Why are you (still) modding CivCol ?

[Monguntiacum]

Hello, i come to that forum today, because raystuttgart told me, here are still active modders for Colonization. So, i started now modding Colonization 2, after a short time attempt some years before. But i´m part of a medieval 2 total war modding team, so i never have had enough time for colonization. But last weeks i played again Religion and Revolution, and Mare Nostrum, Medieval Conquest and Colonization 2071. And i had much fun. So i will now try again.
I love Total Conversions. And Colonization have a big scope for total conversions. That the game is an older one is irrelevant, i´m also an old one

 

[Nightinggale]

That the game is an older one is irrelevant, i´m also an old one

Good. You will fit right in with the rest of us

Do you have any plan on what precisely you want to do?

 

[raystuttgart]

@Monguntiacum:
Nice to see you here at CivFanatics.

 

[Monguntiacum]

@Nightinggale

good to hear that mate



I always look for strong warriors ehm modders who will fight at my side.


edit: I deleted most of the first post, because nearly identical with second post. Sorry for dp.

 

[Monguntiacum]

I have no idea, where my post is gone away after using the "reply" button. So i try again.
Moderator Action: Sorry, moderation queue. Should both be visible now. The_J

Also raystuttgart get an heart attack when he heard my "visions" about making some different Total Conversions, i will hold the line and dont back off

But of course, step by step and one after the other.

Here you can take a look for the projects i would like to do:
http://www.infracta.de/wbb/forum/index.php?page=Board&boardID=437
It´s in german, but with little help of google translation

The first mod i would like to do is Hispania Maxima. I love Religion an Revolution and i admire the job Ekmek, koma13 und veBear did with Mare Nostrum. So Hispania Maxima should base on both mods. Technically on RaR, but similar timeframe like Mare Nostrum.

The mod should bring spain peninsular in 2th century before jesus christ superstar, when Carthagians starting the conquest of hispania to get the silver mines.
So as playable factions: Rome, Carthago, Macedons and Gauls (Arveni). "Tribes" are Celtiberians/Iberians and Greek Cities at eastern coast.

Here the thread:
http://www.infracta.de/wbb/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=57028

 

[orlanth]

Welcome Monguntiacum! Like you I love total conversion mods much more than adding onto the vanilla game, they allow an entirely new game experience And Civ4Col is a great base for developing these. I'd be interested to hear any ideas you have in mind!

 

[drjest2000]

@Monguntiacum - Welcome to the forum! I think we're all old men here >_<

 

[Monguntiacum]

my posts are appeared now, thanks The_J

I have no idea, where my post is gone away after using the "reply" button. So i try again.
Moderator Action: Sorry, moderation queue. Should both be visible now. The_J

Also raystuttgart get an heart attack when he heard my "visions" about making some different Total Conversions, i will hold the line and dont back off

But of course, step by step and one after the other.

Here you can take a look for the projects i would like to do:
http://www.infracta.de/wbb/forum/index.php?page=Board&boardID=437
It´s in german, but with little help of google translation

The first mod i would like to do is Hispania Maxima. I love Religion an Revolution and i admire the job Ekmek, koma13 und veBear did with Mare Nostrum. So Hispania Maxima should base on both mods. Technically on RaR, but similar timeframe like Mare Nostrum.

The mod should bring spain peninsular in 2th century before jesus christ superstar, when Carthagians starting the conquest of hispania to get the silver mines.
So as playable factions: Rome, Carthago, Macedons and Gauls (Arveni). "Tribes" are Celtiberians/Iberians and Greek Cities at eastern coast.

Here the thread:
http://www.infracta.de/wbb/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=57028

 

[Nightinggale]

That sounds really cool. I'm really looking forward to this one. To be honest Hispania Maxima isn't my main interest in history, but it does give us a great setting for a mod.

It´s in german, but with little help of google translation

Oder wir kann es auf Deutsch lesen
Seriously Google translate makes some interesting mistakes (it really like dirty words) and reading it in German is not only easier, it is also more accurate.

Colonization 2: Die Quellen des Nils

That made me wonder about an ancient Egyptian mod. Sounds cool, but I know I'm not doing it. I'm busy modding as it is.

Nightinggale (ein befreundeter Modder) ist ja aktuell auch dabei, die DLL von RaR 1.5 in Bezug auf Performance und Stabilität weiter zu verbessern.
Davon könntest du dann profitieren, wenn er das mal abgeschlossen hat.

Wow. People talk about me in foreign languages without my knowledge. I must be famous or something

I can't disagree with that statement and feel free to use whatever you like from RaRE. I haven't really added anything specific to RaR and all of the new features could be useful in any mod and so can the bugfixes. I also managed to reduce the wait time between turns by 25% and remember the starting point was RaR 1.5 with the speed improvements that one already has.

I properly should update the first post to tell all of this as most people will not read the whole thread

If you do anything to Civ4 (col or otherwise) I highly recommend you to use my new makefile. If not for the new features, then just for the fact that it uses all CPU cores rather than just one when compiling. No need to waste potiential modding time on waiting on a compiler
Around 10 years ago I worked on a code which took me 20 minutes to completely recompile. That really hurt productivity

 

[drjest2000]

Wow - I like the idea of Hispania Maxima. It makes me smile.

The two larger Balaeric Islands, the Gymnesian Islands, were settled by a mixed population of Greeks and Phonecians. Legend says they were settled by Rhodes after the Trojan War. By the 2nd cent. BCE, though, I would think they were under Punic domination, but as to what ethnicity they were, I would imagine that is hard to say. I'd say they were a "melting pot" result of some sort.

Spoiler :

 

[Monguntiacum]

Colonization 2: Die Quellen des Nils, shouldnt be ancient egyptian. It should be a mod about imperialism in 19th century at africa. With ironclads, early "machineguns". The title is a hommage about the searching of the mysterious spring of the nile of the great adventurer. That men inspired whole western world authors: Karl May`s "Kara Ben Nemsi", or the novels about "Allan Quatermain".

But that mod will come in future, first Hispania.


@Nightinggale: Thanks!

 

[Trade Winds]

I have been a Civfanatics unregistered reader and civ/col player for years; and an easy stuff modder, so I know most of the mods and most of you community members that I admire.

I still play and mod Colonization because it is a mixture of Civilization type games and stockpiling games, two genres that I love. And also this game is easy for “number changing moders” as me to achieve very playable changes in the game.

But praising about what we agree doesn’t help to improve, so I also want to comment some cons that I still find even after a so active modding community:

No need for expansion

Spoiler :

In civilization you must expand for new resources or fertile and productive areas. In Civ4Col, the squares round the city can make you rich, and you can find almost all kinds of resources there. This is why in my mods I leave terrain with zero production and I rely mostly on bonuses to have an incentive for expansion.

No need for a variety of resources.

Spoiler :

In civilization and stockpiling games you need more sophisticated resources to reach higher citizenship rates. Here just one type of manufactured resource can make you rich and you don’t need the whole array of them to progress. Some citizens should leave a city if they can’t buy in the market the goods they demand.

Loads of money.

Spoiler :

There is not a real need to make money. Or else, you end up with loads of money for nearly no use. In other games your money pays your army or you have to cope with the increasing inflation as in civilization. What inflates here is the population, at no cost; and your army is free.

If I learn enough to include an <upkeep> variable inside “CIV4ProfessionInfos.xml” and “CIV4UnitInfos.xml”, I will head that direction, although I don’t know how easy or hard this task is.

 

[raystuttgart]

@Trade Winds:

The nice thing about modding friendly games like Civ4Col is, that you can easily adjust them to your personal taste.
You do that, and that is great.

I will give my comment to one point you mention, if I may.

Resources (or yields) being more strategic:

Well, the general idea has been discussed several times.
Of course that does sound interesting, but one major aspects needs to be considered: AI.

Simple truth is, that Civ4Col Vanilla AI is damn stupid.
Mods (e.g. TAC or RaR) have tried to improve that AI and achieved to make it a bit less stupid.

But even after years of modding of a whole community AI is still not able to really plan ahead and think strategically.
It is still simply very reactive for the most part. In many cases its decision are even influenced by the outcome of randoms.

So when introducing complex concepts that are really important for gameplay and require some strategic thinking, you only have 2 reasonable approaches.
(If you don't, your AI is broken and the mod is not fun to play anymore. Most complex features use a mixture of the 2 following approaches.)

A) Try to implement some AI logic that "simulates" strategic thinking.

Very hard to do, since there are so many cases you might need to consider and implementing complex logic in a performant way is also not that easy.
Only a few of the best Civ4Col modders considering programming have ever been able to programm good AI logic for complex features.
And even those "experts" spent many many hours of implementing, improving and fixing logic for such complex concepts.

B) Have AI play by easier rules or simply let it cheat.

Usually that is not that difficult to do.
However, it is also not very satisfying to know, that AI is simply given easiers rules or just cheating.

 

[Trade Winds]

Mods (e.g. TAC or RaR) have tried to improve that AI and achieved to make it a bit less stupid.

I have seen AI problems before when modding but I didn’t give the importance you show.

The ideas I may have for my mod or my modmod were also probably thought by the master modders, but I see they were probably abandoned for the difficulties to teach the AI to cope with it.

So probably the limited AI is the biggest issue in Civ4Col.
Therefore I must experiment if the changes I do, for example the unit cost that I pursue, make the game more fun or more of a solitaire card game.

 

[Fullerene]

Well, I'm still (attempting) modding this game, since I'm only now really getting into modding it.
Col has great concepts that makes a great game play. And I believe that most interesting mods are yet to come, if only best modders stay interested of modding this game.

Personally I'm certainly a programmer modder, as I find working with graphics difficult and quite boring. And it's the gameplay features that interest me, rather than shiny graphics, although they add to the immersion.

My sin as modder is lack of ability to concentrate on one project at time. I have too many civ related projects going on in addition to other spare time projects.

But I'm looking forward to express my creative side with this game.

 

[Lib.Spi't]

Hey guys, since this thread is still live I thought I would throw my hat in the ring of modders who like Col.

I am a bit rubbish at modding, I am still shocked how far my mod has come, mostly with the exceptional help of others.

Medieval 2.0 has really started to grab my attention, for all it's amazing features, I could see some really great mods come out of this base that could go all over the shop, (Like 2071 is now doing)

I like RaR, but really only because of the trains.. (and I found the trains more satisfying in Westward Ho!) I think things like the tech tree in Medi make it a much more interesting playthrough as the game expands with yo, rather thna it all being there from the start.. and don't get me started on the multiple trade screens... I love them...

Anyway, now that my mod has a team (At least one of whom knows what he is doing... unlike me ) I find myself with bigger modding breaks, while I wait for him to do something amazing with the core code

I find myself becoming tempted to enter the murky world of Col modding...

 

[Nightinggale]

Personally I'm certainly a programmer modder, as I find working with graphics difficult and quite boring. And it's the gameplay features that interest me, rather than shiny graphics, although they add to the immersion.

I could have written something like that as well. However lack of interest in graphics does not make a programmer. Coding skills and attention to details in the DLL makes a programmer. Hopefully we share that as well.

But I'm looking forward to express my creative side with this game.

I look forward to seeing it. It sounds promissing

I like RaR, but really only because of the trains.. (and I found the trains more satisfying in Westward Ho!)

I think things like the tech tree in Medi make it a much more interesting playthrough as the game expands with yo, rather thna it all being there from the start.. and don't get me started on the multiple trade screens... I love them...

Lack of a tech tree is my biggest concern for RaR as well. The trains are a cool addition, but they should be invented in late game. Being available from the start makes me use them instead of wagon trains if I'm short on hemp or horses.

I find myself becoming tempted to enter the murky world of Col modding...

Come to the dark side, but leave your civ soul behind


I'm happy to see a thread like this in 2014 for a game released in 2008. It shows how great the game engine is that the mods can keep renewing themselves to stay interesting. The most surprising aspect is that new people are still attracted. Quite a number of new people showed up with the intension to mod in 2013 (myself included). Now that I am modding I wonder what it could have been like if I had started in 2011 where I made a post about trying to get the compiler to work. It's quite ironic that my modding days were delayed two years due to that issue considering I wrote a new and much improved makefile once I was finally able to compile.

 

[Kailric]

Lack of a tech tree is my biggest concern for RaR as well. The trains are a cool addition, but they should be invented in late game. Being available from the start makes me use them instead of wagon trains if I'm short on hemp or horses.

Well, the vanilla time period of Col is from 1492 to 1800's and there were plenty of inventions in that time, thus my original TechTree mod covered that period. It has expanded a whole bunch in M:C however with lots more options. There is one idea I had maybe that would work for some and that is certain FF's could release techs for everyone no matter who's team he joins that way you could delay the release trains.

I'm happy to see a thread like this in 2014 for a game released in 2008. It shows how great the game engine is that the mods can keep renewing themselves to stay interesting. The most surprising aspect is that new people are still attracted. Quite a number of new people showed up with the intension to mod in 2013 (myself included). Now that I am modding I wonder what it could have been like if I had started in 2011 where I made a post about trying to get the compiler to work. It's quite ironic that my modding days were delayed two years due to that issue considering I wrote a new and much improved makefile once I was finally able to compile.

Yes, it is very nice. I believe unless they release a new and improved Col game these forums will remain alive for a long time. I regret not starting to mod earlier as well. I had the game sense 2008 and when I finally started checking into modding I was like, oh man, what have I been missing! Anyway, I feel like I'll be around for a while still yet so keep the mods rolling.

 

[raystuttgart]

Lack of a tech tree is my biggest concern for RaR as well.

We had that on our list of planned features.

But I never found time to do the implementation as I had wanted it to be.
(I would have tried to adapt the solution from Civ4(BtS) instead of reusing Civics as in Kailric's implementation.)

Especially since such a feature would simply have been too massive without a strong team.
Coding, testing, bugfixing, improvments, balancing, texts, buttons, ...

I did not want to simply pump out a modcomp.
I wanted to create a feature with quality, atmosphere and good performance, that nicely blends into RaR and really enhance gameplay
without feeling artificial or destroying balancing or even causing heavy bugs.

Lots of further features could have come out of that featue of course.
(e.g. Civics that would reassemle the creation of a "Constitution".)

But well, maybe one day a skilled modder (or a team) will create a modmod of RaR and succeed creating such a feature ...

The trains are a cool addition, but they should be invented in late game.

I completely agree with that.

It shows how great the game engine is that the mods can keep renewing themselves to stay interesting.

And it also shows that the modders that have been improving this game over all those years did a good job as well.

 

[Fullerene]

I could have written something like that as well. However lack of interest in graphics does not make a programmer. Coding skills and attention to details in the DLL makes a programmer. Hopefully we share that as well.

Being programmer depends how you define a programmer. I'm sure I'm not as skilled as you and some other civ4col modders around but I'm learning all the time.

I'm happy to see a thread like this in 2014 for a game released in 2008. It shows how great the game engine is that the mods can keep renewing themselves to stay interesting. The most surprising aspect is that new people are still attracted. Quite a number of new people showed up with the intension to mod in 2013 (myself included). Now that I am modding I wonder what it could have been like if I had started in 2011 where I made a post about trying to get the compiler to work. It's quite ironic that my modding days were delayed two years due to that issue considering I wrote a new and much improved makefile once I was finally able to compile

I remember waiting this game and buying it instantly when it came out. The vanilla game was small disappointment I have to say. But what interested me most was the mods and moddability, even though maybe I lacked skills then But now I'm really getting into modding this for more seriously.

Well, the vanilla time period of Col is from 1492 to 1800's and there were plenty of inventions in that time, thus my original TechTree mod covered that period. It has expanded a whole bunch in M:C however with lots more options. There is one idea I had maybe that would work for some and that is certain FF's could release techs for everyone no matter who's team he joins that way you could delay the release trains.

Historically speaking RaR is about colonization of Americas and the inventions were more likely to be made in Europe if I'm not mistaken. Maybe inventions could be events that occur on certain dates? Don't know if it makes a fun game play feature or not...