the same thing there about the late game AI just being awful) so I guess I'll just keep watching for a patch or something.