Virote's Ancient Greek Scenario - Public Alpha

[CivChris]

How long you waiting now?

I´m at 9-10 mins now wich really...
i think this should really be one of the important tasks to handle ...
for i fear no one will really play it when this does not change

I do not know what to do here. Maybe I should use my cripple-large-empires strategy for most governments? Of course, it will be really bad for the bigger empires, and bearable for the smaller ones. I really don't know what else to do here

hm only with corruption i think it won`t do, i don`t know exactly how it works, since there`s the distance to palace corruption, wich would stab all far of colonies to death.
and that other corruption is something with optimal number of cities don`t know how that works out in the end?

for sure the far off colonies still need to be operable...

maybe delaying the agora to the classical techs would do?

Two reasons:
1. To block off sea channels
2. Because it cannot access the particular sea square which it would otherwise move to.

It is more likely to be #1.

honestly i din`t know the ai would be so clever when it`s most of the time so dumb

Don't they have any stray galleys which you can attack?

i did attack all galleys that crossed my fleets path but it was not satisfactionary... my war ships sunk their ships one by one without any counter attack...

I hate corruption

However, it will make the corruption-reducing citizens more useful, so think I'll do it!

I've also just found out that I hadn't set the "world sizes" to anything uniform like I had in previous versions. This may be part of your corruption/tech rate woes, if the last random map you had played on was a smallish one.

hrhr i hate corruption as well, always cripling my will to build more and more

but since even neapolis suffers only 1/3 of corruption, it might really be set to low under oligarchie...
hm random game... gee can`t remember when last played one of those, but that small worldmap thing might be the case.

Thanks for your feedback!/QUOTE]

well youre more than welcome, i`m always interested in ancient scenarios and greece has much to offer on that
so i`m actually glad if i can help you to sort out the minor problems.

Out of interest, what difficulty level do you usually play?

hm diffrent actually, mostly monarch or emperor, i actually make it depend on who i play mostly, when playing like china, rome or even egypt i go for emperor, when babylon or phonicia or so i go for monarch.
but that actually has no gameplay reasons at all...

havent tired much beyond emperor level for i found that difficulty quite appealing.


forgot to ask:

will there be an updated alpha test sometime soon?
i would love to start a new game pretty soon, since this one well rather speeds to it`s end...
I´ll go through the whole tech tree though,

but before dealing with the same problems again, i`d rather find new ones to handle with then

 

[Virote_Considon]

I´m at 9-10 mins now wich really...
i think this should really be one of the important tasks to handle ...
for i fear no one will really play it when this does not change
Unfortunately, there is little that I can do, for now

hm only with corruption i think it won`t do, i don`t know exactly how it works, since there`s the distance to palace corruption, wich would stab all far of colonies to death.
and that other corruption is something with optimal number of cities don`t know how that works out in the end?

for sure the far off colonies still need to be operable...

maybe delaying the agora to the classical techs would do?

Increased corruption should do the trick. I can always add in more corruption-reducing citizens, and add in extra corruption-reducing effects to the improvements/wonders...

honestly i din`t know the ai would be so clever when it`s most of the time so dumb

Beats me. Maybe they're just putting them there because they realize that they have already explored on further, and do not want to backtrack

i did attack all galleys that crossed my fleets path but it was not satisfactionary... my war ships sunk their ships one by one without any counter attack...

I think that is just due to the weakness of their current ships; they should be braver in subsequent updates

hrhr i hate corruption as well, always cripling my will to build more and more

but since even neapolis suffers only 1/3 of corruption, it might really be set to low under oligarchie...
hm random game... gee can`t remember when last played one of those, but that small worldmap thing might be the case.

I think it is generally set low, as it was on 60% for ALL difficulty levels! I set it back to 100%, although if this is too much, then I may set it to 80%.

well youre more than welcome, i`m always interested in ancient scenarios and greece has much to offer on that
so i`m actually glad if i can help you to sort out the minor problems.

Well, it's appreciated

hm diffrent actually, mostly monarch or emperor, i actually make it depend on who i play mostly, when playing like china, rome or even egypt i go for emperor, when babylon or phonicia or so i go for monarch.
but that actually has no gameplay reasons at all...

havent tired much beyond emperor level for i found that difficulty quite appealing.

Ah. I normally play Monarch.

forgot to ask:

will there be an updated alpha test sometime soon?
i would love to start a new game pretty soon, since this one well rather speeds to it`s end...
I´ll go through the whole tech tree though,

but before dealing with the same problems again, i`d rather find new ones to handle with then

Some time soon; I've done Scythia's tree, govts and units, just need to do the rest of their stuff and many other tweaks

 

[CivChris]

hm i didn`t get far...

got another crash bug for a missing entry on the pediaicons.txt
ANIMNAME_PRTO_P_Citizen_Hoplite2

i can solve problems regarding buildings in the txt files
but actiually i have no idea what to to with all those units files

and since, i already upgraded some units to citizen hoplites, and they worked fine, i don`t know whats really missing here...
it seems the crash comes when i build that unit myself, or the production switchs to it after finishing something else, never had anything like this before

hope you can help there, cause persia just declared war on lydia and i embarked my fleet (along with amazaons and heroics) to fight for those brother greeks


2 more minot things i observed but don`t know if they are intended:

- corinth can build both heavy transport and corinthan galley at the same time, since the heavy transport does not upgrade to anything..
i think you missed out upgrading the heavy transport to corinthan galley? wich then upgrades to the italian trireme (if you have italians that is).

- i have artemis orthia finished and now can build army, but i can build both an army (no HP bonus) and an peleponesian army (2 HP bonus), so the normal army unit should imrpove to the better so it`s taken from the buildable list, or has it some other purpouse?

 

[Virote_Considon]

hm i didn`t get far...

got another crash bug for a missing entry on the pediaicons.txt
ANIMNAME_PRTO_P_Citizen_Hoplite2

Thanks for finding that one. It also affected another unit. Download the pediaicons again from the first post. You should still be able to continue your game

i can solve problems regarding buildings in the txt files
but actiually i have no idea what to to with all those units files

It's pretty simple. You just specify the unit folder for the unit(it knows to search in art\units\). Inside the Unit folder, the .ini file should also have the same name. For the bare basics (i.e., not needing to know how to change the graphics on an Era/Captured basis), that's all there is to know

and since, i already upgraded some units to citizen hoplites, and they worked fine, i don`t know whats really missing here...
it seems the crash comes when i build that unit myself, or the production switchs to it after finishing something else, never had anything like this before

This is because there are 2 different versions of the unit, because the later version can enslave. Graphically, they are the same unit, but physically, they are different. I just forgot to put in the #animname entries for the upgrades!

hope you can help there, cause persia just declared war on lydia and i embarked my fleet (along with amazaons and heroics) to fight for those brother greeks

I hope you do well!

2 more minot things i observed but don`t know if they are intended:

- corinth can build both heavy transport and corinthan galley at the same time, since the heavy transport does not upgrade to anything..
i think you missed out upgrading the heavy transport to corinthan galley? wich then upgrades to the italian trireme (if you have italians that is).

No, there is a difference between what the units can transport; the Corinthian Galley can transport more, but only Foot Units, whereas the Heavy Transport can transport less, but also transport "heavier" units, such as catapults.

- i have artemis orthia finished and now can build army, but i can build both an army (no HP bonus) and an peleponesian army (2 HP bonus), so the normal army unit should imrpove to the better so it`s taken from the buildable list, or has it some other purpouse?

That one really was an error on my part

 

[CivChris]

It's pretty simple. You just specify the unit folder for the unit(it knows to search in art\units\). Inside the Unit folder, the .ini file should also have the same name. For the bare basics (i.e., not needing to know how to change the graphics on an Era/Captured basis), that's all there is to know

yes i`d like cup of tea
units are just locked box to me, but on the other hand i don`t need to change that

No, there is a difference between what the units can transport; the Corinthian Galley can transport more, but only Foot Units, whereas the Heavy Transport can transport less, but also transport "heavier" units, such as catapults.

ah i was checking but didn not notice the "footunit transport" for the corinthan, thus wondered why i should build that old heavy transports

Thanks for finding that one. It also affected another unit. Download the pediaicons again from the first post. You should still be able to continue your game

wokred just fine! thx!
now i can go for persia and finish the tech tree to check if there`s anything else giving me thoughts

i feel sad for persia... i have the tomb of leonidas placing a garrison in my citys and the seven gated wall placing a city wall... so i can go for quite a ride and won`t have to check for defences too much...

DOH! just wanted to check for what building gives the garrisons and made a right click int eh city view
now i have to redo the whole turn

i really hope turntimes will get at least some better in the next version

plus

 

[Virote_Considon]

yes i`d like cup of tea
units are just locked box to me, but on the other hand i don`t need to change that

Well, there are many tutorials about and people to help out when you finally do want to add units

ah i was checking but didn not notice the "footunit transport" for the corinthan, thus wondered why i should build that old heavy transports

Yeah. It's set up this way to make it more awkward in getting heavier units, such as catapults, siege engines and chariots, around with the rest of your army. Basically, it makes heavy equipment a logistical nightmare, as they were IRL

wokred just fine! thx!
now i can go for persia and finish the tech tree to check if there`s anything else giving me thoughts

i feel sad for persia... i have the tomb of leonidas placing a garrison in my citys and the seven gated wall placing a city wall... so i can go for quite a ride and won`t have to check for defences too much...

DOH! just wanted to check for what building gives the garrisons and made a right click int eh city view
now i have to redo the whole turn

Sounds like you may be able to give the Persians a good run for their money!

i really hope turntimes will get at least some better in the next version

plus

I wish I could do something about turn times, but unfortunatley, I know of nothing, really, apart from these new crippling strategies I'm implementing...

 

[CivChris]

so here we go..
i made me a list this time

- the war against perisa had some suprises, since my direct neighbours were less developed i thought persia would not be that tough only massing plain units.

well units of perisa that i crossed while conquering the whole of asia minor:
-greek hoplites
-perisan archers
-persian chariots
-meso archers
-meso chariots
-meso infantry
- ONE indian archer
- heroic warriors ( at least i think it was one)

and Xerxes , wich i killed with an amazon princess

they had masses of the archers and also quite some chariots and infantrys, i made it to samosata - mytilene but had to sign peace then cause 40 more perisan units were roaming in asia minor..

the spawned units really needed their att and defence stats on this!
so you might think again about reducing their strenght...
on the other hand i really din`t take any other troops with me only the spawned ones, and i could have taken many with better att/deff values...

the diffrent nationality units

- work fine as far as i could see, italian cites build nice italian units my only mesopotamian city could build only meso worker,meso infantry and syrian merchenary, no other units
hope in connection with iron there are more to build?


Booty
i captured one with a pirate galley, brought it back to my capital ( as i was used to with booty) nothing happend
so i read the instrucktions
melted my booty with a heroic warrior and tokk it to the VP near corinth but
nothing happend tied it on VPs outside my culture zone but no sir.. no money for me

Mythological beasts

i wandered the steppes a bit and on my way i visited delphi ( no not to conquer) that immobile dragon there hinders the ai totaly, they won`t move any workers around and just won`t develop.. so i fear it should be taken away, although it looks really neat

in the northern steppes the other beasts were gone... only the immoblie remaind in their locations waiting for someone to attack them

one more crash bug

-missing entry on the animname orto p peleponesian pelastate

i checked for all other units i could build and they seem to work fine exept of the one above.

Unit names

as said before the city rubbel spawnes at king periander,well
-the woman units do the same, so i have some females pretending to be king periander.. back in those times this would`ve been no joke thing


- completed tech tree in 733 BC, almost all classical techs took me 1-2 turns, the scools, philosophers and alchemists took care of that.


so that`s it from me so far

i won`t play that one further cause the thrill is gone, and the turn times now 15 minutes, make me cry for those 5-6 min turn times in the beginning

i will start a new one when your done for the next update and actually can`t wait to be restricted to low research times, lesser units and a hopefully, at least tiny bit, better turn time

btw, since i had way too much time between the turns i have altered the map quite some more... well at places MUCH more....

rearranged corsica, sardinia, some of italy, most of egypt, the "carthagian" africa coast, some changes along the black sea, added malta and pantelleria (between sicily(wich i also slightly changed) and carthage.

i added some more citys like
Kythera (Argos)
Ainos (Euboa)
Messana (Magna Graecia) cause i gave kroton (originally founded by a city near patrai) to elis.
rhegion to Messene

ah and only for a try, i made pontus to colchis and gave sinope (colony of milet) to ionia, so ionia can setlle the black sea as they should.

skiped byzantion back to athens as you wanted and gave kalchedon to corinth, along the bosporoan landbride since that other thing will not work

sorry if i`m proposing so many changes... it`s just i`m really into maps somehow
and since it is your mod you decide what to change when how and where of course.

 

[Virote_Considon]

so here we go..
i made me a list this time

Cool

- the war against perisa had some suprises, since my direct neighbours were less developed i thought persia would not be that tough only massing plain units.

well units of perisa that i crossed while conquering the whole of asia minor:
-greek hoplites
-perisan archers
-persian chariots
-meso archers
-meso chariots
-meso infantry
- ONE indian archer
- heroic warriors ( at least i think it was one)

and Xerxes , wich i killed with an amazon princess

Had they won him against you, or did he come against one of their previous conquests (such as Babylon)?

It looks like the Persians were a bit more advanced that you'd think

they had masses of the archers and also quite some chariots and infantrys, i made it to samosata - mytilene but had to sign peace then cause 40 more perisan units were roaming in asia minor..

the spawned units really needed their att and defence stats on this!
so you might think again about reducing their strenght...
on the other hand i really din`t take any other troops with me only the spawned ones, and i could have taken many with better att/deff values...

I think I will still lower them. Your invasion force should definitely be made up of "homeland" troops

the diffrent nationality units

- work fine as far as i could see, italian cites build nice italian units my only mesopotamian city could build only meso worker,meso infantry and syrian merchenary, no other units
hope in connection with iron there are more to build?

I don't think there are in Mesopotamia. You should be able to build those Mesopotamian Chariots, though, with Horses and the right tech (unless the Syrian Merc. is acting as a replacement).

However, you're not supposed to be able to build too much in Mesopotamian lands as Corinth. The idea is, as Corinth (and other civs with no connection to such lands), you can only build weak "generic" units, so if you want more firepower (which you should need if you want to hold your own against the AI in their own turf), you should have to ship units in from your homeland.

Booty
i captured one with a pirate galley, brought it back to my capital ( as i was used to with booty) nothing happend
so i read the instrucktions
melted my booty with a heroic warrior and tokk it to the VP near corinth but
nothing happend tied it on VPs outside my culture zone but no sir.. no money for me

I'm not sure what is wrong here... I did accidentally select "Capture the Unit", instead of "Reverse Capture the Unit", which means you should be able to take it to your capital for the gold (rather than to a VP location). Maybe if you capture it with the Heroic Warrior (a Land unit), and take it back to your capital, it may work?

Mythological beasts

i wandered the steppes a bit and on my way i visited delphi ( no not to conquer) that immobile dragon there hinders the ai totaly, they won`t move any workers around and just won`t develop.. so i fear it should be taken away, although it looks really neat

I know what you mean I'm sure there is something that I could do... Maybe if I moved it outside of the immediate city radius, it would have a better effect on the AI?

in the northern steppes the other beasts were gone... only the immoblie remaind in their locations waiting for someone to attack them

How far along the Steppes did you go? Just until the Caspian? Because if you go further (MUCH further), you should be able to find a couple of cool Chinese Dragons, among other things. I doubt you'll be able to kill them, or even damage them, but they look cool

one more crash bug

-missing entry on the animname orto p peleponesian pelastate

i checked for all other units i could build and they seem to work fine exept of the one above.

Thanks. I'm correcting now

Unit names

as said before the city rubbel spawnes at king periander,well
-the woman units do the same, so i have some females pretending to be king periander.. back in those times this would`ve been no joke thing

Haha! As with the City Rabble, there is not much I can do about this, without removing the "king" flag (which I want to keep)... You could always rename them? (Although I agree that it is a bit tedious...)

- completed tech tree in 733 BC, almost all classical techs took me 1-2 turns, the scools, philosophers and alchemists took care of that.

Luckily, the tech costs have been increased in the current version, and may also be increased further if it is needed.

so that`s it from me so far

i won`t play that one further cause the thrill is gone, and the turn times now 15 minutes, make me cry for those 5-6 min turn times in the beginning

i will start a new one when your done for the next update and actually can`t wait to be restricted to low research times, lesser units and a hopefully, at least tiny bit, better turn time

btw, since i had way too much time between the turns i have altered the map quite some more... well at places MUCH more....

rearranged corsica, sardinia, some of italy, most of egypt, the "carthagian" africa coast, some changes along the black sea, added malta and pantelleria (between sicily(wich i also slightly changed) and carthage.

i added some more citys like
Kythera (Argos)
Ainos (Euboa)
Messana (Magna Graecia) cause i gave kroton (originally founded by a city near patrai) to elis.
rhegion to Messene

ah and only for a try, i made pontus to colchis and gave sinope (colony of milet) to ionia, so ionia can setlle the black sea as they should.

skiped byzantion back to athens as you wanted and gave kalchedon to corinth, along the bosporoan landbride since that other thing will not work

sorry if i`m proposing so many changes... it`s just i`m really into maps somehow
and since it is your mod you decide what to change when how and where of course.

Of course- and I'd be happy to see any changes that you make

 

[Virote_Considon]

Made another Pediaicons fix- DL them again from the front page!

 

[CivChris]

Had they won him against you, or did he come against one of their previous conquests (such as Babylon)?

must have gotten xerxes from babylon or either india, for they had an indian war running as well.

However, you're not supposed to be able to build too much in Mesopotamian lands as Corinth. The idea is, as Corinth (and other civs with no connection to such lands), you can only build weak "generic" units, so if you want more firepower (which you should need if you want to hold your own against the AI in their own turf), you should have to ship units in from your homeland.

sounds perfect reasonable to me

I'm not sure what is wrong here... I did accidentally select "Capture the Unit", instead of "Reverse Capture the Unit", which means you should be able to take it to your capital for the gold (rather than to a VP location). Maybe if you capture it with the Heroic Warrior (a Land unit), and take it back to your capital, it may work?

- moment please I´ll load it up again

yes! captured the princess, so return to the capital was it.

I know what you mean I'm sure there is something that I could do... Maybe if I moved it outside of the immediate city radius, it would have a better effect on the AI?

won`t do i have stelled sardinia (where that snake thing lingers) and although it`s outside my culture zone ( 3 tiles form the city)
my worker won`t automate ...
seems he fears that thing might strike him dead

so i fear they have to be placed on more remote spots.

How far along the Steppes did you go? Just until the Caspian? Because if you go further (MUCH further), you should be able to find a couple of cool Chinese Dragons, among other things. I doubt you'll be able to kill them, or even damage them, but they look cool

hell, no i just went through a bit of western europe,
concerning the turn time, reaching asia would really be sort of a weeks journey....

Haha! As with the City Rabble, there is not much I can do about this, without removing the "king" flag (which I want to keep)... You could always rename them? (Although I agree that it is a bit tedious...)

renaming?! that ain`t funny man

i got 89 of those rubbish rabbles...

hm... so all units with king flag get the same name? theres no workaround?

 

[Virote_Considon]

must have gotten xerxes from babylon or either india, for they had an indian war running as well.

Ah. How did the Indian war pan out? Who (territory-wise) "won" the war?

sounds perfect reasonable to me



- moment please I´ll load it up again

yes! captured the princess, so return to the capital was it.

In the next version, it will definitely be Victory Locations!

won`t do i have stelled sardinia (where that snake thing lingers) and although it`s outside my culture zone ( 3 tiles form the city)
my worker won`t automate ...
seems he fears that thing might strike him dead

so i fear they have to be placed on more remote spots.

That's a bummer! I guess I could reduce some of their stats, to make them a small menace early in the game, but menaces which can be easily defeated?

hell, no i just went through a bit of western europe,
concerning the turn time, reaching asia would really be sort of a weeks journey....

A true adventure

renaming?! that ain`t funny man

i got 89 of those rubbish rabbles...

hm... so all units with king flag get the same name? theres no workaround?

None that I know of, apart from giving them the "leader" flag (which means you'll have rabble Jasons and Women Heracles' within your cities, which is just as bad! )

 

[CivChris]

Ah. How did the Indian war pan out? Who (territory-wise) "won" the war?

hm i have not yet made contact with india, but since i traded word maps with persia, i could see them slowly advancing into gandara and bactria taking some cities there.
but the overall impression was that persia was loosing ground, that might be due their encounter in the west with lydia and myself and the masses of troops they moved into my direction and not to india...
though they could have even more units over there...

That's a bummer! I guess I could reduce some of their stats, to make them a small menace early in the game, but menaces which can be easily defeated?

hm yeah thats a problem that needs a fine solution...

- placing mobile units won`t do as well for they just attack in the first turns and take some gold ...

- placing the immobile, with weak defence would do for funsport in the first few turns, but not more

- placing too many immobile on future settling spots may lead the ai to settle some far off lands...

for now maybe stick more to the mobile units on settable islands? so anyone trying to settle further from the beast will be attacked furtheron..

but honestly i have no solution for this either....

None that I know of, apart from giving them the "leader" flag (which means you'll have rabble Jasons and Women Heracles' within your cities, which is just as bad! )

hm k, so it`s set with all those kings at least for now

as for the map, i`ll redo some of the levante as well, since it`s so unnaturally streched due to the much larger greece it just doesn`t feel right for me...
i`ll leave mesopotamia as it is though, cause changing that would make it necesarry to fit more land in all the way to asia...

i`ve actually really started to like the map itself, although i`m more for real earth maps, with a few changes i`m actually loving that map

keroko made something really fantasic with it, i`ve seldom seen a map in just the perfect sizes for cities and civs like this,
normally all maps tend to be too small or too big...

as soon as i come up with a suitable version of the levant i`ll post it.

sneak peak at the changed carthagian coast, with malta pantelleria,
i placed ruins on all colony locations i have the historic name for.




forgot to mention: i`ve added lots of sand dunes (no roads) because i really dislike seeing the ai or my own automated workers build roads on every tile they can walk upon...

and as you already used it in arabia it`ll divide north from south afrika, with exeptions on some small "trade routes" that i left open for roads.

 

[CivChris]

k levate is done, i checked back with the previous chnages i posted and will try to give a list of the changes, so you won`t have to loook all over

- changed some coasts a lil and added overall ruins at the colony spots that i got the names for.

- changed the hellespont by making it wider, now the lydian cities won`t block settling positions on the western coast when they get to 100 culture.

- added the landbride at byzantion (athens) again, kalchedon (corinth) will still be of importance as garrison on the east side.

- as a sugestion gave sinope to Ionia ( was colony of milet) to represent the ionian influence and colonization in the black sea
and because of it renamed pontus to colchis (capital at phasis)

- moved the "ionian" coast a row more inland and added some ocean there

- changed tarsus to perisa ( that now hold 2 med sea ports)

- changed antioch to babylonia

- added berytos and sidon to phonicia ( was not sure about the phonicia tribe resource? will they need meso ressources as well?)

- changed the levant and it`s cities to better fit the map

- tweaked arabia so it would fit as it should be and conect the sheban empire

- moved the iram of the pillars to western oman ( theres been recent surveys there that might identify an ancient spot as that realm

- added panormus (sizily) to phonicia, magna graecia would settle that spot before the phonicians and since they lost some cities in the east.

- added messana and massilia to magna graecia

- skipt kroton to elis rule

- reshaped the carthagian coast along corsica, sardinia and sizily

- i added a asclepion (2nd palace to charthage) i really think thats useful so the greeks will have a tough time to race against phonicia for good settlements in the western med, bad thing is that the asclepion won`t work when the city gets over size 6... but the gerousia will only work under oligarchy... maybe another good corruption reducing building placed there from the start would serve as well

- i thought about the same for meroe, since that would normally be a kingdom of it`s own... but i fear it would get too powerful so i skiped that idea.

- reshaped the italian peninsula a bit and replaced the etrusan cities, volsinii is now capital for that`s the suposed place of the fanum voltumnae ( the etrusan cief sanctuary and meeting place.

- moved mediolanum (celts) to northern italy, not sure so if it gets italian or babarian tribe ressources?

- changed the nile a bit and replaced egyptian cities
i have naucratis as the " nile port" and rhacotis ( thats were alexandreia was founded) west of it.
i`d sugest to keep both cities because naucratis was very important until alexandria took that role. plus naucratis stayed the only polis in the ptolomaian empire. the human player can still decide for himself wich city he will evolve more.

- added lots of sanddunes to restirct all players to build roads all around ...


- some more minor changes i really can`t remeber

because there are so many changes, you would have to import that map to your biq if you want to take the changes.
i would sugest:
you take a toughtful and close look at the changes, i made sure the "tribes" ressources are in place and copied all other resources from the original version.
if you dislike some of the landscape/ cityplacement changes give me feedback and i`ll change them to your sugestions

heres the file
View attachment DoricGreece2WORK.zip

 

[Virote_Considon]

hm i have not yet made contact with india, but since i traded word maps with persia, i could see them slowly advancing into gandara and bactria taking some cities there.
but the overall impression was that persia was loosing ground, that might be due their encounter in the west with lydia and myself and the masses of troops they moved into my direction and not to india...
though they could have even more units over there...

Does anyone you know have contact with India? Babylon or Sheba might?

hm yeah thats a problem that needs a fine solution...

- placing mobile units won`t do as well for they just attack in the first turns and take some gold ...

- placing the immobile, with weak defence would do for funsport in the first few turns, but not more

- placing too many immobile on future settling spots may lead the ai to settle some far off lands...

for now maybe stick more to the mobile units on settable islands? so anyone trying to settle further from the beast will be attacked furtheron..

but honestly i have no solution for this either....

I think I'll weaken the ones who start in "good" positions, but keep mobile ones on islands, then. The ones roaming around in the more "barbaric" lands need not be altered, though

hm k, so it`s set with all those kings at least for now

Aye. However, should whoever owns it release their parts of the source code, I'll be able to change it

as for the map, i`ll redo some of the levante as well, since it`s so unnaturally streched due to the much larger greece it just doesn`t feel right for me...
i`ll leave mesopotamia as it is though, cause changing that would make it necesarry to fit more land in all the way to asia...

Yeah, the Levante is a bit streched. That, the Sinai and Africa (which is by far the worst hit area of the map, which was a necessary change, else Laconia would find itself linking up with Cyrenacia

i`ve actually really started to like the map itself, although i`m more for real earth maps, with a few changes i`m actually loving that map

keroko made something really fantasic with it, i`ve seldom seen a map in just the perfect sizes for cities and civs like this,
normally all maps tend to be too small or too big...

That's what draws me to this map, as well. In other maps that I've seen, I've found that some areas (especially the already crowded Greece) are too small, whereas others (such as Anatolia, or Persia) are much too big for what is needed. After taking the large Greece from Varwnos' Byzantine map, and placing it on Keroro's map, everything was pretty much the perfect size!

as soon as i come up with a suitable version of the levant i`ll post it.

sneak peak at the changed carthagian coast, with malta pantelleria,
i placed ruins on all colony locations i have the historic name for.

View attachment 168984

Brilliant! Looks like it will be dead useful!

forgot to mention: i`ve added lots of sand dunes (no roads) because i really dislike seeing the ai or my own automated workers build roads on every tile they can walk upon...

and as you already used it in arabia it`ll divide north from south afrika, with exeptions on some small "trade routes" that i left open for roads.

Sounds good to me. I'd done that with a previous version, but when I altered the map, I had no need for it. Now that I have the Arabian Workers set to unwheeled (which was necessary to link up Incense and Spices), I have reason to include it in more areas than I currently do

 

[CivChris]

Does anyone you know have contact with India? Babylon or Sheba might?

stupid me
could have thought about that before...

checked it the babylonians could give me contact with the shebans

the indian contact i could get from persia of course...
i traded maps and india has advanced up to Margu and Ghazni but havent lost any of theri cities it seems. so india might be too powerful for poor persia...

Aye. However, should whoever owns it release their parts of the source code, I'll be able to change it

well i fear we all know that that aint likley... at least not in the near future

 

[Virote_Considon]

k levate is done, i checked back with the previous chnages i posted and will try to give a list of the changes, so you won`t have to loook all over

Nice. I'll still probably look all over, though

- changed some coasts a lil and added overall ruins at the colony spots that i got the names for.

- changed the hellespont by making it wider, now the lydian cities won`t block settling positions on the western coast when they get to 100 culture.

- added the landbride at byzantion (athens) again, kalchedon (corinth) will still be of importance as garrison on the east side.

Nice, nice and nice again!

- as a sugestion gave sinope to Ionia ( was colony of milet) to represent the ionian influence and colonization in the black sea
and because of it renamed pontus to colchis (capital at phasis)

I still dunno if I'm gonna do this, or not...

- moved the "ionian" coast a row more inland and added some ocean there

Sounds good!

- changed tarsus to perisa ( that now hold 2 med sea ports)

I won't be doing this- it may give Persia a jump start when trying to take over Greece! I want them to work towards gaining access to the Med!

- changed antioch to babylonia

I'll have to look at this one properly. On the one hand, I dunno how it will affect Phoenicia, but on the other, there is nothing immediately wrong with this that I can think of.

- added berytos and sidon to phonicia ( was not sure about the phonicia tribe resource? will they need meso ressources as well?)

They do need both; the Mesopotamian resource needs to be under the cities at least, and the Phoenician resource will allow the construction of superior boats!

- changed the levant and it`s cities to better fit the map

- tweaked arabia so it would fit as it should be and conect the sheban empire

- moved the iram of the pillars to western oman ( theres been recent surveys there that might identify an ancient spot as that realm

- added panormus (sizily) to phonicia, magna graecia would settle that spot before the phonicians and since they lost some cities in the east.

- added messana and massilia to magna graecia

- skipt kroton to elis rule

- reshaped the carthagian coast along corsica, sardinia and sizily

All sounds good to me!

- i added a asclepion (2nd palace to charthage) i really think thats useful so the greeks will have a tough time to race against phonicia for good settlements in the western med, bad thing is that the asclepion won`t work when the city gets over size 6... but the gerousia will only work under oligarchy... maybe another good corruption reducing building placed there from the start would serve as well

I was planning to, if I still had enough improvement/wonder slots when I'd finished the Colony civs tech tree.

- i thought about the same for meroe, since that would normally be a kingdom of it`s own... but i fear it would get too powerful so i skiped that idea.

Meroe was in the same boat as above.

- reshaped the italian peninsula a bit and replaced the etrusan cities, volsinii is now capital for that`s the suposed place of the fanum voltumnae ( the etrusan cief sanctuary and meeting place.

Sounds good to me.

- moved mediolanum (celts) to northern italy, not sure so if it gets italian or babarian tribe ressources?

Probably Italians.

- changed the nile a bit and replaced egyptian cities
i have naucratis as the " nile port" and rhacotis ( thats were alexandreia was founded) west of it.
i`d sugest to keep both cities because naucratis was very important until alexandria took that role. plus naucratis stayed the only polis in the ptolomaian empire. the human player can still decide for himself wich city he will evolve more.

Sounds good again!

- added lots of sanddunes to restirct all players to build roads all around ...

Cool!

- some more minor changes i really can`t remeber

because there are so many changes, you would have to import that map to your biq if you want to take the changes.

I'll have both the .biq files open, so I can study them carefully.

i would sugest:
you take a toughtful and close look at the changes, i made sure the "tribes" ressources are in place and copied all other resources from the original version.

Nice one!

if you dislike some of the landscape/ cityplacement changes give me feedback and i`ll change them to your sugestions

You'll be able to see the changes which I kept when I release the next update, which should be before the end of the month! (especially since I have 1/2 term...)

 

[Virote_Considon]

stupid me
could have thought about that before...

checked it the babylonians could give me contact with the shebans

the indian contact i could get from persia of course...
i traded maps and india has advanced up to Margu and Ghazni but havent lost any of theri cities it seems. so india might be too powerful for poor persia...

Ha! Looks like the Persians have already over-extended themselves!

well i fear we all know that that aint likley... at least not in the near future

So much for optimism

Anyway, ~£95 million tonight in Euromillions... I'll happily pay £1m for the winning ticket

 

[CivChris]

on colchis:

I still dunno if I'm gonna do this, or not...

well as said it`s up to you, it`s sort of a fame to history conflict in my eyes, since pontus is a name many players associate something with, colchis is more sort of a myth realm... but would be the historic choise.

I won't be doing this- it may give Persia a jump start when trying to take over Greece! I want them to work towards gaining access to the Med!

i also thought that it might give trouble... but i wanted to reduce phonicia to its actuall borders...
may i sugest

-to give kelenderis to lydia

- leave antioch at babylonian hands,
on the other hand... antioch was founded ~300BC so in the time the mod spans there was no city...
BUT! you could always rename it to AL-Mina and give it to euboa, for it was a colony from there...

- and give tarsus back to phonicia, tarsus / cilicia was more or less independent during most of the spaning time, so it would be ok to represent it as idependent phonician city, i guess

just imporant in my eyes is to cut the phonician realm at antioch so the "true" phonicia looks right.

You'll be able to see the changes which I kept when I release the next update, which should be before the end of the month! (especially since I have 1/2 term...)

hm since the month just started guess i`ll have to check for other games till then

So much for optimism

Anyway, ~£95 million tonight in Euromillions... I'll happily pay £1m for the winning ticket

thats some amount of money...

 

[Virote_Considon]

on colchis:


well as said it`s up to you, it`s sort of a fame to history conflict in my eyes, since pontus is a name many players associate something with, colchis is more sort of a myth realm... but would be the historic choise.

Aye. Also, I don't know what tech tree Colchis would go in, whereas Pontus fit nicely within the Hellenistic tech tree with Macedonia and Epirus.

i also thought that it might give trouble... but i wanted to reduce phonicia to its actuall borders...
may i sugest

-to give kelenderis to lydia

- leave antioch at babylonian hands,
on the other hand... antioch was founded ~300BC so in the time the mod spans there was no city...
BUT! you could always rename it to AL-Mina and give it to euboa, for it was a colony from there...

Sounds fun enough!

- and give tarsus back to phonicia, tarsus / cilicia was more or less independent during most of the spaning time, so it would be ok to represent it as idependent phonician city, i guess

just imporant in my eyes is to cut the phonician realm at antioch so the "true" phonicia looks right.

I see what you mean.

hm since the month just started guess i`ll have to check for other games till then

Well, half-term is the week after next, so we'll see how well I'm doing then

thats some amount of money...

Yeah. The source code holders wouldn't be able to resist it!

 

[CivChris]

i`ve tried a play with the redone map, i`m half way through the archaic times and it seems it works quite fine so far.

i set research rates to min. 8 and max. 25 and it seems all ais are developing really good at times too good ( thrace got greek hoplites already since they have no complete tech tree)

but the "finished" ai`s like thebes, elis and sparta seem to do better, having heroic warriors, amazons and satyrs walking around.

so it might be no bad idea to set a research limit so even the low developed countries will go for some power.

and babylonia and india seem to conquer the persian empire

found another missing entry:

art/uniuts mycenean chariot/ mycenean chariot .ini

one of the ai was building a doric chariot, wich caused the game to crash..
i was wondering, but i think i have not build any of these back in the other game

Aye. Also, I don't know what tech tree Colchis would go in, whereas Pontus fit nicely within the Hellenistic tech tree with Macedonia and Epirus.

well it could go along greeks techs along like the bosporian kingdom cause it was well influneced through the greek colonisation and the slave trade with the greeks.


so, did you get any of the euromillions for the source code?