Where are ciV competitors?

The theme of this thread, plus comments by Thormodr and others elsewhere, is turning out to be the single best thing about Civ5 for me, the realisation that Firaxis ain't the only show in town. Thanks, guys - been stuck in the Civ groove for too too long, know nothing about Paradox and other designers.

So have ordered up EU III and the Victorias (going pretty cheaply too), for a start. Trouble is, that's me lost to the outside world for a couple of months. But who wants to go outside this time of year anyway?
 
If you got EU3 complete you still need to buy two more expansions to be fully up to speed. It is weird, but that is how it worked out for Paradox. I think they are worth it.
 
If you got EU3 complete you still need to buy two more expansions to be fully up to speed. It is weird, but that is how it worked out for Paradox. I think they are worth it.

Thanks for the tip - it does seem odd of course, but I don't mind expansions if they're real upgrades and not just a bunch of DLC cartoon leaderheads. Anyway, I'm just gonna jump in and see what I think...

[Odd, I mean, because it is EU Complete indeed I ordered. But then maybe we're used to there being a Civ4 Complete (i.e. the game is now finished, dusted and done, which I think never really happens for a grand strategy game...)
 
Thanks for the tip - it does seem odd of course, but I don't mind expansions if they're real upgrades and not just a bunch of DLC cartoon leaderheads. Anyway, I'm just gonna jump in and see what I think...

[Odd, I mean, because it is EU Complete indeed I ordered. But then maybe we're used to there being a Civ4 Complete (i.e. the game is now finished, dusted and done, which I think never really happens for a grand strategy game...)

You ordered disks? Because the last two expansions weren't released on as hard copies.
EU3 complete includes original EU3, Napoleon's Ambition and In Nomine.
Heir to the Throne and Divine Wind are download only. (I recommend GamersGate if you need a portal).

The expansions are of magnificent quality. EU3 complete or EU3 complete with the last two expansions is an amazing difference. They even updated the graphics in Divine Wind.
 
could play age of wonders if you're into fantasy stuff. I love those games. think steam has them now.
 
Go play Sword of the stars. Space based, combat can be in real time with you giving orders or you can let the computer automatically battle it out for you (much faster, but not as much fun). Up to 6 different races, all with their own likes and dislikes, random maps, ability to have random tech trees with each race having differing tech chances according to their preference and backstory. Runs well even on low end machines and is very stable. Much, much fun.
 
You ordered disks? Because the last two expansions weren't released on as hard copies.
EU3 complete includes original EU3, Napoleon's Ambition and In Nomine.
Heir to the Throne and Divine Wind are download only. (I recommend GamersGate if you need a portal).

The expansions are of magnificent quality. EU3 complete or EU3 complete with the last two expansions is an amazing difference. They even updated the graphics in Divine Wind.

'Europa Universalis III Collection' - £5.99 on Amazon. Hey I don't even know if I dig it yet (but I'm sure I will) so don't rush me, man. :)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Europa-Universalis-III-Collection-PC/dp/B001BVAQSI/
 
Glad you are getting into EU3 Doctor P. :)

It's very fun and there is a good community on Paradox Interactive Forums.

Lots of good gameplay advice and helpful people.

Also, there are some quality AARs if you enjoy those sort of things.
 
Try Hearts of Iron II Arsenal of Democracy.

As far as HOI goes, HOI II is the equivalent of Civ 4 and HOI3 the equivalent of Civ V (in terms of the earlier iteration being a lot better.)

HOI II is actually a little less complicated than III, more fun to play, and immensely more accurate historically.

Plus the HOI II Arsenal dev team are just regular gamers who bought the HOI II license and made a bunch of improvements to the core engine. Good guys to support, IMO
 
Some other good games I tried out recently and really enjoyed were Nitro Games titles, published by Paradox IIRC.

Conquest of the Americas and East India Company Complete. Both available via Gamersgate for pretty cheap. Be sure to get East India Company Complete.

Sort of like Sid Meier's Pirates! but with more of a trade-network development slant. Lack of land combat is a flaw in both, but the basic economics/strategic balance, the flavor, and particular the tactical naval combat are the best I've seen for Age of Sail strategy genre.

I've bought many Paradox titles now, and I'm happy with all of them, even the ones I didn't really get into (e.g., Arsenal of Democracy). Sometimes their games have some imbalance initially, or some bugs, but they are renowned for smoothing out those bugs, and I see this pattern as a reflection of the sheer complexity and detail in the games they make. It is inevitable that a game as complex as the EU series will still have bugs even after beta-testing. Since Paradox does a great job of refining, accessorizing, updating, expanding on their titles, I don't see this as a flaw in their business, just something you should be aware of. Like any of these games, they eventually get repetitive and boring, but with alternative settings, mods, playing different positions, or just taking a break from them, you can come back and be much refreshed. I'd say their games have been just about as replayable to me as Civ4 BTS was, though perhaps not quite as replayable as Civ3 Conquests. Arsenal of Democracy will eventually get all balanced and patched up, and I'll go back and give it a whirl; if I'm in the mood for that flavor, I've no doubt I'll "get my money's worth" at that time. This is the thing about Paradox titles as compared to Civ (esp. it seems since Civ4): they do not try to be all things to all players. EU focuses on a particular set of dimensions of history, during a particular historical period (as opposed to conceiving itself as a "simulation of all of cultural history" or something conceivably broad) 1400 to 1820(?). Victoria same thing, 1820 to 1930. Historical processes and themes that are represented in great detail in Victoria are largely absent from EU and vice versa. This is I think a more valid and reasonable approach to a strategy game that seeks to simulate history.

What is "TBS?"

ADDIT: for another good glimpse of how 1UPT hex-based strategic can work quite well (and even achieve a need for combined arms integration) check out Slitherine's "Commander Europe at War" published by Matrix IIRC. There is a user-made expansion to it that is really fantastic. Think it is available as a DL on Slitherine's site. If anybody has trouble figuring out what that means, just let me know and I'll suss it out for you . . .
 
I wish I never read this thread... it inspired me to pick-up a copy of Europa Universalis III and its first three expansions. In a word - wow! I saw more depth last night in EU3 during the tutorial, followed by a 3 hour session, than I have in ~150 hours of play with Civ5.

Want to settle unclaimed lands in the New World? Surprise... there are natives! Want to exterminate them? No real problem. Peacefully co-exist and eventually absorb them into your population? Also doable. Want to increase the size of your settlement's population? Send more settlers! Logical, huh?

It's strange how perspective can change with new experience, but now Civ5 seems distinctly like that cludgy old Age of Empires game (from Micro$oft IIRC). I would say Civ5 can be compared to EU3 as Call of Duty can be compared to ArmA2 (sorry if you never played them). Now I feel like I wasted my money on Civilization V... no, that's not fair. 1-200hrs. of entertainment for $60 is pretty good, better that the same amount for a 4hr. CoD campaign I guess.

I hope Civ5 matures and comes around someday, but for now I gotta' go play EU3 - see you guys in a year or so.

EDIT* I just noticed the developers of EU3 are European (Swedish). I am definitely noticing a trend here... my last 3 favorite games came from their side of the pond - all very fun, rich with detail and very well worth their (relatively low) prices.
Cheers!:salute:
 
you should definitely try birth of the federation. So ancient though...
 
I recently picked up the EU3 Complete + expansions.

(if not already done so...) I would recommend signing up @ the Paradox Forums. Once signed up you get access to other forum areas, one of which (Support or FAQ can't remember) has a very good GUIDE for EUIII that you can download once signed up to the forum.

Very good guide for getting you into EU3
 
you should definitely try birth of the federation. So ancient though...

I played this tons when it came out and was thinking about it when this thread came up but couldn't remember what it was called or even enough about it to describe it. I'd love to buy that game again but I haven't had much luck with really old games playing on my computer. /mourn Civ2

Great game! I do like sci-fi but am not at all a big Star Trek fan and loved this game so you don't have to love or even like Star Trek to enjoy it.
 
EU III looks like a great game- EXCEPT for dull graphs and statistics everywhere. I wish they put more animations and made map with mountains and little strees and stuff, like CONQUEST of teh AMERICAS have.
 
Only Call to Power series could be a competitors to civ, i think that Call to Power 2 is better than civ5 at present state :)
 
Mods for Civ4. Other Sid games, even old ones.
Yeah, and Tropico is really, really good. I only played first one, though, but I heard third is even better. I like how it tracks every citizen, but don't makes you wipe each of their behinds yourself, like The Sims do. It was kind of a sick fun to build lux apartment for an expensive engineer woman, and then find out she fell in love with some poor (but probably handsome) towel guy and moved to his shack on the beach.

Which reminds me. Why no one mentioned Dwarf Fortress? :)
 
I've read so much about SMAC while hunting for Civ replacements (^btw I agree with you Ermak, EU III looks very dry)--this is truly a legendary game.

Anyone know if SMAC is still playable on a modern machine, and could you stand the primitive graphics? Or is it best left in the realms of legend? Can you even DL it anywhere? And why didn't they ever make a successor, seeing as space is a whole genre now?

Edit to add: Sad for CiV this is such an active thread but well, vote with your feet!
 
SMAC is still great (and in some aspects, unsurpassed) and graphics is not bad - comparable to Civ3.
This reminds me. There is a freeware game, called C-Evo. It's a civ game, but with lots of things done differently. For example, it's possible to design your own units there, kind of like in SMAC.
 
EU III looks like a great game- EXCEPT for dull graphs and statistics everywhere. I wish they put more animations and made map with mountains and little strees and stuff, like CONQUEST of teh AMERICAS have.

You're the only one who keeps accusing paradox games of 'dull graphs and statistics everywhere'. I really don't recognize that at all. Please point out where these alleged dull graphs and statistics are. Maybe you should give it a try. I'd recommend to start with EU3, since it's the most easy of their games to step into.

Also, it's true that the graphics gimmicks are a bit lacking. It's not terrible, but it could be more. Instead, they put more development time in additional features. Paradox is just a small (not that small anymore, but still fairly small) Swedish studio with limited resources. I for one am happy they keep graphics at a very acceptable level, but I can understand some would fine it lacking.

The last EU3 expansion did update the graphics to the level of Victoria 2, so if you check screens, you should check those.
 
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